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Old 06-02-2012, 03:52 PM   #1
stiles watson
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Major disappointment

Over the last five years, I have been supportive of Keystone. We have enjoyed our Big Sky and have rolled with the maintenance and repair issues. Now I am perplexed by Keystone's response, not to me, but to one of their dealers in Raleigh, NC.

I am having my black tank and my galley tank replaced because they ruptured. The two tanks were ordered by the dealer based on the serial number and manufactured date of my rig. Two tanks were shipped, one late. The black tank was the correct one and has been successfully installed. The second arrived 4 days late and was the wrong tank. The discharge nozzle was on the wrong side.

Keystone's response was that they only show two tanks on my rig, the black tank and the galley tank. They shipped the grey tank because they were "guessing" it would work. This is not competent, professional service to the dealer or to me. Now they say they don't know what tank goes into my unit and have asked for measurements. That info will not be delivered to Keystone until Monday.

Delays and more delays that are costing me, not Keystone, not the dealer, money. The dealer and the repairman have been straight with me and with Keystone. No, I haven't called Keystone. The issue is between the dealer and Keystone. I am caught in the cross fire. I am trying to be patient and treat others with the respect I would want to receive, but I am angry. It is costing me money for every extra day I have to stay here.

Who is at fault? Not the repairman, he supplied the correct information to the dealer. Not the dealer, they ordered the part Keystone told them to order. That leaves Keystone with either incompetence in keeping records or an incompetent staff.
 
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Old 06-02-2012, 04:07 PM   #2
cjohnson
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Sorry to hear about your problem. I believe you really need to contact Keystone personally, they are spending your time and money.
Someone at Keystone is just not doing their job!
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Old 06-02-2012, 04:41 PM   #3
richfaa
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Stiles if someone at Keystone did not know how many tanks are on a 2008 340 RLQ Big Sky they need to be fired. I can not think of a Montana that only has two tanks... You need to call the guys at Customer service. There is a incompetent in their midst.

There is no guessing involved you need to know exactly the correct tanks and which side the discharge nozzle is on.It is marked on the tank.Someone made a big mistake//// and is now not telling the truth.
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Old 06-02-2012, 05:09 PM   #4
steelpony5555
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Has the dealer at least tried to patch your old gray tank to at least get you back up and running till they get the new tank in.
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Old 06-02-2012, 06:00 PM   #5
DQDick
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If it were me I'd call Keystone. Something is totally wrong with this picture and I'd want to know everyone's story and see what could be done to speed things along. Keystone management needs to be informed if they really did what they are being accused of and they need to know what is being said if it's not exactly correct and you need to know what they are going to do to make it right.
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Old 06-02-2012, 07:35 PM   #6
Art-n-Marge
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Especially since you are long time Keystone owner you should have a voice to go beyond this crap. I think your story here is appropriate as it is written that the fact every day is a day that costs you funds. If you had a Montana then could argue some crap that the rig is not a full-time rig, even though it's a weak argument the way they have fouled up. But this is a Big Sky designed for full timers but only when you can use it.

There is no excuse which I think this is what they are doing here in getting your rig back up and running. I'd be on the phone right now and ask for a failure analysis - why if the directions for getting replacement parts by providing the VIN, and this did not work. If you find out what happened please let us know.

This is not how to treat a long time customer and this is not the first tanks they've probably replaced for whatever reason. I'm sure tank failures are not a first time occurrence and how they are handling this is not helpful to their public.
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Old 06-02-2012, 07:51 PM   #7
Artemus Gordon
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When we are angry, we tend to take sides. Life is too short for you not to get answers from the horse's mouth. Unless you saw, heard, or read the response from Keystone you can't be sure your getting the entire story. It's up to you ( in my personal opinion ) to call Keystone. You need information and facts. I personally will not wait on sidelines, I get in the game. I don't disagree that it's between the dealer and Keystone. That said merely venting frustration about "Keystone" on a public website is not going to fix your problem or get you camping. Vent at "Keystone" and make something happen!
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Old 06-02-2012, 08:36 PM   #8
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Stiles, thats what happened to me or very close to that, the Dealer would not listen to what I told them about the tank and the yellow crayon number writen on the tanks, my black tank had a number of 295 and a discharge facing the rear street side of the monty, the gray tank was 294 with the discharge faceing to the front street side. that is the tank that my dealer ordered so I had to wait another week and a half for delivery and installing it, which the did wrong and it leaked more than the original leak.
I feel your frustration..............
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Old 06-03-2012, 02:00 AM   #9
kdeiss
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Artemus Gordon

