Wireless Transmission of electricty - Montana Owners Club

HamRad · 08-27-2008, 01:01 PM

Wireless transmission of electricity is not a new idea. It's been around a long time. So far no practical and or efficient way to do this has been developed. If this process is ever perfected it has huge ramifications on our world society. It would almost solve the energy problem overnight!

Can you imagine a world where this process has been put in place? The autos would never have to visit a fueling station again. All the energy you would need for your car is simply transmitted to the car! And you'd never have to worry about boondocking. At least for power. You'd still have the problem of water and dumping but at least you'd have plenty of power.

The ramifications are almost limitless. It will be interesting to see how this transpires.

HamRad

Edit to include "Wireless" in topic title.

H. John Kohl · 08-27-2008, 01:10 PM

Now I thought you were talking about lighting.

firetrucker · 08-27-2008, 01:42 PM

The skeptic that I am asks if you are concerned about cell phones, two-way radios, and microwave ovens. We're talking different frequencies, but a comparatively huge increase in energy density. What would keep things that you don't want to receive the power from melting down? Hmmm, maybe it's not such a bad idea after all...nosy, noisy neighbors, speeding cars, bank vaults. No end to the possibilities.

Bob

Waynem · 08-27-2008, 03:00 PM

Wow! What a vision into the future.

HamRad · 08-27-2008, 03:21 PM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by firetrucker

The skeptic that I am asks if you are concerned about cell phones, two-way radios, and microwave ovens. We're talking different frequencies, but a comparatively huge increase in energy density. What would keep things that you don't want to receive the power from melting down? Hmmm, maybe it's not such a bad idea after all...nosy, noisy neighbors, speeding cars, bank vaults. No end to the possibilities.

Bob

Bob,

I have absolutely no idea how this will work. I do envision a process similar to the cell phone pattern. And or the satellite type approach. How will this energy be sent and received? Will it be harmful? Will there be some sort of safeguard? Who will control this stuff? Will the authorities be able to simply call the power company and tell them to shut off the power going to such and such a car? If it can be used to "deal" with nosy and noisy neighbors we will all be in trouble!

I wish I had the answer to ANY of the questions I've posed but I don't. Heck I'm probably not even asking the right questions! But it is fun and exciting to even talk about something like this!

Dennis

firetrucker · 08-27-2008, 06:52 PM

Dennis, can you imagine everyone having a small windmill connected to a 2-3 kW inverter generator that would automatically sync to the powerline, like a Honda generator. That would sure reduce the demand on the grid and provide emergency power, but somehow, the utilities and government would have a problem with the reduced revenue, I guarantee. Our whole society is based on consumption and control of the supply, and the outcome of conservation is not going to be as rosy as most people would like to think.

Bob

SlickWillie · 08-28-2008, 01:29 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by firetrucker

Dennis, can you imagine everyone having a small windmill connected to a 2-3 kW inverter generator that would automatically sync to the powerline, like a Honda generator. That would sure reduce the demand on the grid and provide emergency power, but somehow, the utilities and government would have a problem with the reduced revenue, I guarantee. Our whole society is based on consumption and control of the supply, and the outcome of conservation is not going to be as rosy as most people would like to think.

Bob

IIRC from my days working in a power plant (was TXU at the time), utility companies had to buy power from customers that produced more than they used. Many large industries generate their own power and have excess generation. I'm not sure what the situation is now, as I left TXU in the early 90's.

Seems to me the hydrogen fuel cell is the way of the future. I use to keep up with it's progress, but have not the last few years. Check this out: http://www.ballard.com/ I know I had read at one time that a fuel cell the size of a refrigerator would eventually power a house.

Snownyet · 08-28-2008, 06:48 AM

Ive been a power plant employee for 20 years,have quite a bit of knowledge on the whole process and I cannot fathom how wireless transmission of electricity would occur. How would it be possible to keep it from going straight to ground? Theres stray voltage issues when wires are used. Slickwillie, what you describe still occurs, but the process differs from state to state. One interesting thing we may see soon is broadband communication over electric wires. Its in trial use now where utilitys are communicating over their electric conductors. I guess since theres such wide ranges in frequency, you can use 60hz ac voltage in conjunction with high freq's successfully.

HamRad · 08-28-2008, 07:43 AM

Snownyet,

I cannot figure out how they'd do it either. It is all "magic" to me. I have a vague understanding of how radio stuff works but it, too, is pretty much just more "magic" to me! But if we can make radio, television,cell phones and the Internet work there isn't any reason we can't get electricity to do the same.

The Broadband experiment over electrical wires has been going on for a few years now. There are some interference concerns about it. I know many in our Ham Radio system have experienced serious interference. So much so that in several places they ended up stopping the program in that particular area.

My point in posting this subject was to get folks interested in it. I read recently where a major company has gotten interested in the process and demonstrated it by powering a light bulb wirelessly. I seem to remember that it was only a few feet but it piqued my interest. Also not too long ago watched a Discovery Channel or TLC or whatever.... on Tesla's experiments in the early 1900's with this issue. He actually built a huge transmission tower in New Jersey. It was a couple of hundred feet tall! Unfortunately it was never used. He ran out of money before he could get it working.

