Inside lights won't come on-Help!!! - Montana Owners Club

jaybird · 10-25-2010, 04:55 AM

Got home last week from successful campin and plugged 5er into shore power and left her. Checked back in and now I can't get the lights to come on (they barely light) but the ceiling fan works and the microwave power is on. The battery is 5 years old but would the battery be in play when she's plugged in? Any advise??

firetrucker · 10-25-2010, 05:21 AM

Check the breaker for the converter. It sounds like it is either off or the converter (or the fuses on the output) are dead and the battery is almost discharged.

Bob

jaybird · 10-25-2010, 05:24 AM

My IOTA converter does not have any fuses on the back of the box and the main cabin breaker for the converter did not pop. The van on the converter works but I don't know if that means the converter is OK or blown

firetrucker · 10-25-2010, 07:06 AM

Check the voltage at the batteries. If the converter is working, it should be between 13.4 and 14.6 volts, The fan on the converter should only run when it has been working hard, putting out a lot of current. If it's running all the time, I'd start by disconnecting the battery to see if it was the problem. If everything goes off, then it's the converter.

Bob

ljensen · 10-25-2010, 07:24 AM

You should have 2-30 amp fuses,most likely one of them is blown. This happens to me once in awhile, I don't know the cause, I only know how to fix it when the lights are dim.

firetrucker · 10-25-2010, 01:06 PM

Those fuses are there to protect against getting the battery connected backwards, but if they fail for any reason, like age and vibration, you will lose the output of the converter.

Bob

jaybird · 10-25-2010, 01:52 PM

I was told by the manufacturer that Keystone asked IOTA to produce converters without fuses and replace them with Jumpers whatever that is. So apparently the jumpers are something I can't replace. Maybe I have to replace the converter. I bought a new battery but still no lights

snfexpress · 10-25-2010, 02:55 PM

A jumper would simply connect one side of the fusible socket to the other side making the electrical connection, rather than using a fuse. So, a jumper could have become dislodged.

Here's what I would do to try to troubleshoot the problem:

1) Connect 7-way to truck, with truck running. If voltage at battery is above 13.4 volts and if lights won't come on, then the problem is between your battery and the 12 volt distribution panel (or at the panel itself);

2) If after connecting the 7 way you have over 13.4 volts and the lights are on, then it could reasonably be expected that the converter is at fault;

If #1, then I would check connections at the battery - make sure they are clean and tight. I would also check the ground to the frame of the 5er from the battery. Keystone typically uses a self-tapping bolt without scraping the black paint off the frame which can cause a poor ground.

Also, you should have a resettable circuit breaker near the battery on the forward wall of the basement (in the front compartment). Perhaps this breaker has gone bad because of a short? You can easily test this by measuring the voltage prior and after the circuit breaker.

My best bet would be either the ground connection, or, more likely, the circuit breaker, because you stated you replaced the battery.

Good luck and I hope you can follow my rambling...

jaybird · 10-25-2010, 03:53 PM

Thanks to all for your help. We all know how pricy and a pain it is to take our 5er's to the shop. I'll give all your ideas a shot. Not being to mechanically skilled its kind of a chanllenge to see if I can get er going. It all started when I tried to replace the circuit breaker on the push outs and I zapped something. My main push out stops and starts. I put the original 40amp breaker back on in a panic. That couldn't be it could it???

snfexpress · 10-25-2010, 04:08 PM

Ahh...more information. I would suspect the main circuit breaker from the battery to the distribution panel - it is typicaly located adjacent to the circuit breaker for the slide-outs.

jaybird · 10-25-2010, 04:21 PM

That coud be it. When I tried to replace the slide breaker I had some sparks from wrenches touching battery. Should I completely unhook the battery when I try to replace this circuit breaker? Told ya I was a novice?? but thank you for your advise

jaybird · 10-25-2010, 04:24 PM

I'm guessing but I remember a circuit breaker next to the slide breaker and its 3 prong. Could that be it??

TAKPAK · 10-25-2010, 04:29 PM

Jaybird, you might just check for fuses on the converter. We have the 3400 with the IOTA 75 amp unit. It DOES have two fuses on the back. I had to take the air intake on the bottom step out to get to it. Even then, I had to unscrew the IOTA from the floor so I could turn it to see the fuses. I would seriously doubt that IOTA would allow Keystone to dictate removing fuses, as that would put IOTA in a big liability situation. I personally have never seen a unit WITHOUT fuses.

