front end flexing

[Doug and Lorraine]

I'm worried that my '03 Mountaineer's front end is going to fall apart. I understand the older models had such problems. What exactly are the signs that this is happening and what can be done with it? HELP!

[PapaBeav]

We just went through this with ours. The first thing that I noticed was the veneer in the front closet was starting to get busted up. Then while driving down the road I would look at the pin box in the rear view mirror and it was stationary but the Monte was going way up and down a couple of inches in each direction. I took it to the dealer and had it checked for frame flex. After determining that it did Keystone gave the OK to have it repaired. We just got back from a trip to Utah with no problems. So far, so good. Rich

[ols1932]

quote:Originally posted by Doug and Lorraine

I'm worried that my '03 Mountaineer's front end is going to fall apart. I understand the older models had such problems. What exactly are the signs that this is happening and what can be done with it? HELP!

Doug and Lorraine,
Look at the molding that runs down the front underneath the overhang (the part of the rig that has the king pin); if you see that it's pulling away when the rig is on the truck, you have flex. Now, you do need about 1/4" flex as normal. The only way I know of checking it is to jack up the front end until the landing legs are barely touching the ground. That will tell you how much flex you have. Our rig had 1 3/4" flex and nothing was broken, not even one weld. The flex was repaired by adding some gussets around the king pin and welding a 3/8" by 4" piece of steel across the front of the chassis.

Orv

[Doug and Lorraine]

Is this a problem that Keystone will step up to take care of or are we stuck with an expensive repair? Just how common is flexing and is it something you eventually look forward to with fifth wheels? We love our fiver and this is very disturbing. We've been talking about getting a new fiver for a couple of years now and now wonder if Keystone units are built as well as others. It's very disappointing to put your trust and money (lots of it!) into a product you're so excited about and things like this happens. Just very frustrating.

[8.1al]

Doug and Lorraine,
Do you have a problem or are you just wondering what to look for? If you don't have a problem don't lose any sleep over this. The flex is not by any means a common problem.

[Doug and Lorraine]

Oh no, we have a problem. The front end is seperating from the body. The bedroom floor is moving when walking on it as well as some serious "squeaking" from the floor. The wall behind the dresser moves also. We'll have to check a few more things out this weekend. Thanks for ypur responses. Will get back to you all soon.

[PapaBeav]

If it is as bad as you say it is I would contact Keystone right away. When I called they told me to take it to my local dealer and have it checked out. They were very supportive and picked up the entire tab. And our rig is 5 years old. Rich

[richfaa]

Call Keystone service center and describe the problem as you did above. Mention that you posted the issue on the MOC forum and that it sounds like ....frame flex.. Do it now...

[Doug and Lorraine]

Thanks for all your replies. Called Keystone today and was told to take it to a Keystone dealer and have them look at it . We will do that next month since they said they sold 300 rv's from the Hershey PA RV Show a few weekends ago and are overwhelmed right now. Figures - our impeccable timing!

[pbahlin]

There are mutitple issues that are being lumped as 'frame flex' and they're not all the results of flexing frames. I had a problem like this that was recently repaired by Keystone Service Center.

My Big Sky exhibited signs of movement at the nose. On the right side, the trim that runs under the nose from the very front, back to the corner that drops down to make the face of the front storage area, was showing movement. When on jacks, the trim was about 3/8" down from the caulk line. This gap tapered to nothing back at the corner. When on the hitch, this gap closed up and everything looked fine. The left side didnt' have this gap but the decal that runs along the trim had wrinkles that could only happen if something was moving and returning to normal during travel.

Keystone looked at this at the rally (a terrific reason to go to the rally is to get experts involved) and had me bring it to their service center. What was happening is that the screws that fasten the side wall to the frame were letting go. There's a thin steel plate (maybe 1/8") welded to the bottom of the box beam that runs along the bottom of the pin overhang. Screws go through this plate and into the first of three aluminum box beams that reside at the bottom of the sidewall.