Fascinating stuff! If only!

Bob,

You are probably correct. The way things are you know the oil companies are not going to allow alternative methods to get very far unless they are the ones controlling things. And of course they already have the necessary governmental systems setup to allow them to keep control of the situation. But it is still fun to think about. Do you remember reading and or listening to the Dick Tracy stuff back in the 40's and 50's? Many of the concepts that I first saw were standard way back then. The wrist radio, then the TV! Now we have cell phones. Still looking for the magnetic powered vehicles! But that is sort of along the lines of this subject.

OK.... I'll stop.

Later,

Dennis

MacDR50 · 08-28-2008, 09:22 AM

The most common concept is to convert it to another energy form such as photonic and beam it between line-of-site transceivers. My question is at what point does all this radiation start causing those cancer prone cells we all carry to start sprouting like weeds after a good rain? The secret to the energy crisis is to use no more than can be replaced/renewed.

HamRad · 08-28-2008, 10:23 AM

Roger & Bea,

Thanks for the additional information about transmitting electricity. As to the question about cancer I have no thoughts. Will it be worse than what we're transmitting now? Would you be vaporized if you got into the line of sight transmission? Lot's of good and important questions yet to be answered.

Thanks again for the input.

Dennis

Waynem · 08-28-2008, 02:56 PM

Electricity is already being transmitted. Grab a fluorescent cylinder light bulb and walk under a power line feed and it will light up.

Now how do you convert that? If you were to live under one of those power line spider feeds, could you power your house?

grampachet · 08-28-2008, 03:24 PM

We had an electric toothbrush that was recharged by putting it into the plastic recharge holder. There were no contacts or metal touching metal. Everything was encased in plastic and I have no idea how it recharged but it did.

Waynem · 08-28-2008, 03:58 PM

Induction.

Edited: I don't understand a darn word of it, but I know that's how the toothbrush gets charged.

Snownyet · 08-29-2008, 04:28 AM

Quote:

quote:Originally posted by Waynem

Induction.

Edited: I don't understand a darn word of it, but I know that's how the toothbrush gets charged.

The concept is similar to the flashlights you shake to charge. Shaking a magnet within a copper winding induces voltage. I love this topic, 20 yrs in the field and its still exciting. Any conductor coiled up with current flowing through it will induce voltage in the center of the winding, even a coiled up extension cord. I had a co worker once say that a power plant is the only production facility where you cannot see your finished product, and if by chance you can.... You just did something wrong.

skypilot · 08-29-2008, 04:37 AM

Snownyet: I like that powerplant saying -- never thought of it that way.

I've noticed some computer and cell phone items advertised recently that recharge just by being close enough to a 'charging station' that is using radio waves to recharge the units (mice, cell phones, laser pointers come to mind). Very limited range and looking a web page I just got via a google search, the 'instruction sheet' is mostly warnings... Big one is that 'the effects of long term usage on individual health has not been determined. Past studies have not shown any adverse effects but other studies continue. Be sure to maintain at least 3 feet (1 mtr) distance from the charging station during normal usage.' (Paraphrased..... ). Will be interesting to see what develops. As a neighbor and I were recently discussing -- the things we saw in comics and cartoons in the 60s and 70s (even 30s and 40s according to him), are now coming true -- who knows, in a few years we might just have the jetson's flying car!!

stiles watson · 08-29-2008, 04:42 AM

All this electricity stuff is based on the square root of negative 1, an imaginary number. It is all smoke and mirrors. But my lights still come on.

Bob Pasternak · 08-30-2008, 12:19 AM

Back in the 80's when lived in FL and was driving FL to LA or San Fran every week, I seem to recall there was a school in southern CA that had a mega-volt power line going over it. It seems there was a dis-proportionate number of cancerous tumors of the head and eyes of some of the students at that school. Another form of retarder for trucks was an electric one. An armature was fastened to the drive shaft and a field coil wrapped around it and fastened to the frame of the vehicle. There was a reostat on the dash that the drivers could use to induce voltage to the field coil and creat resistance to slow the vehicle. I've not driven a truck with it but when I drove charter buses, we had some VanHool (Dutch made) buses that had them. They did work as advertised.

SlickWillie · 08-30-2008, 01:31 AM

The power plant I worked at in East TX had three sets of high voltage lines (345KV) leaving the plant. One crossed a friends pasture. Every horse they ever had developed cataracts on their eyes. I've been at their house late in the evening when all was quiet, and you could hear the hum of the electrical lines.

As far as induced voltage. When I first went to work there in 1979, I went fishing on a creek where one of those lines crossed the creek. I made the mistake of parking my truck under the lines. I had an aluminum shell on the bed, and every time I would go to open the shell, I would get a spark to my hand. I have heard stories of people stealing electricity by burying coils of wire under high voltage lines. Not too sure those are true, perhaps just someones imagination.

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