Go Back   Montana Owners Club - Keystone Montana 5th Wheel Forum > MOC on M.A.R.S. > Maintenance
Click Here to Login

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 10-06-2018, 09:10 PM   #1
Kenw
Established Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Concord
Posts: 49
M.O.C. #19636
Axle Maintenance FYI

To all,
This is an FYI
After reading many many posts here on axle maintenance I finally got into performing mine. I have a 2017 Montana HC 370 BR, 7000# axles with the e-z lube system, 18 months old now, approximately 4200 miles on the axles, stickered weight 11850 pounds, axles produced March 2, 2017. I did not use the e-z lube system and opted to pull the hubs, clean everything, replace the bearings with Timken and replace the grease seals. The grease in the hubs was red in color. Here is what I found...

Hubs 1-3 Everything was good, not a lot of grease and virtually none in the cavity between the bearings, no scaring but one small brown mark the size of my thumb nail in one of the outer bearings.

Hub#4 The front bearing had very very little grease in it. I could see through every cavity of the bearing as it didn't have any grease in it and a small brown mark in the interior race. The rear bearing troubled me! The amount of grease was OK but it was black in color and it seamed to have very small (shiney)particulates of metal in it. When I say black I mean black! There was a little wear on the bearing but if I were not replacing them I would have put it back in.

Dexter needs to put more grease in these assemblies and Keystone needs to tell their supplier to add more grease. Gee, Dexter/Keystone must be saving 50 cents per axle by providing the minimum amount of grease possible.

Ken
Kenw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2018, 09:14 PM   #2
coachgrowl
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: ALAMEDA
Posts: 224
M.O.C. #20448
Part numbers for bearings please. Thanks in advance.
__________________
2017 Montana High Country 310RE
2017 Ram 2500 Diesel, 4 wd crew cab, slr, pulrite super glide, short bed, 2 ea 100 Ah LiFePO4 12 volt Deep Cycle Battery
coachgrowl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2018, 09:41 PM   #3
Montana Man
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Lemoore
Posts: 555
M.O.C. #21963
I have the same axles and they were undergreased as well.
__________________
2016 3160, Legacy, Manufacturing defects corrected by me, 2014 Ram 3500 SRW SWB 4X4 6.7 Aisin Mega Cab, EBC slotted disks and brakes.
Montana Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2018, 11:27 PM   #4
rohrmann
Montana Master
 
rohrmann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Box Elder
Posts: 2,489
M.O.C. #12947
Also, when replacing the bearings, the races must be replaced too. This is the Timken link to their catalog with a description of servicing these bearings starting on page 62 https://www.timken.com/wp-content/up...81.pdf#page=58
There does not need to be any grease in the hub, only at the bearings. There is a very good video on the Timken site that explains the adjustment of these bearings. Go to this link, http://www.timken.com/engineering-to...nds-on-videos/ and view the video titled
'Proper Tapered Roller Bearing Installation in the Hub Assembly"


For the 7,000 Dexter axle with the 12" X 2" brake drum assembly, and E-Z Lube design, the parts are:


Inner bearing- 25580
Inner race- 25520
Outer bearing- 14125A
Outer race- 14276
Wheel seal- 010-036-00, also known as 10-36, 3.376" OD X 2.25" ID double lip for E-Z lube





__________________
Bob & Becky
2012 3402RL
2012 Chevy 2500HD D/A CC 4WD
rohrmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2018, 07:35 AM   #5
mhs4771
Montana Master
 
mhs4771's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sebring
Posts: 2,416
M.O.C. #9969
Sounds like Dexter has done a complete Flip-Flop. For years many of us had totally grease covered Brake shoes because of over greasing that was found because of poor braking or at the first time the hubs were pulled.
__________________
Michelle & Ann
2018 Chevy 3500HD High Country DRW 4X4 Crew Cab w/Duramax/Allison, Formally 2010 Montana 2955RL, Now Loaded 2016 SOB, Mor/ryde IS, Disc Brakes & Pin Box, Comfort Ride Hitch, GY G114 17.5 Tires.
mhs4771 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-2018, 01:53 PM   #6
RichR
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Castle Rock
Posts: 204
M.O.C. #11369
That's the reason I had the dealer re-pack the bearings when I bought the trailer- I don't trust the manufactor to do whats right
RichR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-08-2018, 03:10 PM   #7
WaltBennett
Montana Master
 
WaltBennett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Haymarket
Posts: 1,420
M.O.C. #13325
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichR View Post
That's the reason I had the dealer re-pack the bearings when I bought the trailer- I don't trust the manufactor to do whats right

