Frustrated Newbie - Montana Owners Club

Sally Newberry · 08-25-2016, 06:53 AM

My husband & I purchased our first Montana on 8/20/16. It's a pre-owned 2015 3402RL. The previous owners must've been full timers because this fifth wheel is definitely "used" for it's age. We've had it less than 1 week, haven't even had a chance to take it out for a weekend yet & have found serious problems with it. These problems should have been found during the walk-thru but our walk-thru was a joke. At any rate we have found a crack in the body of the unit right a the corner where a slide meets up against the body. Not sure if it's in the fiberglass or just in the paint (it has full body paint). The day after getting it home we noticed a horrible septic smell. Come to find out the dealer didn't empty the black tank. When my husband hooked the fifth wheel up to the truck to dump the septic at a nearby truck stop he noticed sewer coming out from underneath. Because we live about an hour from the dealer they sent a tech out to inspect our black tank and sure enough it's cracked. We're taking the unit back to the dealer this weekend to have both issues addressed. I'm very frustrated that a Montana that was only used for less than 1 year (previous owners bought it in July 2016 as a 2015 leftover) would have these types of issues. Because we haven't been able to use the camper yet we don't know for sure the the heat/AC work properly. Again, that should have been addressed at the walk-thru. When we take it to the dealer this weekend we'll be sure to have a tech do a proper walk-thru with us before we leave it. I'm just afraid of what we're going to find next. I was pretty confident purchasing a used Montana because it's a "Montana"...known for quality, but now I'm not so sure. I'm very nervous that we won't have it back in time to go camping Labor Day weekend as planned.

dieselguy · 08-25-2016, 07:04 AM

Welcome to the current growing number of disappointed newer Montana owners. In all fairness, late model quality (or lack of) is an industry wide issue no matter the brand. Is the crack up by the bedroom slide lower front corner? If so ... it is somewhat common. Unless your dealer has some direct connection to acquire a tank, you may be hard pressed to get one installed by Labor Day Weekend if you just now took it back.

**Rondo** · 08-25-2016, 07:08 AM

Sally-- Doesn't sound like the previous owners were fulltimers because they normally take care of their rigs. Does your dealer rent out units, if so this could be the problem. You can't blame Keystone Montana Division for this but you can blame your dealer and the previous owners. Apparently your dealer did nothing to it especially if the black tank was full and did not do a thorough inspection of the unit when they took it in. Apparently the previous owner could have cared less about it when they traded it in. That new of a unit is very unusual for a trade in especially if it was purchased a year ago or less by the previous owner. What dealer did you purchase it from and in what city. We like to know these things so if we have problems while on the road we do not go to those dealers. Hopefully, this dealer will stand behind his sale and fix EVERYTHING you have wrong with it. Be sure to take a PDI(PreDelivery Inspection)list with you so you check everything. This list can be found on a listing for PDI on the main page of the Forum. Good luck and let us know what the outcome is.

Sally Newberry · 08-25-2016, 07:09 AM

Yes, that is exactly where the crack is, it's about 1-1/2" long. Do you know if it can easily be fixed? Keystone is willing to fix it at no charge thank God. The dealer is Camping World & I'm told that they have a warehouse nearby. Keeping my fingers crossed have praying nothing else significant arises.

Sally Newberry · 08-25-2016, 07:25 AM

Rondo, we purchased the unit at Camping World in Syracuse, NY.

I don't blame Keystone at all, I understand issues happen, it's a moving vehicle traveling over some less-than desirable roads at times. Our previous SOB was a Keystone & we had it for 4 years with no problems. I am quite frustrated with the dealer's lack of inspection and the whole walk-thru process, as well as with the previous owners. I have always been a stickler for making sure the inside of my campers are always clean (outside is hubby's job

)so when we were cleaning out our trade the night before dropping it off I made sure it was clean. I was even worried about the floors needing to be swept but that's just my OCD I guess. So it floors me that the previous owners wouldn't at least make sure the tanks were empty before trading it in.

Thank you for your advice. I will keep you posted.

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Rondo

Sally-- You can't blame Keystone Montana Division for this but you can blame your dealer and the previous owners. Apparently your dealer did nothing to it especially if the black tank was full and did not do a through inspection of the unit when they took it in. Apparently the previous owner could have cared less about it when the traded it in. What dealer did you purchase it from and in what city. We like to know these things so if we have problems while on the road we do not go to those dealers. Hopefully, this dealer will stand behind his sale and fix EVERYTHING you have wrong with it. Be sure to take a PDI(PreDelivery Inspection)list with you so you check everything. This list can be found on a listing for PDI on the main page of the Forum. Good luck and let us know what the outcome is.

Sally Newberry · 08-25-2016, 07:30 AM

What made me believe the previous owners were full timers is that there are screw holes in the walls in every place you can imagine, and some places you can't. I did notice some when we looked at the camper, but most weren't found until I was cleaning and washing the walls down. My husband has been busy filling the holes & making them disappear.