This box is filled with wood to give the screws something besides aluminum to hang on. To fix this they filled all the aluminum tubes with wood, ran extra long screws into the whole thing and rewelded the ends of the aluminum beams (they had cracked) together. They also ran screws horizontally at the bottom, through the lower aluminum box and on into the steel box beam. While the whole area was opened up they added king pin gussets since they've had reports of the pin to frame connection being a weak point.

I have to say that the service center is top notch. They did a professional job and I've towed it since then over 700 miles and it appears to be holding now. I'm not so happy that this whole area of the rig seems to be held together in a rather poor way. This area is obviously high stress and relying on a 1x1 piece of wood to hold it all together seems inherently weak. The proof of the weakness is the high quality service center work required to enable it to meet their standards of workmanship. Perhaps they need to drive this fix into the design, eh?

DW and I both noticed that the rig seems to tow better now. It used to oscillate on a bump. It's hard to describe but it just seemed sort of squirrelly on bumps. Now it does one cycle up and down and it's over. That's on a Trailer Saver air hitch.

If you suspect any thing at all is moving in this area get it checked. Keystone will take care of it and you don't want it to get worse while you chew on the problem alone. Look for wrinkled graphics, stretched or compressed caulking,separated caulking, anything at all other than a nice tight caulk line.

[Doug and Lorraine]

This may be our problem. We'll see once we take our fiver to the dealer.

[Jdrobone]

Had a problem similar to Paul's, though I didn't realize it at the time. My 2010 3400 rig was at the service center for another problem and I asked Darryl why the graphic on that corner of the nose was crinkling up on the bottom. When I picked the rig up I was told they removed the front cap and repaired a cracked aluminum brace/strut, something aluminum anyway, and put those additional wood pieces and longer screws Paul was referring to.

[Doug and Lorraine]

Well, we dropped our '03 Mountaineer at dealer in PA about 40 or so miles away and the service writer called Keystone and they told him it's out of warranty and dosen't feel it will be covered. Now what????? How much money do you put into a rig that's 7 years old? This is very upsetting. The reason we went with Montana in the first place is the reputation of being #1. Does that mean they just push units through to fill orders? Shoddy workmanship? There is no way this should be happening to as many as it is. Our last trailer we had for 14 years and not one bit of problems and looked as good as when we sold it as when we bought it. Hubby will be calling Keystone again tomorrow. Just not happy at all.

[richfaa]

Make sure you mention that it is the WELL KNOWN frame flex problem/ 7 yaer old Montana's will fall into the years when they had the problem.

[HamRad]

Doug and Lorraine,
Have you contacted Lippert? They are probably the builders of the frame. In previous instances Lippert worked with Keystone to resolve some of the frame issues. I don't remember the details.

Good luck.
HamRad

[Doug and Lorraine]

The more info we got on this forum, we think it's the sidewall problem with the welds breaking. We don't know what the service writer was exactly telling Keystone to get some kind of approval that they told us to take our fiver to a dealer to get looked at. So my hubby will call to get some names for the service writer to talk to. Hubby didn't get the name of the person he talked to. We'll see what happens tomorrow. Here's hoping. We appreciate all your replies!

[richfaa]

If you have the seperation when the camper is OFF the truck and it closes up when it is on the truck it is most likely sidewall seperation..However the 03 Montana 's had the real frame flex problem.
Keystone will have to know exactly which issue you have before they can do anything about it.

[Doug and Lorraine]

Ours is just the opposite. It opens up when on the truck and closes when jacked up. The bedroom closet, ceiling above bed slide, tv stand, dresser are all coming apart especially when on the truck. We took pics and video of putting it on the truck. Big gaps.

[richfaa]

Those are definate symptoms of Frame Flex. Keystone needs to see the pictures and video. Remember this is a "known" issue in the early year 5th wheels known as frame flex. If you do a search on the forum you will find much information.

[PapaBeav]

We just had ours fixed two months ago (frame flex) and Keystone picked up the entire tab and our rig is 5 years old.