When we are angry, we tend to take sides. Life is too short for you not to get answers from the horse's mouth. Unless you saw, heard, or read the response from Keystone you can't be sure your getting the entire story. It's up to you ( in my personal opinion ) to call Keystone. You need information and facts. I personally will not wait on sidelines, I get in the game. I don't disagree that it's between the dealer and Keystone. That said merely venting frustration about "Keystone" on a public website is not going to fix your problem or get you camping. Vent at "Keystone" and make something happen!
I agree well said
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Old 06-03-2012, 03:45 AM   #10
ols1932
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Stiles,
That kind of response is disappointing to all of us. There is absolutely no reason whatsoever that such incompetence should go on without many, many communiques of complaint. Similar thing happened to us when our gray water tank needed to be replaced--Keystone sent the wrong tank. They stated, "We don't know which tank is in your unit."

I worked in industry too long to accept that kind of response. Every unit Rockwell-Collins Radio has a record of every electronic part, every modification, every status of equipment shipped out of the door. If the consumer provides the serial number, Rockwell can ship every exact part in that unit.

Keystone: No excuse will ever make us understand.

Orv
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Old 06-03-2012, 04:01 AM   #11
CamillaMichael
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No help in solving your problem, but I sure do hope this matter is fixed...SOON.
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Old 06-03-2012, 04:37 AM   #12
richfaa
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This was a un knowledgeable individual at Keystone.There was a huge miss understanding. Don't think he was even aware that you had a Big sky.
The tanks are clearly marked.Yours would be the same as my 06 3400. Call this number 574- 537-3946 that is Darrell Turner at the service center. I am sure he can clear it up..

However..the VIN and date of manufacturere may not be enough information.You need to get the information off the tanks.
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Old 06-03-2012, 06:21 AM   #13
bigred715
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This is madenning. I'm going to need a new kitchen tank probably due to it leaking after only 3 days of use. I'm also going to need a new awning due to an accident and the dealership says that Keystone doesn't know what model it is. Shouldn't they have a work order when it was built to know what items were put on when being built? The dealer had to come out and measure the awning to tell the parts man what to order.
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Old 06-03-2012, 06:56 AM   #14
Artemus Gordon
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Again I think Keystone is the fall guy! The VIN should give detailed information on each rig and it's equipment. One more issue however, manufactures make changes all the time during model year. Each brochure, website description states "Standards and Options are subject to change without notice"! I was in business for many years. I learned something very important. No one will ever voluntarily accepts blame if it can be deflected on to someone else! Very few exceptions in my experience. Thus everyone covers their butt! Roll with it, it will get fixed. Not putting this on anyone specific, but now a days we demand one day service, same day repairs. I remember being trapped at a camp ground waiting for parts for my dads old Ford for two weeks,I just take a deep breath and try not to get angry, frustrated, or just plain mad. Two heart attacks taught me my lesson!
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Old 06-03-2012, 07:29 AM   #15
richfaa
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The VIN should give detailed information on each rig and it's equipment." Unfortunately it does not always do that for the reasons stated. Montana is notorious for doing on line changes.Usually always for the better.

Big Red the best way to know what tank you have for sure is to have the dealer drop the underbelly section and read what is on the tank. The model of the awning is on the awning... carefree..Dometic. Do you need the entire awning or just the fabric.The dealer should be able to order the fabric only.

This is not the auto industry.Rv industry..anything goes..
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Old 06-03-2012, 07:57 AM   #16
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Stiles, I hope your situation is taken care of soon. I can imagine how frustrated you are right now.

