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Old 10-28-2019, 09:56 AM   #1
Theunz
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My Trucks' Better Then Your Truck!

My Trucks' Better Than Your Truck! What? Waite, how can he say that?
I can say that because my truck is the best available combination for ME!
There is a constant barrage of posts here, and on other forums as well, with members telling others that they need this truck or that truck based only on one criteria. Quotes like, you need the most heavy duty truck available because someday you MIGHT get a bigger trailer, or you need a dually because you MIGHT have have a blowout ( really? When was the last time you had a blowout on your truck) or you have to have a long bed so you can carry more gear, or even, you'll be sorry if you don't get a diesel ( if you don't tow in any mountains do you really have to have 900lbs of torque or an exhaust brake and put up with the high maintenance cost of a diesel?
Let's face it, the reason their is so many different combinations of trucks offered by each of the manufactors is because all of us have different needs and wants from our trucks.
Certainly most, but not all of the current Montanas have enough pin weight to warrant a dually. Remember though, there are many who have older trailers that are perfectly adequate for even a 3/4 ton. I'm a big fan of The Three Bears...To little, To Big, and Just right! My truck is "Just Right" for me, something different may be "Just Right" for you. So, your truck may be better than mine, just not for me!
When someone asks about what truck they should buy let's consider all of THEIR criteria for THEIR needs then offer up the pros and cons of the different configurations without being condensending.
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Old 10-28-2019, 10:27 AM   #2
jsb5717
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I can agree with this. I have a SRW Short box diesel 4x4 because in all of my life, not just towing the 5er, it's what I prefer to drive. Just because that's what I prefer doesn't mean that I need you to drive one and I'm not offended if you want to drive something else.

Where we need to agree is in the application of safety. There are absolutes and variables.

Absolutes: Loaded weight of the trailer. Weight rating/capacity of the TV. If those aren't in alignment then safety is compromised. As a community we should all encourage each other to be safe using real world numbers and real life experience.

Variables: Pretty much every thing else. Make/Model/color/accessories/etc of the TV or hitch. Features and accessories of the trailer, color of the carpet, etc. As long as the choices I make in the world of variables doesn't risk the absolutes of safety then all is good

There is a lot of great value in the experience and knowledge here that can help others be safe and I've learned from those discussions. I also enjoy hearing about the experiences and experiments of others in the variables. I learn new fun or practical things that way as well.
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Old 10-28-2019, 10:55 AM   #3
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The thread is exactly right. Over a couple of years, a bulged sidewall and a cracked bead decided for us that a dually was needed. It was hard to find because a Mega Cab dually is very hard to find, but necessary for us so the cats play pen fits in the back. Not a normal problem for most.
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Old 10-28-2019, 11:57 AM   #4
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This is exactly what I’ve seen telling people for years. Buy the truck that suits you after you have checked out all three and you will truly have the best truck.
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Old 10-28-2019, 03:53 PM   #5
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We get a pin number from a friend that works at Ford for the X plan so we have a Ford. The specs on the Montana told us what the configuration should be to stay within specs so we have what we have.
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Old 10-28-2019, 06:32 PM   #6
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Amen and hallelujah.
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Old 10-28-2019, 07:16 PM   #7
JJ Getaway
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theunz View Post
My Trucks' Better Than Your Truck! What? Waite, how can he say that?
I can say that because my truck is the best available combination for ME!
There is a constant barrage of posts here, and on other forums as well, with members telling others that they need this truck or that truck based only on one criteria. Quotes like, you need the most heavy duty truck available because someday you MIGHT get a bigger trailer, or you need a dually because you MIGHT have have a blowout ( really? When was the last time you had a blowout on your truck) or you have to have a long bed so you can carry more gear, or even, you'll be sorry if you don't get a diesel ( if you don't tow in any mountains do you really have to have 900lbs of torque or an exhaust brake and put up with the high maintenance cost of a diesel?
Let's face it, the reason their is so many different combinations of trucks offered by each of the manufactors is because all of us have different needs and wants from our trucks.
Certainly most, but not all of the current Montanas have enough pin weight to warrant a dually. Remember though, there are many who have older trailers that are perfectly adequate for even a 3/4 ton. I'm a big fan of The Three Bears...To little, To Big, and Just right! My truck is "Just Right" for me, something different may be "Just Right" for you. So, your truck may be better than mine, just not for me!
When someone asks about what truck they should buy let's consider all of THEIR criteria for THEIR needs then offer up the pros and cons of the different configurations without being condensending.
This was interesting as my wife and I have just ordered a new 2020 Montana 3761FL and now we are in the market for a truck. The 5th wheel is 41 feet long and we would like to get a 1 ton diesel, 6.5 foot bed and prefer an SRW so that we have a more user friendly truck to drive around when the trailer is parked. We are thinking a GM 3500 (GMC or Chevrolet), RAM 3500, or a F350. I am concerned about safety in driving in high winds, bad weather, etc. but I am told that the 2019 and 2020 trucks by GM, Ford, and Chrysler that are SRW have increased the towing capacity can handle the loads. Any opinions out there?
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Old 10-28-2019, 07:26 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by JJ Getaway View Post
This was interesting as my wife and I have just ordered a new 2020 Montana 3761FL and now we are in the market for a truck. The 5th wheel is 41 feet long and we would like to get a 1 ton diesel, 6.5 foot bed and prefer an SRW so that we have a more user friendly truck to drive around when the trailer is parked. We are thinking a GM 3500 (GMC or Chevrolet), RAM 3500, or a F350. I am concerned about safety in driving in high winds, bad weather, etc. but I am told that the 2019 and 2020 trucks by GM, Ford, and Chrysler that are SRW have increased the towing capacity can handle the loads. Any opinions out there?
JJ, first, welcome aboard, you've ordered a very nice 5er. I'm sure others will chime in but for the tow vehicle it's all about the numbers. To start you will need to work with the GVRW for your new 5er and calculate 25% of that as loaded pin weight. Most newer diesel trucks can tow the weight but do they have the payload rating to handle the pin weight in addition to the people and other items loaded into the truck...including the hitch?

