Need help from experienced brain trust.

[JandC]

We are full time and don't stay more than a day in places that don't have full hook up, so I can't address pros and cons of different gen sets. We did add the shortest profile front air available to our 3400. It not only takes care of the front bedroom but helps cool down the rest of the living area. We also went with the Splendid wash/dry combo (vented model). We can drop a load in and forget about it, plus in the 3400 model it only cost us a little space instead of giving up all the room for a stackable. DW loves the unit and can do 4 large loads easily in one day. As far as pulling a 3400 with a 3/4 ton, you may want more TV. I am fine with a SRW F-350 but I did add Firestone bags recently. Just keep in mind that we are new full timers. You may go a different route depending on how you are going to use your unit. Welcome to the forum. I have found a ton of extremely good advise here!

[Narlywarrior]

quote:Originally posted by Art-n-Marge

With Ford let's be specific since there's TWO types of F-350. One with SRW and the other is a dually. You don't say what year of 3400 you have but if the GTWR of that trailer is way over 14,100, then even the F-350 SRW may not cut it and not necessarily the 7.3 which was a nice strong motor but it was not coupled with as strong as a transmission as the Torqueshift and the trans is one of the weak points for a larger trailer.

Air Bags DO NOT increase your towing capacity - if you call the air bag company and not their sales distributors or dealers who lie to make the sale, then they'll tell you this! They just smooth the ride and help bring down the headlights from being highbeams. Usually, adding a leaf spring and changing the tires and maybe the wheels to support the higher weight capacity can help for an F-250 to F-350 conversion, but for your year of truck it may be more. This was all that was needed for my '06, but your '03 also has smaller brakes. I upgraded my '04 F-250, 6.0PSD to an '06 F-250 with the same 6.0 PSD and gained some weight capacity. But not enough, then added the leaf spring and hardware and changed my wheels and tires because the stock F-250 wheels weren't strong enough. But I only tried to satisfy pulling my '06 3500 that weighs no more than 14,040. I will not be able to tow the newer 15,000 lb trailers at all. I weigh my trailer regularly and it's always under 13,500.

I went for the two Hondas in parallel so I can support my 30 amp when necessary. If the generator were attached to the rig, I couldn't use it for anything else. I use my portables for many other things besides the Monty.

For the money go with a hitch that leaves the bed flat. My rails are in "the way" all the time even when I remove the hitch to use the truck bed for other things. Get a slider if you have a short bed.

Hi Art,

My 3400 RL is a 2007. The sales brochure says the shipping weight is 11,560. My truck is a 2003 F-250. I need to do some home work on tow capacity.

I have the two hondas that came with the deal so I have something that is a great start and useable else where.

I am going with a hitch that has the best capacity, slider for short bed and smoothest ride and that also leaves bed flat. don't know which one that is yet but that is the way I think I want to go.

Thank you for your opinion and point of view.

Have a great day and travel safe.

Louie

[Narlywarrior]

quote:Originally posted by JandC

We are full time and don't stay more than a day in places that don't have full hook up, so I can't address pros and cons of different gen sets. We did add the shortest profile front air available to our 3400. It not only takes care of the front bedroom but helps cool down the rest of the living area. We also went with the Splendid wash/dry combo (vented model). We can drop a load in and forget about it, plus in the 3400 model it only cost us a little space instead of giving up all the room for a stackable. DW loves the unit and can do 4 large loads easily in one day. As far as pulling a 3400 with a 3/4 ton, you may want more TV. I am fine with a SRW F-350 but I did add Firestone bags recently. Just keep in mind that we are new full timers. You may go a different route depending on how you are going to use your unit. Welcome to the forum. I have found a ton of extremely good advise here!

Hello JandC,

Thank you for your reply. All good points to ponder. I sure love my 7.3 but I may have to come to terms with the facts and continue to do my research.

Enjoy. Travel safe and thank you.

Louie

[jlb27537]

Hi, You might look at this link. You will probably have to use the 2002 year since mid 2003 the 6.0 came out.

http://www.trailerlife.com/trailer-towing-guides/

Bear in mind the GVWR of the truck is part of the limiting factor for towing. On a F250, the axle weight rating is limited by the 16" tires. Until you actually weigh your 3400RL you do not know what it weighs. Shipping weight usually means nothing.

