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07-23-2004, 03:08 PM
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#1
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New Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: PASADENA
Posts: 5
M.O.C. #1873
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Abnormal Wearing of Montana tires
We are the owner of a 2004 Montana 2955RL fiver that is wearing the inside tread on each tire to the point Of having all four tires to be replaced after about 5000 miles. I contacted my selling dealer who gave me the phone number of Keystone customer service. I talked to them and was told that they don't pay for alignment since I had probably hit a curb and overloaded the axles. I assured him that I did neither and felt that this was an issue that Keystone should address. He told me to take my trailer to a tractor trailer alignment shop to check it out. The service writer and mechanic that was going to do the work told me the axles were too small for the trailer and straightening them would not last vert long and recommended I replace the axles. I would like to know if anyone else is having this same problem and if you could please check the size of your axles to let me know if my axles are a different size by mistake. I have 5200lbs. axles.
Thanks,
PENROD
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07-23-2004, 03:43 PM
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#2
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Spring Hill
Posts: 2,725
M.O.C. #59
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My axles are rated about 4500 and have never had a problem.
Before you go to a shop for alignment at least jack up each wheel and check the wheel bearings by insuring there is littl play. I call it a shimmy test. Also make sure the lugs stay torqued to 90 ft lbs. These lugs will loosen.
Also make sure that your axles are not overloaded by driving the truck through truck scales. Make sure you are less than 10400 on those axles.
I do wish Keystone would put heavier axles on these rigs. If I start having problems I will probably change axles. But with way over 20000 and 2 orignal tires with little wear I will keep mine for now.
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07-23-2004, 04:52 PM
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#3
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Duncan
Posts: 157
M.O.C. #1645
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Our tires are also wearing on the inside. After going through 8 different people (dealer, Keystone, Tire manufactures, ect,) we talked with an engineer for Tacoma -- he wanted to know the weight on the tires. He suggested that the trailer was probably over the weight limit for the tires. We will weight the trailer next week. Ours is still under warranty. Also have have not hit a curb or bent the axles.
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07-23-2004, 06:37 PM
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#4
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Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Albuquerque
Posts: 703
M.O.C. #235
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Good to see this topic as I have not posted for quite a while - on the road for 8 weeks then busy since we returned home. My husband went to rotate the tires (we had other people do it before) and found a problem with the right back tire wearing just on the inside about 1/4 inch - the rest of the tire looked good as did the 2 that haven't been on the right rear - the 2 that had had the same wear pattern. After taking one tire to several specialists they said the axle is out of alignment or bent. Like you we haven't hit curbs, rough roads etc - highway driving. Calls to Keystone also produced the same result not covered under warranty unless axle is bent then it is. After all the problems we have had with this Montana (long story)the last of the warranty work is suppose to be done this next week - we take it in on Wed, so we will see what they say about the axle and tire wear. Will let you know. An alignment here is $50 and if that is needed then we will have that done when we have the extra springs put on the truck.
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07-26-2004, 03:07 AM
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#5
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Montana Master
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Monominto
Posts: 731
M.O.C. #657
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Tell us the whole story. It sounds like a whole lot more then just tire wear. We'd really like to know, so we can inspect our to see if the same problems have gone un-noticed.
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07-26-2004, 03:51 AM
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#6
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Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Richmond
Posts: 60
M.O.C. #599
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We had one of our Montana tires blow out and shredded to pieces on our last trip. The tires probably have less than 3,000 miles on them. Wasn't enough left of tire to even try to see if it was defective.
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07-26-2004, 08:15 AM
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#7
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Established Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location:
Posts: 15
M.O.C. #1550
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I posted on this subject before as I had concerns about the number of problems I have seen on excessive tire wear on the Montana and Mountaineer lines.
Several replied with equal problems and after inquiring with several other service managers, the problem is excessive.
Keystone will, with out doubt, pass this off as damage caused by running over curbs, etc. I am not sure how you can mess up two axles and four tires by hitting a curb, but goes to show you Keystone mentality. Overweight will certainly wear tires on the inside and a trailer riding low in the rear will transfer enough weight to wear rear tires as well. Actually you can wear one tire on one side just with a combination of weight factors. These axles supposedly aren't maxed coming off line, but there sure isn't much of a margin left for customers. Loading can be critical side to side, front to rear and very few actually know what the loading is per wheel.