The best source for actual truck specs is on the sticker inside the door. Since you haven't bought one yet I would look at spec sheets to see which type of truck gets you closest to the required weight rating.

Your 5er has a GVWR of nearly 17K lbs and a loaded pin weight of around 4K lbs. That's your starting point. Add to that people and stuff in the truck. Which trucks will safely handle that? My guess is that you are in the dually arena.

Again, it's all about the numbers. In the theme of this thread you should drive whatever truck you like...but safety for your family and others on the road should be first and will limit those choices accordingly.

Good luck with the TV search.
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Old 10-28-2019, 07:51 PM   #9
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This is a NEVER ending subject that will NEVER EVER end. It is actually very simple. You should NOT be traveling down the road with ANY one item on your tow rig or trailer being over the specs they were designed to handle.
They are:
Weight on front axle of truck. (never an issue)
Weight on rear axle of truck. (often an issue)
Weight on rear tires of truck (often an issue with SRW trucks, even sometimes on a dually)
Payload capacity of truck (very often an issue)
Total Weight of truck while hitched up (often an issue)
Weight on trailer axles (sometimes an issue)

So saying your truck is just right for me is just wrong...Ö..Without paying attention to the #s
All of the weight #s that manufacture's spec are there for a reason.

As a carpenter I'm not going to use Florida's roof specs to build a house in Maine. So why would you think using a tow rig/camper that was over its designed weight limits was ok for me ?
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Old 10-28-2019, 08:37 PM   #10
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Please show me where I suggested that anyone use a truck that was under capacity.
A couple of things here. When I say that my truck is just right for me, that's exactly what I mean. It means it meets the proper weight carrying capacity amongst other criteria for my specific uses. I have never, and never will advocate for driving over a vechicles "safe" limits.
15 % of GVWR is industry standard for calculating pin weight, although 20% is a more relevant figure. My trailer has a little over 4,000lbs of cargo carrying capacity, a figure I will never get close to. So to tell someone that they must buy a truck that will handle their trailers max gross weight is just not right. Each owner needs to look at how he is going to use their trailer and use that to help make their buying decision. By the time most buy a trailer of Montana's caliber they have been RVing for a few years and know how they are going to use it. Remember a full timer's cargo carrying needs are much different then a weekender or vacationers needs.
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Old 10-28-2019, 09:14 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJ Getaway View Post
This was interesting as my wife and I have just ordered a new 2020 Montana 3761FL and now we are in the market for a truck. The 5th wheel is 41 feet long and we would like to get a 1 ton diesel, 6.5 foot bed and prefer an SRW so that we have a more user friendly truck to drive around when the trailer is parked. We are thinking a GM 3500 (GMC or Chevrolet), RAM 3500, or a F350. I am concerned about safety in driving in high winds, bad weather, etc. but I am told that the 2019 and 2020 trucks by GM, Ford, and Chrysler that are SRW have increased the towing capacity can handle the loads. Any opinions out there?
That is a heavy 5er with a shipping (empty) weight of almost 14,000 lbs. The traveling weight will depend on how heavy you load it as it has almost 2,900 lb cargo carrying capacity. Probably few people load up a ton and a half of extra stuff even when including water. But you could still easily push 16,000 lb or more total weight. That is a lot of weight
Then you must consider the loaded pin weight and the payload rating of the truck. The shipping pin weight, meaning the empty weight with no extra accessories is 2,880 lbs. But loaded it will be considerably higher. The washer/dryer is at the rear, so that is a plus if you intend to get them. Again, added pin weight all depends on how much stuff you load it with and how. But you could still easily push 4,000 lb pin weight. Add that to other weight on the truck, fuel, people, cargo in bed, etc, and you are way up there.
Now SOME configurations or new SRW trucks do go to 4,000 lb plus. But most configurations are less, and some much less. Even with the highest rated SRW truck I am not sure you could find one with a rating you would need.
I am all for having an SRW truck, if and only if, the weight ratings of the truck match the loaded weights of the trailer. And in this case I donít think you can.
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Old 10-28-2019, 09:39 PM   #12
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I get that everyone is tired of hearing folks talk about what is the "BEST" truck. BUT I will say this once again:


Its not about what YOU drive It's about RECOMMENDING that others drive something that may be unsafe!!! Just because you are happy with a 3/4ton SRW does not mean you should RECOMMEND same to a newbee with no idea!! If you tell a newbee that you are happy with YOUR truck you are basically telling them it is suitable for them to use. You have to be willing to admit the limitations of what you drive. I have zero hesitation with telling someone about the issues with the width of a dually. NOBODY likes a wide rear ended truck! And yes a diesel engine costs more and has higher maintence. But to suggest that a safety feature such as an Exhaust Brake is not important is almost criminal!


