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Old 06-14-2005, 03:55 PM   #1
garyka
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M.O.C. #3662
BLACK TANK SENSORS

A CAMPGROUND I AM STAYING AT WILL PUMP OUT THE BLACK WATER TANK WHEN REQUESTED(SENSOR INDICATING FULL)THE PROBLEM I AM HAVING IS WHEN THEY ARE DONE THE SENSOR DOES NOT GO BACK TO EMPTY,IT WQILL SHOW 2/3 OR FULL WHEN I KNOW THIS NOT TRUE BECAUSE I AM THERE WHEN IT IS PUMPED OUT AND I USE THE NO FUSS FLUSH. ANYONE ELSE OUT THERE HAVING THIS PROBLEM?
PS I AM NEW TO THIS WITH A 2005 3295 MONTANA
 
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Old 06-14-2005, 03:59 PM   #2
CountryGuy
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garyka

Welcome to the forum!

Welcome to the world of Montana and Rving

Welcome to the world, where we all know the indicators NEVER work, so we all figure out how FULL sounds on a flush! Steve R has a good way to describe that.

This is a re-occuring subject, you might find some interesting posts by visiting the top of the page, and the Search feature here at MOC!!

We have not looked at the indicator lights in MONTHS, had a RV since 1984, 2 of them were brand new rigs, and the lights have never worked more, than, say, a day or so!

OH, we happen to approve of your choice of floor plan!

Enjoy that rig!
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Old 06-14-2005, 04:28 PM   #3
syplace
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We have the same rig; purchased 6/21/04. From day 1 (after learning from the MOC forum) we use nothing in the tanks other than Calgon. It works!
After dumping sensors read empty. We then add about a gallon of water and 1/2 cup of Calgon. Perhaps if you fill tank 3/4 full, drive down road and with all that jarring what ever will work loose and then dump immediately when you get to your destination will solve your problem. Some have used RID X and seem to like it. Besure not to use too much.
Hope this helps.
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Old 06-15-2005, 12:58 AM   #4
Bill and Ann
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Forget the guage. No matter what you use they still won't work.
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Old 06-15-2005, 04:54 AM   #5
Thunderman
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Garyka,
I have used the Calgon formula already mentioned and my sensors work perfectly. Before using the Calgon, my sensors were never correct.
Try it!
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Old 06-15-2005, 06:03 AM   #6
illapah
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Calgon works for us too.
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Old 06-15-2005, 06:05 AM   #7
illapah
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Pretty long but I think worthwile:

Black and Gray Water Holding Tank Maintenance

The Geo Method

By Charles Bruni
cbruni@mindspring.com
Renton, Washington
U.S.A.

Everyone who owns an RV should be concerned with maintaining its wastewater tanks. Problems with wastewater tanks that can be avoided should be avoided. Wastewater tank repair is expensive. Due to health concerns, many service facilities will not work on wastewater tanks and lines until the tanks have been completely emptied and sanitized. This may be quite difficult when the tank(s) is in need of repair. So, common sense dictates that the tanks should be kept relatively clean at all times. Additionally, improper use of the wastewater tanks can lead to a build up of solid wastes, which in itself may cause the system to fail.

I've discovered very simple, effective, and inexpensive methods of maintaining my wastewater tanks in a relatively clean condition at all times. I developed these methods myself through my understanding of chemistry, physics, and biology with a smidgen of common sense thrown in for good measure. I also read my RV owner's manual. Although we are not full time RVers we use our fifth wheel camper at least one weekend a month. We never use public bathing and toilet facilities. In other words, our wastewater tanks are fairly heavily used. Since I've met a number of RVers who don't seem to know how to maintain their wastewater tanks I thought many RVers would find my tips useful. If you have not been maintaining your tanks I believe you will be pleasantly surprised the first time you employ these tips. I do these things and they work.


1. DUMP A FULL TANK

When you are camping and your RV is connected to a sewer/septic intake, leave the drain valves closed until the tank is full and ready to dump. Dumping a full tank provides a sufficient quantity of water to flush solids from the tank. Leaving the drain valves open allows the water to drain off without flushing out solid waste. That solid waste will collect in the tank(s) and cause problems over time. If your tanks are not full when you are ready to dump them, fill them with fresh water first, and then dump them.


2. DUMP TANKS IN ORDER FROM DIRTIEST TO CLEANEST

In other words, dump the black (commode) water tank first, then dump the galley tank, then dump the shower and bathroom sink tank. This way you will be flushing out the dirtiest water with progressively cleaner water.