The fact that they only had it for about 10 months before trading it in makes me nervous as to what else might be wrong it.

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Rondo

Sally-- Doesn't sound like the previous owners were fulltimers because they normally take care of their rigs. Does your dealer rent out units, if so this could be the problem. You can't blame Keystone Montana Division for this but you can blame your dealer and the previous owners. Apparently your dealer did nothing to it especially if the black tank was full and did not do a thorough inspection of the unit when they took it in. Apparently the previous owner could have cared less about it when they traded it in. That new of a unit is very unusual for a trade in especially if it was purchased a year ago or less by the previous owner. What dealer did you purchase it from and in what city. We like to know these things so if we have problems while on the road we do not go to those dealers. Hopefully, this dealer will stand behind his sale and fix EVERYTHING you have wrong with it. Be sure to take a PDI(PreDelivery Inspection)list with you so you check everything. This list can be found on a listing for PDI on the main page of the Forum. Good luck and let us know what the outcome is.

jcurtis934 · 08-25-2016, 07:30 AM

If you are looking at your issues to arrive at the feeling that the previous owners were full timers, then who knows...people are different. But, in general, fulltimers would treat it as their home and not abuse it. I would guess that the previous owners towed it too fast, didn't level before deploying slides, may have ran over curbs, etc. But it could also be a trailer that left the factory with issues that weren't addressed by anyone. I would be frustrated as well. Factory tank gauges are crap and can NOT be relied on at any time. Crack at the corner of any opening says there is movement in the wall for some reason and it is deviating from being a true rectangle...just like a house when there are foundation issues. Paint can develope cracks if it were applied over an unclean surface...but I would expect to see it in multiple places. Given the circumstances, it is hard to say if you are in for other issues. A call and email to keystone customer service citing the vin of the unit and its short history under your ownership is in order for a file to be opened. Whether keystone will be responsive in any way is hard to say based on issues others are seeing, but you need to give them the opening to be a true quality manufacturer and to reach out on these and any further issues. Hope this isn't the tip of an ugly situation. John

rames14 · 08-25-2016, 07:47 AM

Sally, I noticed in another post you are going to the Hershey show. Is it possible for you to make the Goshen rally? It's not too late to sign up and you would be amazed at the resources you will meet. I know it shouldn't be that way, but we have had a lot of success as have others through the rally. You will also see how things go together and what is involved in repairs. Plus, you will really learn a lot about your Montana - at least that has been our experience. Good luck with the repairs.

Sally Newberry · 08-25-2016, 07:48 AM

I'm not thinking the problems would be caused by the previous owners being full timers, not at all. My point on that was this doesn't seem to be a unit that sat in someone's driveway except on weekends, it was definitely used. I'm sorry if it sounded like that, that was not my intention. My husband & I plan to be full timers, or at the very least long timers within the next 6-8 months as soon as he retires. Thank you for your advice about contacting Keystone with the VIN number, we'll do that. We've always had good luck with Keystone Customer Service.

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by jcurtis934

If you are looking at your issues to arrive at the feeling that the previous owners were full timers, then who knows...people are different. But, in general, fulltimers would treat it as their home and not abuse it. I would guess that the previous owners towed it too fast, didn't level before deploying slides, may have ran over curbs, etc. But it could also be a trailer that left the factory with issues that weren't addressed by anyone. I would be frustrated as well. Factory tank gauges are crap and can NOT be relied on at any time. Crack at the corner of any opening says there is movement in the wall for some reason and it is deviating from being a true rectangle...just like a house when there are foundation issues. Paint can develope cracks if it were applied over an unclean surface...but I would expect to see it in multiple places. Given the circumstances, it is hard to say if you are in for other issues. A call and email to keystone customer service citing the vin of the unit and its short history under your ownership is in order for a file to be opened. Whether keystone will be responsive in any way is hard to say based on issues others are seeing, but you need to give them the opening to be a true quality manufacturer and to reach out on these and any further issues. Hope this isn't the tip of an ugly situation. John

**DQDick** · 08-25-2016, 08:00 AM

Camping World doesn't have the best rep as dealers. There are a few good ones out there, but a number of less than good ones also. I would ask for the name and number of the folks who owned that rig before and ask why they sold it. That could be enlightening even if you feel in the end they are idiots. Also, on the Good Sam forum you can post problems with Camping World locations and sometimes get things straightened out should your experience become less than satisfactory.

1retired06 · 08-25-2016, 11:31 AM

Don't count on resolution before the Labor Day weekend. A Mercedes can turn to crap if not maintained and taken care of properly. If the walk thru was a joke, to use your words, look carefully at that dealer. Sorry for your rough start.

Sally Newberry · 08-25-2016, 12:05 PM

We were hoping to make the rally but unfortunately we both have to work.

