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08-22-2006, 12:43 PM
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#1
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Breckenridge
Posts: 354
M.O.C. #6190
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Are Montana's suitable for cold weather living?
My husband & I are just starting to look into the possibility of full-timing but probably in a much different way than most of you.  We would have to do most of it locally at this time as we cannot retire yet and so need to keep our jobs. (First, we would have to sell our house of course.)
We live in mid Michigan and there are a few CGs that are open year-round. We have found the Montana's to have floorplans and features that we like and at a price we feel we can afford. One of our main concerns is whether we can comfortably live in a Montana in the winter in mid Michigan even with the arctic package.
We are not jumping into this right away but are just looking into it and want to learn all we can from those of you that have done it/are doing it and hopefully be well informed before we make such a huge decision/choice.
All feedback and suggestions will certainly be appreciated.
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08-22-2006, 02:51 PM
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#2
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Leona
Posts: 6,382
M.O.C. #2059
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In my opinion, there are several challenges to be addressed. One of the first would be your water supply. Your water lines would not be underground, so keeping them thawed is a challenge. I would think skirting your Montana would be a strong benefit in that clime. Preserving any heat and preventing some of the air flow would be the goal.
One of the biggest challenges is the condensation problem. Cold on the outside and warm on the inside means condensation will form in the interior walls and windows. Dessicants and de-humidifiers will be paramount.
Since the roof is flat, I would guess wet snow removal would be needed and challenging. There are some threads from last winter explaining the different challenges and means of coping that were used.
If I remember right, Steve Riegle has addressed these issues and may be a rich source of information. Another alternative is to procure new jobs in more southern climes. Hope your research brings you to the desired conclusion. By-the-way, welcome to the forum.
Stiles n Dianna
"Life is an adventure unfolding"
03 3670RL Big Sky
02 Ford F250 Lariat Longbox 7.3L PSD
Hypertech Programmer III
Prodigy
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08-22-2006, 03:51 PM
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#4
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Montana Fan
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Ottawa Lake
Posts: 307
M.O.C. #321
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I live in southern Mi. and I can say that I would not attempt it. you wold have to use the furnace to keep the holding tanks from freezing and do something with the low point drains. Sreigle might be of some help as he has stayed in some pretty cold temps and had his low point drains freeze up. Roman
2004 3295 rk
1995 F-350
3"down pipe&4"exhaust
k&n air filter
1st Moc rally attendies
Roman & Pam Bialecki
Ottawa Lake, Mi.
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08-22-2006, 05:05 PM
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#5
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fort Myers
Posts: 5,933
M.O.C. #4282
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It will be an adventure. Our new 2007 Montana (3400RL) is about as well equiped coming out of the plant as any previous year Montanas to handle the cold weather. However, there will definitely be some challenges. But it can be done. Especially if you buy a new Montana.
Up here in NW. MI, there are year round CGs (Bellaire, Mancelona). Proprieters of these year round CGs are a good source of info to check with. The reason they have year round CGs (and this area is a snowbelt) is because they have figured a way to protect enough against the elements to make camping possible all winter. Ask one of these CG managers about your plans.
I plan on making Christmas holiday trips (3 weeks or so at a time) back to NW Lower MI (5 grandchildren here). Even though this Montana is supposed to be rated to zero degrees, I have ideas from this forum that I will implement to assure comfort.
Steve Riegle is our resident expert on (among other things) cold weather camping, as he spends his holidays in E. Kansas, where it can get rather nasty in December. He will be here shortly with his list.
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08-22-2006, 05:33 PM
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#6
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Montana Master
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 20,028
M.O.C. #20
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The 2007 Montanas are tested not to freeze down to zero degrees F. That's right in the new brochures.
We've had up to 14 inches of snow on our roof without problem. I really don't think snow up there is an issue. After all, it easily holds my 200 pounds and that's a much higher pound per square inch than snow will be.
Assuming a 2007 model --
As noted above, you will use a lot of propane staying warm. See if the rv park provides 100 lb propane bottles or larger, where you pay for the propane used.
You will want to make sure the furnace runs occasionally. The 'no freeze' is based on the furnace pumping heat into the belly where the water lines and tanks are located. If you're comfortable, so is the Montana is the rule I use.
If you don't have dual pane windows you'll want to put the 3M or other brand exterior clear film over the windows.
If you want to have running water from a city water connection you'll need to heat tape your water hose. If the park has not heat taped their pipe (the part above ground) and spigot then you'll need to do those, too. Otherwise, fill your onboard water tank as needed and use the water tank.
The 2007's have just about everything else that can freeze inside where they get some heat. I see where the water hose goes through the bottom into the convenience center appears it would be open to the elements. I think I'll shove some insulation in there to plug that hole around the water hose.