3. USE WATER SOFTENER

**Calgon Water Softener link**

This stuff is amazing and it works. Buy a couple of boxes of powdered water softener at the grocery store. You'll find it located with or near the laundry detergent products. I prefer Calgon Water Softener because it dissolves quickly in water. Cheaper water softeners work just as well but dissolve more slowly. Dissolve two (2) cups of the water softener in a gallon of hot water. Then, pour the solution down the drain into the empty tank. Use two cups of softener for each wastewater tank in your RV. The tank's drain valve should be closed otherwise the softened water will just drain out. Then use the tank(s) normally until it is full and drain it normally. Add a cup of laundry detergent to the black (commode) water tank at the same time you add water softener. This will help clean the tank. The gray water tanks should already contain soap through normal use.

The water softener makes the solid waste let go from the sides of the tanks. If you've ever taken a shower in softened water you know that after rinsing the soap from your body your skin will feel slick. That's because all the soap rinses away with soft water. Softened water also prevents soap scum from sticking in the tub. Get the connection? With softened water gunk washes away instead of sticking. The same thing applies to your RV's wastewater tanks.

I use one of those clear plastic elbow connectors to attach my sewer drain line to the wastewater outlet on my RV. It allows me to see how well things are progressing during a wastewater dump. Before I began using water softener regularly the black water tank's water was brown, the galley tank's water was brownish, and the bathroom tank's water was white. The first time I added water softener to the tanks the water coming from the black water tank was actually black (not brown) and the kitchen tank's water was also black (not brownish). The bathroom tank's water remained white. That told me that the water softener had actually done what I had intended for it to do and made solid waste, which had been stuck to the interior of the tanks, let go and drain away. I added water softener to all the wastewater tanks for the next few dumps to be certain all the solid waste possible had been cleaned away. The wastewater only appeared black on the initial treatment. I now add water softener to each tank once after every few dumps to maintain the system.

Occasionally, I pour a half gallon of liquid bleach into each tank to sanitize and disinfect them. I add the bleach when the tank is about half full, and then continue to use the tank normally until it is full and ready to dump. I no longer use the blue toilet chemical because it isn't necessary. I have no odors coming from my black water tank. Generic brand liquid bleach is cheap and very effective.

How does chlorine bleach work? Great link!


4. USE A WATER FILTER ON YOUR FRESH WATER INTAKE LINE

Most fresh water contains sediment. Sediment will accumulate in your wastewater tanks and your fresh water lines. It also tends to discolor your sinks, tub/shower, and commode. I use the disposable type and have found that they eventually fill up and begin restricting the fresh water flow resulting in low pressure. That's how I know it's time to get a new filter. It works, it's cheap, it avoids problems, do it. When I fill my fresh water tank I attach the filter to the end of the hose and fill the tank with filtered water.


SOME OTHER THOUGHTS

Never put regular toilet tissue in your RV's black tank. Only use toilet tissue which is approved for RV and/or septic tank use. Regular toilet tissue may eventually dissolve, but not before causing a clog in your black tank.

I believe occasionally traveling with partially filled wastewater tanks that contain softened water promotes cleaning by agitating the water. The same goes for chlorine bleach.

I believe this process works faster and more efficiently during warm weather. However, I know it works well even during cool/cold weather.

I believe the process works best the longer the water softener remains in the tanks. So, I don't add water softener during periods of heavy wastewater generation. I wait until I know we won't be generating wastewater quickly so that the softened water remains in the tanks for several days before dumping.

I add a small amount of chlorine bleach to the fresh water tank twice a year to disinfect and sanitize the fresh water tank and fresh water lines. A weak chlorine bleach solution will not hurt you. However, it certainly makes the water taste bad. When we have chlorine in the fresh water system we use bottled water for drinking and cooking until the chlorine is gone.

My tanks are plastic and my pipes are PVC.

Don't be afraid to use your tanks. Just use common sense about their care and maintenance.

These tips are inexpensive to do. Some of them don't cost anything. You have nothing to lose in trying them and I encourage you to do so. I actually feel a certain amount of pride in the condition and cleanliness of both my waste and fresh water systems. Naturally, these tips make dumping a much more pleasant and sanitary procedure.

If you have odors in any of your water systems these procedures should eliminate them. Odors indicate a sanitary problem and degrade the enjoyment you derive from your RV.