Keystone never admits fault to anything unless they are backed into a corner. If they can pass their problems elsewhere, they will.
Al-Ko axles isn't easy to nail down about axle problems since they sell to Keystone whatever axles Keystone specifies. They have no control what application Keystone uses specific axles for. However, Keystone is a large enough customer that Al-Ko has been doing what they can in the form of replacing axle beams under warranty.
I have managed to get both axles and tire re-imbursements from them. Success on this depends on how long the owner has had the trailer.
Keystone knows they have a problem. Getting them to admit it is something else again. Keystone is not necessarily pro-customer when they have on-going problems they don't want to address or change.
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07-26-2004, 08:32 AM
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#8
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Montana Master
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Monominto
Posts: 731
M.O.C. #657
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This may go deeper then we suspect. So far I have found a 2850 with 20 to 30,000 miles on it. That's the record holder so far. I suspect it's the 3670s and 3400reds that are loaded to the max. What sort (size) of 5ers did you get the re-imbersements on???
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07-26-2004, 09:03 AM
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#9
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Spring Hill
Posts: 2,725
M.O.C. #59
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Gruffy and RV Service Manager,
My 2850 is the one referred to. I have 15 inch Towmasters. I replaced my back two tires about 10000 miles ago. I replaced them simply because they had very slight bulges but not bad. To look at my 99 tires it hard to tell the difference between them and the new tires. Nice even wear.
My Montana had the frame upgrade 00-8 installed. The strength at the spring hanger area very strong since the metal used is thicker and stronger than that in the original I beam. This prevents even the slightest sway side to side. Maybe this is why I don't have excessive tire wear because my frame just looks stronger than new ones. I wish all of the new ones had this mod but it is expensive to do.
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07-26-2004, 09:06 AM
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#10
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Spring Hill
Posts: 2,725
M.O.C. #59
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hit the wrong button .....sorry
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07-28-2004, 07:52 AM
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#11
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Established Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Wherever we are at the time!
Posts: 14
M.O.C. #685
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I am Jerry Arbaugh and I too have axle problems and wheel lean An expert axle pro who builds trailers says the axles are not the right ones they are 6000 lb each and he says they need to be 8000 lb Our 5er is the 2000 3555RL .Keystone and I have a court date of 10 Sept 2004 at 1 pm in Astoria Oregon if anyone wants to be there come on to Astoria It starts promptly at 1 pm Also Gruffy mine springs and shacles were replaced May 2003 by this same axle pro and mine looked just like yours all of them came apart I got pics if you want to see He put in good ones with zert fittings and much stronger and he also said the axles caused this problem My temp phone # is 360 642 8238 til 1 sept came across the Columbia river from Astoria to do some salmon fishing
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07-28-2004, 03:06 PM
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#12
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Established Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Wherever we are at the time!
Posts: 14
M.O.C. #685
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My tires was also replaced april 2002 and Keystone quickly replaced all 5 of the uniroyals with my choice of 5 michlien at the local tire dealer in Coos bay oregon.As far as I can tell from the oo-8 this unit has not had it done and Keystone never notified me about it. I also sent keystone an email about it after I found out about it here and I haven't heard a thing from them
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07-29-2004, 11:42 AM
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#13
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New Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Asotin
Posts: 4
M.O.C. #1881
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Jerry, I am encouraged to see that you are taking on Keystone over axle problems.
I just arrived home from a 4700 mile trip to Haines, AK from South East Washington. I have a 2004 Montana 2980RL. It has a total of about 8000 miles on it now. As I was going through Whitehorse, YK, I noticed abnormal wear on the inside of all 4 tires. Not sure when the wear started I didn't know for sure that I could make it to Haines and back home. At a trailer repair facility at Whitehorse, I was told that it was wearing relatively slowly and I should be able to make it to Haines and back to Whitehorse.
We made it that far and debated as to whether or not we should attempt to go on, as the wear pattern continued. We started out and after a few hundred miles I decided to have the tires turned the other direction on the wheels, so as to wear on the better part of the tread. That worked and we made it back home.
I had contacted the repare facility at home by phone and registered my problem, as the warranty was about to expire. Believe it or not, two new axles beat me home!.
I told the dealer, however, that I didn't want to put the new axles on because it made no sence to replace weak axles with new weak axles.