If you will have an older Montana, not a 2007 or at least not one with the internal convenience center for water hookups, there's a whole list of additional things you'll have to deal with. If that's the case, post back and we'll try to tell you what those are.
We have spent Nov/Dec in the Kansas City area in our Montana (a 2003 model) each of the past three winters. We've had temperatures to 5 below F, and ten days at a time where the highest high was 14. We had some freezing problems but I think I have those all whipped now. There are things you can do.
In Michigan you probably have even more severe winter weather than we have dealt with. Hopefully someone with this experience in that climate can jump in and help.
See another Montana or Mountaineer on the road? Flash lights twice, it might be one of us!
Steve Reigle (pronounced Regal)
Fulltiming since 3/21/03
'03 3295RK
'05 Ford F250 SD Lariat CC SB 6.0L PSD/TS FX4 4x4
Our RV Travels (now Firefox-compatible)
 
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08-23-2006, 12:52 AM
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#7
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Clearwater
Posts: 10,917
M.O.C. #420
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BBBBBBRRRRRRRRRrrrrrrrrrrr Steve you're making me cold just reading that post. Sure glad it doesn't get that cold in Florida.
Glenn
Montana Owners Home Page
RV Related Links
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08-23-2006, 01:39 AM
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#8
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Breckenridge
Posts: 354
M.O.C. #6190
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You guys are great! Thank you so much.
We would be looking at a 2007 Montana but not before next year (and perhaps could get a good deal on an end of the year model by next fall IF they had the floorplan we are looking at AND we were ready to do this). It sure seems doable. We realize there is a lot of "extras" we would have to do to protect the RV pipes from freezing and we are learning exactly what that consists of from all of you. Thank you! We already discussed wherever we would be we would obtain the largest propane tanks available. (We already spend almost $200 per month on a locked-in, budget plan just for propane for our house).
I realize most of you do not camp in the north during the winter by choice as you can (lucky you-  ). However, we, by circumstance, cannot go south. My Dad is my only living immediate family (my only sibling just passed away suddenly this past winter) and I want to stay near my Dad as he is not in the greatest health and I want to here for him as he needs me. Otherwise, I can work anywhere really if I choose as I work via the Internet (but do have one office locally I pick up/deliver my work and they are not willing to go digital/Internet). I know my husband could get a job somewhere where it is warmer doing something (he is a journeyman insulator-might come in helpful insulating an RV! ) even if it wasn't in his trade. We would not do that now due to my father or until we were "debt-free" which we feel we could be within three years of moving into the RV.
Our biggest/main concern of going full-timing and being snowbirds is insurance. Husband is 42 and carries good insurance on us both provided through his employer. I am 52 and we definitely need the insurance and I know the cost can be terribly expensive - more than I think we could afford so we kind of feel "stuck" due to that issue mainly.  I have been informed of at least one area in Florida that once you become a resident, and your income is not above a specific level, you become eligible for free medical and hospitalization at a local major hospital. That would be something worth looking into!
My Dad has so graciously given us his home in his living well on a life-time lease so we will one day end up living in his home at least part-time so we know we will need to sell our house eventually as well.
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08-23-2006, 02:52 AM
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#9
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fort Myers
Posts: 5,933
M.O.C. #4282
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Wannabe, you have a lot of issues going on. There are a lot of MOCers here that can offer help in most, if not all of those areas. A lot of experience here. I would continue to ask specific questions and you will get invaluable info from this forum.
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08-23-2006, 04:14 AM
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#10
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Montana Master
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 20,028
M.O.C. #20
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WFT, with the 2007 and later models, and some 2006's, you won't have to do a whole lot other than common sense and keeping that furnace running occasionally.
By the way, new model years start in July in the RV industry. Next Fall the 2008's will have been out for a few months. Just something to keep in mind if you go shopping in July - 2007 will already be a "leftover" and should command a bigger discount.
Glenn, we have failed miserably. Failed in convincing at least one of our children and their familes to move where we could do the winter holidays in warmer weather. When we started fulltiming we had one son in Kansas City, one in Topeka, KS, and a daughter in Panama City, FL. It's obvious where we were thinking of spending our winters. Before the first winter, daughter and husband transferred to Columbus, OH. Then they got divorced and our daughter moved to Kansas City. Then the Topeka son moved to Kansas City. So, here we will be for the winter holidays. But a couple of days after Christmas we leave here. Hopefully I won't have to chip ice off the landing gear to get them to retract so we can leave the area like we did two winters ago.
See another Montana or Mountaineer on the road? Flash lights twice, it might be one of us!