When my RV is parked and not in use I place stoppers in the sink and tub drains. This forces the wastewater tanks to vent through the vent pipes to the outside instead of through the drains into the RV. Water evaporates. Once the drain traps dry out during periods of non-use, nothing is there to prevent gasses (odor) from venting into the camper. Use stoppers when your RV is stored.

Please consider printing this information and posting it on the bulletin boards of RV parks and campgrounds you visit. Fellow RVers will benefit from your consideration.
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Old 06-15-2005, 02:40 PM   #8
HamRad
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There are EXTERNAL tank sensors. A recent article in Trailer Life outlined how they work. If you really want or need a sensor for your tanks then you might consider getting one of the external types.

I just use the Steve Reigle method like many others. Once you get an idea of how long you can go with your tanks it's not really a problem.

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Old 06-15-2005, 05:13 PM   #9
sreigle
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Welcome aboard, garyka. I'm not quite sure what the "steve reigle" method is but we know the tank is nearly full when the clean flush water kind of "plops" as it starts down the drain. It is not a splashback, just something to do with the venting (I think) that causes the water to go down the tube differently when the tank is nearly full (I suspect maybe it's reached the level of the vent). Also, for two adults, we normally get 7 days on the black tank. Occasionally it's ready to dump at 6 days or even up to 9 (rare). Until you get the gauge working to your satisfaction maybe this will help.

We have the same model as you, just a bit older, so I think yours dumps straight down into the tank rather than having a tube angling to the tube. Thus, when that thing is really full you will be able to see it when you flush the toilet. Of course, at that point you won't want to wait a day for the honey wagon to arrive so watch for the plop.

We long ago gave up on the gauges, as many others have. We have not yet tried the Calgon method but we've got to where we no longer really need the gauges. Except the freshwater tank gauge. We do use that one but it seems to work fine, at least on ours.
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Old 06-16-2005, 01:34 AM   #10
old turbo
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I want to keep my black tank working properly I use a mixture of water softner and soap. Once in a while I put a five or ten pound bag of ice cubes in the john when I get ready to leave campgrounds. As the trailer moves this is a great agatator which helps to break up solids and beat the paper to pulp. It will melt as you drive down the road.
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Old 06-18-2005, 01:46 PM   #11
captbanjo
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I would recommend using the 'Morrison Method' to determine when your black tank is full. Having kept the valves closed and having used the toilet for a few days you should reach a point where you can hear the water is not dropping too far down the pipes. At that point, kneel down and reach all the way down the pipe with your arm...at least as far as your elbow...and find out if your hand gets wet. If it does then you have a full tank and should dump. OK...OK...just joking.
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Old 06-19-2005, 06:33 AM   #12
sreigle
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Wayne, do you extend a single finger in this test or is it better to use the whole hand, perhaps fisted into a ball?
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Old 06-19-2005, 09:52 AM   #13
captbanjo
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Steve, I recommend the 'grab and grope' to determine status of tank...
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Old 06-19-2005, 11:56 AM   #14
sreigle
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Aha, then you can also tell first hand (pun intended) the state of dissolvency of the tissue and other matter so you know whether you need to follow the dump procedure with black tank flushing. This thread is getting to be downright gross, by the way.
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Old 07-24-2005, 02:03 PM   #15
PackerFan
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Where do I find this Calgon? I have looked in the local grocery stores and Wal-Mart with no luck. My sensors don't work worth a darn either.

Scott
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Old 07-24-2005, 03:31 PM   #16
CountryGuy
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Go to the LAUNDRY detergent area of the grocery store. It comes in powder and in liquid. I am using liquid in the unit.
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Old 08-07-2005, 06:02 AM   #17
Montana_4140
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Captbanjo,
You had me for a second...
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Old 08-07-2005, 03:45 PM   #18
richfaa
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The calgon and ridex method does work..have no trouble with my 10 year old guages in our TT..and Wayne and Steve.R arhggggggg.
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Old 08-07-2005, 05:24 PM   #19
Kathi
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garyka, it helps to know what the bottle of calgon looks like. Once I saw what the bottle looked like I spotted it right away. Here is a site with a picture of the bottle. I found it in the laundry section, on the bottom shelf, right next to the fabreeze. Hope this helps.

http://www.drugstore.com/products/pr...UY-PLST-0-SRCH
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Old 08-12-2005, 06:21 PM   #20
delrob
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Is this calgon the same as can be found in the bath and beauty dept. Used to put in your bath water?
I couldn't find any in the laundry section of Walmart.
De
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