And yes I do RECOMMEND to people asking for advice that they CONSIDER getting a truck that is one size larger than the minimum requirements (particularly if they are close to the limits) as a SAFETY cushion!! SAFETY should be the number one concern and EVERYTHING else should be secondary to that. I will repeat this again: When you buy a large 5th wheel you are signing on to the fact that you will have to make some compromises to safety with your tow vehicle.


If your towing a 20' rig which is well within the weight limits of a 3/4 ton srw I have no issues with you so long as you don't recommend the same tow truck to a newbee with a 40' rig!


I will admit that I don't think of the Montana line as 20' lightweight trailers. They are meant to be the large pinnacle of the Keystone line and with that in mind is how I dole out advice. And yes I do recommend that buyers think about the possibility that they might be getting a larger trailer before they trade in the truck and also consider the trade in value because those are IMPORTANT things to consider when you are buying a truck.


One last time: its not about YOU, its about your ADVICE to someone else!
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Old 10-28-2019, 10:57 PM   #13
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I got some extra popcorn if anybody wants some.
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Old 10-29-2019, 06:51 AM   #14
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I got some extra popcorn if anybody wants some.

Do you have some extra? I'm out of it.


I bought my truck based on the advertised specs for our 343RL HC. It was actually a used truck and at my usual Ford dealer and was pristine.



I bought a Ford truck because that's what I've owned for many years. As far as I'm concerned, it is the best truck. That is for me. What you own - your choice as long as it suits your towing needs.
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Old 10-29-2019, 07:28 AM   #15
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I got some extra popcorn if anybody wants some.
Please send me a bushel.
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Old 10-29-2019, 12:11 PM   #16
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Do you have some extra? I'm out of it.


I bought my truck based on the advertised specs for our 343RL HC. It was actually a used truck and at my usual Ford dealer and was pristine.



I bought a Ford truck because that's what I've owned for many years. As far as I'm concerned, it is the best truck. That is for me. What you own - your choice as long as it suits your towing needs.
The only advertised spec worth a grain of salt is the Gross weight of the trailer. Everyone should base there truck choice on that # using 20-25% of it for possible pin weight.

The dry weight and pin weight the manufactures advertises means virtually nothing.
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Old 10-29-2019, 12:20 PM   #17
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The only advertised spec worth a grain of salt is the Gross weight of the trailer. Everyone should base there truck choice on that # using 20-25% of it for possible pin weight.

The dry weight and pin weight the manufactures advertises means virtually nothing.

Yep well aware of that. The last one was a Canadian built Glendale Titanium 5er and it was actually sticker accurate to within a hundred or so pounds.



I really don't care as my truck by actual OEM parts is pretty well capable of handling what we have but wouldn't buy a larger/heavier one.
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Old 10-31-2019, 10:44 AM   #18
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I have zero hesitation with telling someone about the issues with the width of a dually. NOBODY likes a wide rear ended truck!
Seems odd that the auto maker continue year after year building trucks NOBODY likes. That must be why you seldom find used ones sitting on a lot for very long. Tongue in cheek? Of course! Oh and I need a couple bushels of that popcorn
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Old 10-31-2019, 02:11 PM   #19
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Ranger

Believe it or not we pull our Montana HC (only 34 ft) with a 6 cylinder Ford Ranger. I have to admit sometimes when taking off we may get honked at a few times for going so slow but I can assure you people get out of our way when we are headed down hill. Someone yelled one time "your brakes are on fire". Boy were they wrong, it wasn't my tires it was just the transmission. I am now removing my tongue from my cheek.

Your friend and mine,
Jim&Celia
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Please note: we live in Missouri and today it's too cold to play golf, this is the result.
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Old 10-31-2019, 06:40 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Hooch on Wheels View Post
Believe it or not we pull our Montana HC (only 34 ft) with a 6 cylinder Ford Ranger. I have to admit sometimes when taking off we may get honked at a few times for going so slow but I can assure you people get out of our way when we are headed down hill. Someone yelled one time "your brakes are on fire". Boy were they wrong, it wasn't my tires it was just the transmission. I am now removing my tongue from my cheek.

Your friend and mine,
Jim&Celia
Hooch on Wheels

Please note: we live in Missouri and today it's too cold to play golf, this is the result.
If that's a true statement (which I find hard to believe ), you are nuts. Pictures please.
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