Your comment about the sparks when changing the breaker is a good lead. It COULD have taken out the fuse(s) on the converter. It doesn't take much......!

jaybird · 10-25-2010, 04:41 PM

I actually talked to someone at IOTA and he told me about the Keystone request to put in jumpers instaed of fuses. (Mine is the IOTA-DLS55) I even sent him photo's of my converter with the lid off. This is all brail to me but I can assure you I will get those damn lights on yet. I've stared at the dog gone converter inside and out looking for a silly fuse

snfexpress · 10-25-2010, 04:49 PM

When working on the 12 volt system (battery), you should disconnect the ground to the battery, then the hot lead after disconnecting from shore power, because a properly functioning 5er will be converting 110 volt AC to 12 volt DC.

jaybird · 10-26-2010, 06:06 AM

snfexpress- Your the man. I just tested the converter and its good to go. Looks like your advise about replacing the general circuit breaker next to the slide circuit breaker might just be the answer.(I sure hope so) I'll have to remember you come Christmas

Thanks so much

Tom S. · 10-26-2010, 06:47 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by jaybird

snfexpress- Your the man. I just tested the converter and its good to go. Looks like your advise about replacing the general circuit breaker next to the slide circuit breaker might just be the answer.(I sure hope so) I'll have to remember you come Christmas

Thanks so much

The circuit breaker next to the slide circuit breaker should be for the landing gear. If you have light problems, there is a limited number of things it could be. You will need an electrical meter (under $10 at Harbor Freight) to do most of the checking. In order, I would do this:

1). Check all the fuses and circuit breakers in the two power panels. Turn the breakers off and back on again to make sure they aren't tripped. Fuses can be checked with a ohm meter. Set the ohm meter to any resistance reading, and it should go to zero when you touch the leads to the fuse.

2). Check the converter. Use a volt meter to see if it is putting out 12 volts. Make sure you disconnect the battery when you do this so you don't read voltage from it instead of the converter.

3). Check the battery. To do this, you will have to remove it and take it to a auto parts store. Due to the quality of help usually found in these stores, I would take it to two different ones to make sure you're getting accurate information.

jaybird · 10-26-2010, 02:11 PM

Your sure that circuit brekaer on my '06 is for the legs? makes sense!! It is the same size as the push out circuit breaker after I looked at it today. Well that changes my hope. I bought a new battery and confirmed that the converter is good. I will hook up everything and hope for the best tomorrow. Is there any chance that the switches in the cabin where all the power bank is, could that big flip up switch for the converter be blown even though I can switch it to the on position. The fan on the converter worked even before I confirmes it hold 13.6v today. And does a new battery need to charge up over night before lights will come on?

Tom S. · 10-27-2010, 01:41 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by jaybird

Your sure that circuit brekaer on my '06 is for the legs? makes sense!! It is the same size as the push out circuit breaker after I looked at it today. Well that changes my hope. I bought a new battery and confirmed that the converter is good. I will hook up everything and hope for the best tomorrow. Is there any chance that the switches in the cabin where all the power bank is, could that big flip up switch for the converter be blown even though I can switch it to the on position. The fan on the converter worked even before I confirmes it hold 13.6v today. And does a new battery need to charge up over night before lights will come on?

I am positive about the breaker. They used to use fuses for the legs, then went to breakers. Inside the living quarters, you have a circuit breaker panel, and the converter should be on one of the 20 amp breakers. The large breaker is a master for the whole 120 volt system. It's easy to check a breaker: First unplug the power cord from the power. Then remove the face panel to the breakers. Pull out the breaker and swap it with one of the other 20 amp breakers. Plug the power back in and see if the 'problem' is gone. As I stated, the best way to confirm the converter is working it to measure the output voltage with the battery disconnected, so you know you're measuring the converter and not the battery. A new battery should be charged enough when you get it to start using immediately.

sreigle · 10-28-2010, 10:33 AM

George, when we had a similar problem with our 2003 Montana it turned out the battery ground cable had a bad connection on the end away from the battery. In ours, that cable was screwed into the floorpan of that front locker. The sheet metal screw connecting the ground to the floor had corroded and was no longer making contact with that floor.

I used a through bolt with lockwasher and nut to replace the sheet metal screw and had no more problems.

This might not be your problem but since nothing else has worked for you I thought I'd mention it. Just in case..

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