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by rames14

Sally, I noticed in another post you are going to the Hershey show. Is it possible for you to make the Goshen rally? It's not too late to sign up and you would be amazed at the resources you will meet. I know it shouldn't be that way, but we have had a lot of success as have others through the rally. You will also see how things go together and what is involved in repairs. Plus, you will really learn a lot about your Montana - at least that has been our experience. Good luck with the repairs.

jameswbarton · 08-25-2016, 12:08 PM

Iretired06, and an Edsel closely resembles my 2016 HC 375 FL. My Mercedes Sedan ran 500,000 miles when I sold it and is not comparable to a Montana. Mine is still in the shop. I have owned it for 84 days used it and fixed minor things for 34 days and it has spent 50 days in the first and, third warranty dealers shop. The second would not give Keystone an appointment for 4 months.

If you wanted to be really helpful you could publish a list of Keystone Management Contacts in Sales, Customer Service, or Owner Relations to help those of us whose dealers do not fix issues for free without Keystone Authorization such as General RV in Birch Run MI.

1retired06 · 08-25-2016, 12:44 PM

Not sure why you posted such a cheap snarky response at me. I will keep my response to myself in the spirit of this forum.

dieselguy · 08-25-2016, 01:57 PM

Fielding the ball outside of the base line of this post and the several other posts involving dissatisfaction in ownership ... I might point out that the two camps of happy and unhappy Montana owners will seldom see eye to eye. What both do have in common is they own a rig that they paid a goodly sum of money for expecting not to have to spin wrenches on them every trip and have near complete use after the sale. What neither have in common is the experience in ownership that the other side has experienced. Disappointment leads to strong and sometimes not well thought out wording that becomes offensive to some not realizing it's purely out of frustration. Some might suggest that if you are so frustrated ... just get rid of the damned thing ... after laying out $50K plus (plus) with no hope of recovering that initial investment ... we all know the real answer to that thought. Stepping away from the podium with the ball in the umpire's charge ...

1retired06 · 08-25-2016, 05:54 PM

Dieselguy, one of the best posts ever. My wife and I know we have had at times what seemed like serious issues and been frustrated with units, but we have never been saddled with a lemon and have been fortunate enough to have had decent dealers. And so I don't have a real appreciation for what someone with a lemon and a unresponsive dealer has to go through emotionally or financially.. Your comments made me reflect on that. Points well taken.

dfb · 08-26-2016, 03:38 AM

Yes, bought ours brand new 3/15... So far, water heater not working on electric fixed. Black water handle not closing took in twice, rope light living area burntout,moulding in living area Falling off, chipped front cap repaired, thetford toilet did not hold water , replaced with dometic. Shower door handles fell off, dealer used hot glue..I fixed myself. Bathroom door picture board wrinkling and coming off. Two rear led ceiling lights stopped working. Ceiling fan screws fell off and blades came down. Furion camera installed by factory was backup camera, factory wired it as observation camera and the camera burn out. Furrion room was great and sent me a new one. Sewer hose cap fell off on hiway, hose came out like a snake. Still can't find another cap. Fender skirt flapping in the wind, what is that?. Rear cap is poorly made compared to other brands.
On another note. Love the Rv. The mcd blinds are great, fireplace is also great. Like the rest of the 3610 rl legacy.. Personally, the Msrp of 92000 is way too high.. Should be in the 50s... But then again, I remember when lettuce was .29 cents...

richfaa · 08-26-2016, 03:46 AM

We have owned RV's for years this 13 3402 is our 6th RV. We have worked for dealers at large RV shows and sold many brands. We became members of this forum in 2005 months before we purchased our 06 3400 Montana. We knew what RV ownership meant. We knew about quality, workmanship, dealers.

We had few problems with our first 4 RV's with two of them none at all .We were weekend campers and low end users. We never had a Extended warranty.

We did our homework well we knew what we might experience which is why a Extended warranty was part of our first purchase. We have not been surprised by our "Montana Experience" disappointed yes but we were well aware of the odds.

The Big Sky is in the shop again we are not happy campers but our dealer and Keystone is working hard to get us back on the road.

We have always valued this forum .We have learned a great deal from "problem "Post' and avoided many problems by learning from them. The post should be kept to describing problems, experiences in repairing them including dealer experience. We learn nothing from personal statements about other members

jcurtis934 · 08-26-2016, 11:03 AM

Dan, what is the sewer cap like that you can't find? If you have the sewer boom on your unit, I have a spare cap. The booms can be had at camping world. Will send you my spare cap for free if it is the cap you need. Just pm with details. John

dfb · 08-28-2016, 01:30 PM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by jcurtis934

Dan, what is the sewer cap like that you can't find? If you have the sewer boom on your unit, I have a spare cap. The booms can be had at camping world. Will send you my spare cap for free if it is the cap you need. Just pm with details. John

Thank you... It is the cap for the side mounted carrier tube... Not bayonet, but some weird style that requires on to get down on hands and knees to see how it goes on...

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