Doesn't matter who you have do it, you had better know where the person lives that did it as there's absolutely no telling if they have a clue as to what they're doing. I do mine myself.
WaltBennett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2018, 05:17 PM   #8
Randy E
Established Member
 
Randy E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Hermitage
Posts: 29
M.O.C. #21626
Angry Axle Maintenance

We Have a 2017 3791RD. I too decided to do my first years maintenance on the axles. I did use the EZ lube system. What I found was, when I added the red axle grease with my grease gun, it took 115 pumps to get old grease out the front of the discharge area. There must have been absolutely no grease inside the housing. I added 3- 1/2 tubes of grease in 4 hubs. I'm sure it only had enough grease on the bearing to keep it from rusting when it was in a box being shipped to Dexter for assembly. I agree, It would cost them 50 cents, and possibly another 15 seconds to use their air powered grease gun and fill the housing properly. This in turn would keep us, the customer, happy, making us to demand that the next new RV we purchase would have Dexter axles under it. As it stands, I don't think they care one bit about us. Why would you go through the process to build a quality product, only to have it all screwed up by the last person to touch it?
__________________
Randy & Tracy Elsey
Hermitage Pa.
2017 3791RD
2016 Chevy DD 4x4
Randy E is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2018, 05:53 PM   #9
rohrmann
Montana Master
 
rohrmann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Box Elder
Posts: 2,489
M.O.C. #12947
Like I said, the grease only needs to be on the bearings. Grease inside the hubs does nothing, and if the hub is completely full, there is a real possibility that a seal will fail and grease will get on the brake shoes. A good packing of the bearings, either by hand or with a mechanical packer, them a small amount added at the races is all the grease needed. If the hub is full of grease, it is an extremely messy job pulling a drum off to inspect the brakes, and all that perfectly good, unused grease inside the center of the hub is trashed, along with a lot of rags used to clean up the mess.
__________________
Bob & Becky
2012 3402RL
2012 Chevy 2500HD D/A CC 4WD
rohrmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2018, 06:08 PM   #10
mlh
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Salem
Posts: 4,570
M.O.C. #2283
Quote:
Originally Posted by rohrmann View Post
Like I said, the grease only needs to be on the bearings. Grease inside the hubs does nothing, and if the hub is completely full, there is a real possibility that a seal will fail and grease will get on the brake shoes. A good packing of the bearings, either by hand or with a mechanical packer, them a small amount added at the races is all the grease needed. If the hub is full of grease, it is an extremely messy job pulling a drum off to inspect the brakes, and all that perfectly good, unused grease inside the center of the hub is trashed, along with a lot of rags used to clean up the mess.
I think you hit the nail right on the head.
Lynwood
mlh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2019, 04:21 PM   #11
daveinaz
Montana Fan
 
daveinaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Sun City
Posts: 310
M.O.C. #23256
I know I'm reviving an old thread, but I'm debating whether to do this myself or just have the shop do it since it'll be there getting the AC serviced. I've done plenty of wheel bearings in the past so I'm not worried about the job, just debating if it's worth the hassle of doing it myself or paying them $120 an axle (x2=240) to do it.

I read rohrmann's post with the part #'s for the bearings/seals. Am I right to assume that all 2008 3400's came with the 7K axle since it's gross is around 14K?

And do you guys put Permatex sealer on the rim of the seal? I've never done that before but reading Dexter's manual I see that it says to do so.
__________________

Dave in AZ
2008 Montana 3400RL
2008 Dodge Ram 3500 Diesel Dually
daveinaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2019, 04:58 PM   #12
AZ Traveler
Montana Master
 
AZ Traveler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Oro Valley
Posts: 1,598
M.O.C. #20477
Dave,

Up to you to decide. I am more comfortable knowing what my brakes look like and taking a good look at the bearings which means I do it myself. If you have someone that you trust, nothing wrong with having them do it.
__________________
Zack and Donna plus Millie
2018 Montana 3160RL
2012 F-250
"Life is too short to stay indoors, enjoy the ride!"
AZ Traveler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-15-2019, 11:12 PM   #13
rohrmann
Montana Master
 
rohrmann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Box Elder
Posts: 2,489
M.O.C. #12947
Quote:
Originally Posted by daveinaz View Post
I know I'm reviving an old thread, but I'm debating whether to do this myself or just have the shop do it since it'll be there getting the AC serviced. I've done plenty of wheel bearings in the past so I'm not worried about the job, just debating if it's worth the hassle of doing it myself or paying them $120 an axle (x2=240) to do it.