Steve Reigle (pronounced Regal)
Fulltiming since 3/21/03
'03 3295RK
'05 Ford F250 SD Lariat CC SB 6.0L PSD/TS FX4 4x4
Our RV Travels (now Firefox-compatible)
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08-23-2006, 04:19 AM
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#11
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location:
Posts: 1,568
M.O.C. #4890
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I saw 100 pound propane bottles at a Costco in Prince George BC. I should have bought one , they were only 135 bucks. That same Costco also filled propane bottles much cheaper than any place in Canada I have been to.
Don & Donna
Vancouver Island
2005 Ford F350 V10 Lariat CC 4x4 LB SRW 11200 GVWR
2006 Montana 2955RL 
click on the little pic to see a big pic
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08-23-2006, 07:47 AM
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#12
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Ooltewah
Posts: 360
M.O.C. #4958
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Here's an idea on your propane bottles, that is used extensively in our area of the country. Most propane companys will loan you the bottle, or larger storage device, just for setting up regular refills or top offs of propane.
Many posts lately have dealt with some folks pulling the lower skin off and insulating more heavily the pipes and the lower areas of our Montana's. Something that would help in any case.
The 2006's in May, when I purchased mine, had the new nose and the water center located in the storage bay, so it is not exposed. Keystone is really starting to think this product to serving the fulltimers/most timers. Hopefully we'll be there soon.
Jim, Angie and Anna the Wonder Retriever
2001 GMC Sierra 4X4, CC, D/A
Air Helper Springs, New Engine
2006 3295RK fitted with some of the improvements from valuable MOC owners!
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08-23-2006, 08:37 AM
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#13
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Colorado Springs
Posts: 578
M.O.C. #718
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Devildog is correct we have a 100Gal tank that the truck comes every 2 weeks and tops off. Wehave in the wintewr use about 30-40 gal every two weeks at $1.30 a gal, on its way up. we paied a low rate up front.
Bob & Lee
U.S.ARMY(Retired)Full time since 2 January 2004
2004 3685FL 1997 F250HD,460, Ext Cab,Auto,4X4
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08-23-2006, 02:09 PM
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#14
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2006
Location:
Posts: 1,700
M.O.C. #5751
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Maybe I'm missing something here.
If I'm going to full time it, the absolute last place you will find me is where I'm worried about snow on the roof or pipes freezing or running out of propane because the heater is always on. I'm more apt to be worried about running out of sun screen or if I'm going to get to the early bird dinner special on time. Sure I'd visit the families...but not in the winter!
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08-23-2006, 03:30 PM
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#15
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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What cat320 sez,,what he sez...
Rich& Helen N.Ridgeville,Ohio.
F-350SD, Lariat, V-10,4:30 Diff, tow command Long bed, Crew Cab Dually, 06 3400RL
Mor-Ryde Pin Box
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08-23-2006, 03:42 PM
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#16
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Breckenridge
Posts: 354
M.O.C. #6190
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We are not planning to do this this way because we "want" to; it is more of a need to. Believe me, it is our dream to head where it warm away from this northern cold when we can work that out!  If you go back to the original post, it will explain it more.
Also, to add, my father is of not the greatest health and I want to stay near him to help take care of him if need be. He is my only living immediate family left and we are very close.
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08-23-2006, 04:21 PM
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#17
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fort Myers
Posts: 5,933
M.O.C. #4282
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Where about in Mid Michigan are you located? Maybe I swing by and visit on my way back up to the Great White North some Holiday season...
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08-23-2006, 04:25 PM
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#18
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Breckenridge
Posts: 354
M.O.C. #6190
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Dave & Sheryl, we live in Midland County, near Midland and Breckenridge. Would love to meet you -just let us know when!
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08-23-2006, 04:37 PM
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#19
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fort Myers
Posts: 5,933
M.O.C. #4282
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We are staying at the Isabella County Fairgrounds (just north of Mt Pleasant) from Sept 14 - Sept 20. Our church is opening a new building. Speakers, events, small carnival. We will be heading to the Annual National MOC Rally in Goshen, IN for the next week, then to Asheville, NC for a month or so before heading to FL.
I will PM you with my cell #. Give a call. Anytime tomorrow would be great.
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08-23-2006, 05:16 PM
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#20
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Montana Master
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 20,028
M.O.C. #20
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At least some parks open during the freezing part of the year offer the 100 lb propane bottles at no charge other than for the propane used. We have that in the park where we spend Nov/Dec. We also had it a couple of years ago at a park in Golden, CO, where we spent the month of October. We just let the park know we need another one and someone brings one down. I usually have a second one sitting here before the first is empty. When empty I call them and someone comes and gets it. I just hook it up and pay them for the propane.
See another Montana or Mountaineer on the road? Flash lights twice, it might be one of us!
Steve Reigle (pronounced Regal)
Fulltiming since 3/21/03
'03 3295RK
'05 Ford F250 SD Lariat CC SB 6.0L PSD/TS FX4 4x4
Our RV Travels (now Firefox-compatible)
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