I wonder if the person that shipped the wrong take was new??? I am surprised at how many folks jumped right on the bandwagon of its Keystone's fault and that idiot needs to be fired. Goodness, people make mistakes. Was their action correct is "guessing" and shipping out the wrong tank? No it was not. However; maybe in their mind they were only going off what information they had at the time, regardless of it being accurate or not. Maybe they thought they were doing the right thing by trying to get a tank shipped out to Stiles as quickly as they could in order to help him solve his issues. I admit I am one who will get worked up over things that are not done correctly, but I also try to understand that "PEOPLE" are involved in every aspect of this transaction and mistakes are going to happen. Lord knows how many mistakes I've made in my lifetime... I could care less about the person that made the mistake, I am interested in reading about how Keystone takes care of the mistake and handles the rest of this situation going forward. Keep us updated on the resolution...
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:10 AM   #17
stiles watson
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Many people will not use "angry" to describe their emotions unless they are red faced, cursing, fire breathing, head banging mad. Anger is an emotion that has a very broad range of intensity from slightly upset to rage. Many use all kinds of euphemisms to report their anger. I call it what it is....anger, not miffed, irked, ticked off, or the like. I did not report the level of intensity of my feelings of anger. In managing anger, I don't need any sermons on how to do so. I do seminars on anger management.

Others have indicated that I need to give Keystone some slack because my repairman or the dealer must have given bad info to them. We have double checked the info given Keystone for accuracy. I read people fairly well when face to face with them. The guys on this end are shooting straight. The dealer is extremely apologetic for the whole snafu.

As far as reading the "crayon" number on the top of the tank, I looked for that number on the old black tank when it was removed and it was totally unreadable. To get that number off the top you have to drop the tank. Since the small crack is at the top, if the galley tank is dropped, then I have no kitchen for the duration of the issue. Knowing this, my repairman measured the tank, length, width, and depth along with nozzle position. If Keystone can not determine the tank from this info, there is a really huge problem internally.

Keystone is a big boy. They don't need to be defended by the MOC. If I mess up, I need to admit it. If they do, they need to fix the problem in an expeditious manner. In many cases reported here, Keystone has stepped up to provide good customer service beyond reasonable expectations and I have applauded that. I will be happy to report a positive result should I have one to report. If Keystone comes through, I will gladly report it. In the meantime, the cash register runs.
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:42 AM   #18
Artemus Gordon
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Sorry to offend, or issue a sermon, since I am clearly not an expert. I attempt to be fair to all parties, hoping to be treated the same, by those I deal with in my life. I assumed you wanted imput or why post? Clearly, I was wrong and I will strive to be diligent, not to rush to inappropriate conclusions in the future. Your last post speaks volumes, and I hope your faith will comfort you, during what is apparently a severe financial strain, frustrating and emotional time in your life. Good luck !
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Old 06-03-2012, 10:17 AM   #19
simonsrf
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This is one of my main complaints I brought up to the Keystone representative at 7-Feathers a couple of years ago.

This representative defended their poor policy of no inventory control, no parts list that are associated with a vin number, no wiring schematics, no list of appliances....and an inability to help their customers replace defective or broken parts in a timely manner.

This has been a complaint expressed so many times on this forum, makes you wonder if they are listening or not, it is obvious they are NOT!

We live in our RV and can't be bothered or inconvenienced by this type of incompetence and neglect to a customer who paid good money thinking that the company would want to protect their existing customers and stand behind their product.

Others on this forum have said that all manufacturers in the RV trade do business like this (including the Keystone rep), that is a blatant falsehood.....I did my research!

BTW, our new motorhome comes with an electrical wiring schematic, a complete list of replacement parts, appliance manuals, manufacturer warranty manuals and contact information, troubleshooting guides, list of trusted dealers for service, and a direct telephone number to the owner of the company just in case it is needed to fix any problem.


Good luck Stiles, we have had tons of holding tank problems, my truest sympathies are with you; hope you get your inferior STAR MFG. tanks replaced soon. Make sure you get and save the right numbers, most likely, you'll need them again before long.

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Old 06-03-2012, 12:32 PM   #20
melnjoy
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Robbie is absolutley right, it would be very easy to scan every product that went into each rig that Keystone built. all products have a UPC code. Keystone would then have a clear record of each rig and that record should be accessible to the repair shop.
Stiles we have had the same problems with Keystone in the past. Tanks and Fender skirting seem to be the worst.
Mel
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