Weight Police Needed Again

[Waynem]

Hi Y'all!

While traveling to P'Cola, I just happened to run across a CAT scale.

Here is some information.
My truck F-350 Dually, has Front GVW of 4000 pounds (Edited: Should have ready 6000 pounds), a rear GVW of 9000 pounds and a GAVR of 13000 pounds.

The CAT scale readings were:

Steer Axle: 4940 LB
Rear Axle: 6760 LB
Tailer Axle 10960 LB
Gross Weight: 22660 LB

So, what does it all mean.

4940 + 4760 = 9700 lb
13000 - 9700 = 3300 lb

Assumed hitch pin: 2000 lb
3300-2000=1300 lb So I can add 1300 pounds to the TV and still be withing weight (If I don't eat lunch)

Interested in hearing comments please.

Edited: Ha! Ha! I corrected the rear axle weight. (Typo - blind eyes)

[rogue]

Wayne, Not the weight police, but have looked at your numbers and mine and here are the comments.

Correction, Gross weight should be 20,660 based upon your individual numbers. 4940+4760+10960=20660.
(now you can have lunch).

Is your TV tag actually 4,000, 9,000 and 13,000? My chevy has the GVAR less than the total or both axles (4670, 6084, 9200)

Looks like your front axle is over weight by 940LB, and your read axle is well under the max, so if you can shift any weight from the front to the rear, or reduce the rear weight of your monty, or add weight to the front of the monty may help reduce the weight on your front axle.

You also need look at the GCWR (this is the Gross Combined Weight Rating of the TV and Monty).

My numbers are
GAWR front, rear, GVWR, Monty axles, GCWR,
Tag on drivers door 4670, 6084, 9200, 12,000, 22,000, (from the truck book towing section for GCWR)
Actual last trip 4350, 5300, 9650, 9,150, 18,800,
TV only 4260, 3090, 7350,
Pin weight , , 2300, (9650-7350)
So you can see I am under in all ares except the GVWR.

Hope this helps.
Bob

Edit, spaces in format not holding, so numbers do not lined up as typed.

[Waynem]

Well, my math says that 4940+6760+10960 = 22660.

My TV (2005 F350 King Ranch, Crew Cab, Long Bed) tag is actually 4000, 9000, and 13000 lbs.

I could put the DW and DDog in the bed of the King Ranch, but I'm not going to tell her that it would relieve 940 pounds, no way!!!

I carry two 2x12 5ft long, some wooden blocks, and an ice chest with maybe 30 pounds in it. I don't have the foggiest idea of how to lighten up the front end.

[MacDR50]

Wayne: The further forward your hitch, the more weight transfered to your front axle. If you get a chance, get the truck weighed without the trailer hitched. That will give you trailer pin. However, that front axle number GAWR seems low. I would have expected 6000#. I checked a few 2006-2008 F350 KR's on line and they all were 6000 #. With a 13000# GVWR that would be about right. Check the plate again. Assuming your front is 6000# then the limiting factor for total cargo including the trailer pin is the least of the rear axle GAWR-R-axle load (9000-6760=2240) or GVWR-total load (13000-4940-6760=1290) or the capacity of your tires.

[bsmeaton]

To get the rest of the data you need, you have to drop the Monty and do a second weigh of the truck by itself. Then you won't have to make "assumptions" on the pin weight.

The CAT scales let you re-weigh for $1 if you keep your ticket.

[Waynem]

I ain't droppin' nottin'.

Okay, I put the glasses on and went out and recheck the information on the sticker.
I was right again! With reservations, of course.

Front GAWR 6000
Rear GAWR 9000
GVWR 13000

So there!! (darn it)

[rogue]

Wayne, Now that makes more sense. Your GVWR is less than the combined GAWR front and rear. And you are within the numbers for the front, so the DW and DDog won't have to give up their current seats.
Bob

[TLightning]

quote:Originally posted by rogue

Wayne, Now that makes more sense. Your GVWR is less than the combined GAWR front and rear. And you are within the numbers for the front, so the DW and DDog won't have to give up their current seats.
Bob

The combined weight of the F and R axles is always more than the actual GVWR. It gives us flexibility in how we load our trucks. You can load either axle to it's max as long as the total does not exceed the GVWR.

[Waynem]

Tom,
Stop trying to confuse us, I just barely got this one memorized!

[sreigle]

Wayne, which model Montana do you have? The 2000 lb assumed pinweight is why I ask. I only recall one or two members with a Montana reporting an actual pinweight that light, despite the brochure numbers. As point of reference, our actual pinweight on this heavily loaded 3400RL is 2860. On our equally heavily loaded 2003 3295Rk it was 3300. The 3295 has about the heaviest or nearly the heaviest pinweights of the Montanas. If yours is actually 2000, that's great.

[Waynem]

Steve,
I really don't know as I have not weighed the TV separately yet. There isn't a scale close by me here at home So I'll just have to wait until I get on the road and near one when I set up. I don't relish unhooking just to get a weight.

With 6760 on the rear axle, I'm sure it is more than 2000# Maybe some one out there with a 2005 F350 King Ranch, CC, dually can tell me what their weight is empty and I can try to figure an approximation from their info.

[MacDR50]

From all the research I have been able to amass from many hrs spent on line and discussing this with people who should know, a 5th wheel pin weight should be between 15-20% of the trailer's weight. The pins in the brochure are most likely based on the curb/unloaded trailer weights. For a 15,000# loaded trailer the tongue should be between 2250 and 3000. Now here is a way of estimating the pin without weighing the truck. Your max GVWR is 13,000. If you go to the Ford site it will give you the max payload for your truck, body style, drive train etc. This is basically the GVWR - the curb weight of the truck with a full fuel load and a driver. Lets say it is 5000#. Well we know you started with 5000 but now you have only 1290 left from the GVWR. This means you have a load of 5000-1290=3710 on the truck. Now take off what you feel is an estimate of the gear you are carrying, the 5th hitch and don't forget the DW and the pooch as well as what you yourself exceed 150# (this believe it or not is what Ford uses for the driver allowance in the curb weight. You should now have a rough but reasonably close estimate of pin weight. BTW a wise man always underestimates his DW's weight.

[TLightning]

Roger, a couple of comments...

-GM states the PW should be between 15% and 25%...Trailer Life Towing Guide says "most have 20% with as much as 25%."

-I have found the internet sites extremely inaccurate for weights, all numbers are best cased for the manufacturer...higher than realistic for cargo capacity. GM likes to talk about over 3000 of cargo capacity for a 3/4 ton truck...correct if it's a gasser...1000# less if a diesel, but they don't tell you that.

-It's been my experience that the best way to get true weight numbers is to look at a truck on the lot that is configured similarly to what you want (CC, diesel 4wd, etc), and take the cargo capacity off the Tire and Loading Information sticker. That gives you the cargo capacity, subtract that number from the GVWR and you have the truck's empty weight.

-With the numbers computed above, apply 20% of the trailer's GVWR and you have a good guess of realistic PW.

[sreigle]

I also always heard 15% to 25% of the trailer's actual weight with 20% to 22% being "ideal," whatever that really means. Ours is at 19.5%.