I have written a letter to Keystone conveying that message--mailed yesterday so I don't have a reply yet. I probably know what that reply will be though. I told them that a satisfactory solution would be to replace the axles with heavier ones with tires and wheels to match.
On the trip we met other Montana owners, one of whom had an axle replaced in Anchorage. His faulty equipment caused an extensive delay awaiting arrival of his new axle. Another one who wasn't aware of the problem until I informed him of it and showed him how to detect the problem. (Draw your hand across the face of the tire. If it is smooth one way but "grips" your hand the other, you have a bent axle.)
We had a great trip that would have been better had we not had this problem hanging over our heads.
Good luck in your suit against Keystone. If enough of us get together we can show some clout.
I can't get to Astoria, but am very interested in the outcome.
Dick Gladish
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07-29-2004, 07:14 PM
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#14
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Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Albuquerque
Posts: 703
M.O.C. #235
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Our unit is at the dealers now getting all the rest of the warranty repairs done (some existing for well over a yr) - don't know the out come of the axle problem yet. They found the leak of our brand new shower after I pointed out they didn't bother to use proper screws when they reinstalled the glass enclosure and all the rest ar rusting - looked like 2 were sheet rock sheets! I even told them my thoughts on the matter - Jack agreed with my assessment of the leak.
I agree - Keystone knows they have problems and don't bother to fix them. We have been fortunate not blowing tires, etc but the inside wear of one tire or any tires isn't right. We have 16 inch tires.
Gruffy - we had 4 pages of complaints and fixes that is why I said long story. The most serious on the first list was the leaking shower into the basement - a whole new shower had to be installed, there was black mold under the shower pan. Not to even mention the brakes, which were replaced at Al-Ko, driven back to NM then 1500 miles later one completely fell apart, had to have it fixed in Las Vegas - still waiting for a check from Al-Ko.
Will let you know what the dealer says about the axles but with their attitude I expect to hear that there is nothing wrong with the axles. After all the questions and problems with something as simple as the rear stablizers bending (they are suppose to replace them finally) axles would throw them.
Safe travels.
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08-05-2004, 05:18 PM
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#15
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New Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: PASADENA
Posts: 5
M.O.C. #1873
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Jerry I want to wish you luck on your lawsuit against Keystone.I have come to the conclusion that I will have to take them to court to get anything done about my axles.It is a shame that an expensive trailer like this will wear out a set of tires in less than 5000 miles and still be in warranty and Keystone say its not their fault.Anyway you hang in there and let us know the outcome.Penrod
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08-06-2004, 02:51 PM
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#16
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 219
M.O.C. #137
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I spent $60 to have mine alined and have pulled it about 6,000 miles after and the tires are wearing even, I check them with a depth gauge.
You can waste time and money on Keystone or lawyers or you can get it fixed and forget about it.
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08-06-2004, 09:54 PM
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#17
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 1,740
M.O.C. #1757
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Thanks for the post and good luck with Keystone. Sounds like their margin for error is too close on the weight of their axles. Keep us posted and happyrving......
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08-07-2004, 03:19 AM
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#18
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Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Racine
Posts: 809
M.O.C. #1165
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jerryb: When you said above, "I spent $60 to have mine alined," what is it that you had alined? (I know this may seem like a dumb question, but I am a bit confused, sorry about that) We just got our Monty back from the "Warranty Doctor" to have slide leaks repaired (waiting for a good Wisconsin rain to test repair), and asked about having the tires balanced. (We have the 16 in tires) Dealer indicated they do not balance tires and we would need to do this at our expense. It seemed to us that tires should have come balanced from the factory, but guess not.
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08-07-2004, 03:34 AM
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#19
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Montana Master
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Cedar Rapids
Posts: 4,876
M.O.C. #1944
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We had abnormal wear on the right rear wheel of our 2000 Montana. When I checked to see what might be causing it, I found that the center bolt in the spring had broken and the axle had shifted to the rear approximately 2 inches. When the bolt was replaced, wear returned to normal.
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08-07-2004, 04:44 PM
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#20
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 219
M.O.C. #137
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A good truck and trailer alignment shop can take care of alignment and balance, Keystone will argue about warranty and even if they replace the axle the new one may not be any better, so just spend the money and get it fixed.
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