I read rohrmann's post with the part #'s for the bearings/seals. Am I right to assume that all 2008 3400's came with the 7K axle since it's gross is around 14K?

And do you guys put Permatex sealer on the rim of the seal? I've never done that before but reading Dexter's manual I see that it says to do so.

I have never put any sealer on the outside of the seal and have never had grease come out of the seal at that point. Also, these seals are tough enough to remove without any other material on them. I also read that suggestion and just ignored it. We have the hydraulic leveling and I use that to raise the rig when servicing the bearings and brakes. Without that system, you will need to be careful lifting the rig without doing any damage.
__________________
Bob & Becky
2012 3402RL
2012 Chevy 2500HD D/A CC 4WD
rohrmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2019, 07:08 AM   #14
Dave W
Montana Master
 
Dave W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 685
M.O.C. #14547
Doing your wheel bearing inspection and lube is a fairly easy though dirty job. It also takes a bit of time, especially if your 5er, like ours, doesn't have self leveling.



I buy the seals on line from etrailer usually or one source on ebay and they work as well as the overpriced but identical Dexter seals


I have been using Dexter recommended Mystick JT6 grease but will be changing to Valvoline synthetic as that Mystick grease seems to get too runny, separating, even in direct sun on a 60* day.


I use a bunch of Harbor Freight nitrile gloves (the 5mil are a bit too thin, but real cheap) and at least a roll of paper towels. The bearings are usually cleaned with kerosene or diesel fuel then blown dry. A bearing packer has been used but there seems to be way more waste then the hand pack method so have put that packing gadget away.


The total cost to do our 6000# axles is about 10 bucks for 4 seals and a half can of 12 dollar grease or about 6. Soooo, 10+6+1(roll of towels)+2(nitrile gloves) =~19 dollars. Quite a savings - and the Scottish part of my heritage (you know, deep pockets, short arms) loves that.
__________________
Dave W
Traveling with my DW Susan, a couple poodlepups and our 2014 Montana High Country 343RL, being towed by a 6.7 2011 F250 CCLB using a B&W hitch and OEM puck system
Dave W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-16-2019, 08:45 AM   #15
Ram Montana High Country
Montana Master
 
Ram Montana High Country's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: POINTBLANK
Posts: 584
M.O.C. #19944
Quote:
Originally Posted by rohrmann View Post
I have never put any sealer on the outside of the seal and have never had grease come out of the seal at that point. Also, these seals are tough enough to remove without any other material on them. I also read that suggestion and just ignored it. We have the hydraulic leveling and I use that to raise the rig when servicing the bearings and brakes. Without that system, you will need to be careful lifting the rig without doing any damage.
I took my neighbors SOB 40' bumper pull to the shop for pre-trip inspection - this unit was 4 years old and had 150 miles after purchase. It was going to be moved from East Texas to Phoenix. The shop said 3 hubs(greasable) had grease soaked brakes and the 4th was rusty. My shop hand packs for $135 for all four and makes sure brake are properly adjusted I can't do it for that and for another $7.00 have the mandatory state inspection done.
__________________
RAM 305RL HC EAST TEXAS
Ram Montana High Country is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-21-2019, 10:30 AM   #16
daveinaz
Montana Fan
 
daveinaz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2019
Location: Sun City
Posts: 310
M.O.C. #23256
Well, I just didn't want to mess with it and had the shop do it. They allowed me to go in and look at the pulled hubs, the spindles, and backing plates. The tech said that they were in very good shape. No grease on backing plates or brakes. No issues other than old grease in the bearings. I know the trailer had probably less than 3k miles on the bearings but I was worried that since it had sat there for 3 years or so that there'd be some rust or pitting on the spindles but all looked good so I'm relieved.

And it does seem to brake better since they put it all back together -- less grabbing it seems. I'm guessing the shoes may have been a little out of adjustment. Whatever it was, braking is smoother now.

I certainly feel better knowing that everything's squared away there. That's one of the major reasons we went with the 5er this time instead of a motorhome. When we would park our motorhome for extended periods, there was the whole drivetrain to worry about. But on a trailer, it seems to me, that the only thing you have to worry about are tires, wheel bearings, and brakes. Much easier than maintaining the entire drivetrain on a motorhome!
__________________

Dave in AZ
2008 Montana 3400RL
2008 Dodge Ram 3500 Diesel Dually
daveinaz is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Montana RV, Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:04 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.