One thing I have found is, ask a 250/2500 driver about weights and his reply is it tows it just fine, have you ever weighed it, NO, I do not want to know. Ask a 350/3500 driver the same question and he will ask if you want to see his weight slips..

My 2012 3500DRW weighs 11,300 lbs with my 3150RL hooked to it. That is way beyond the 8,800lbs a 2003 F250 is rated for and you have a much larger trailer.

Jim

[h2ojocky]

After reading multiple posts on this forum, I purchased a Pullrite Superglide hitch with removable rails for my short bed Chevy. I am pleased as all others that commented on their auto sliding hitch. Check Tweety's online for prices.

Russ

[1retired06]

As a matter of interest comparing a 3/4 against a one ton stock truck, per the official Ford towing guide for 2011 fifth wheel towing:

SRW F250,CC,SRW, 4X4, diesel: 14.4
SRW F350,CC,SRW, 4X4 diesel: 15.7
DRW F350,CC DRW, 4X4 diesel: 21.5
For the supercab SRW Diesel 4X4, 250 and 350 the same: 15.9; have to go to the 350 to get a DRW. Pin weights not listed.

[richfaa]

The GVWR on my F-350 listed in my sig is 13,000
The carry capacity listed on the door sticker is 4,268LBS.
The truck actually weighs ready to tow 9,100 lbs
That means my REAL carry capacity is 13,000 minus 9100=3,900 lbs
The actual pin weight on my 06 3400 and we ran heavy was 2800 lbs .
This 13 3402 is the same floor plan and configuration as the 06 3400 even so I will give it a pin weight of 3,000lbs as we have not yet weighed it but I know we are not as heavy.
that means we still have a leeway of 900lbs and that is the REAL BIG DIFFERENCE
between an 3/4 ton or one ton single wheel drive and a dually. Do the math on your truck ...the numbers can not lie.

[steelpony5555]

One thing to think of with the AC,,if one conks out, and it will, you may have to run a few days in HOT weather with just the bedroom AC. If you have a 15K it won't be that bad, but with a 13k it may get a little warm. Believe me it happened to me last summer. We were fine with the 15k bedroom AC. Also you may just get one of them cheaper then the low profile 13k units, just depends on the dealer. Ours was running a special on the Coleman Mach and we got it installed for $800...

[jlb27537]

To the OP,

Bottom line, you need more truck....................

[Narlywarrior]

quote:Originally posted by jlb27537

To the OP,

Bottom line, you need more truck....................

Dang. I'm getting more and more confused. I have comprehended everything that I have read but I need to get my mind around not having enough truck.

Thank you all for your responses.



Louie

[BusyCarol]

Okay...at this point I don't know if more input is helpful or is going to hinder the process so feel free to ignore my post. You have a lot of experienced Montana owners on here with varying levels of mechanical, technical expertise, and every one of them is proud of their rig and choices...and should be! The bottom line is what are you planning on doing with your rig (i.e. full timing, part timing, some timing, etc) So with that said here are my thoughts, from a females perspective which may be of no use to you at all

1. We contacted Dometic and found out exactly what model would work with our Comfort Control Center 2. We only wanted a 13,500BTU because we do not fulltime in our unit and we definitely wanted low profile. They gave us the exact model to purchase which turned out to be a Penguin II model, we ordered it online and installed it ourselves...and LOVE IT!
2. We have a 7 year old that finds dirt within 30 seconds of arriving at any campsite. So even though we are only 'some timers' I needed a washing machine and we went with the Splendide 7100xc VentLESS model, installed it ourselves, and LOVE IT!
3. We have two Yamaha generators that we can run in tandem if we choose. I like them better than the Champion we use for our stick n brick house because I can lift them and they are MUCH quieter! We don't use them very often but when we want to they are pretty quick to setup. We rigged a way to carry them in our generator bay while on the road. We were going to go with an Onan but couldn't justify the expense with the limited time we use our rig.
4. As you can see we have a similar truck. For more info PM me.
5. We have a short bed truck so we went with a Pullrite Superglide and couldn't be happier! It is a dream to hook up especially with the 6 point level up system.

Just so you know I do drive our rig (forwards and backwards believe it or not) and I LOVE this forum and all of the people who have helped us make us 'more informed newbies'!!!

[richfaa]

Louie...... Pin weight, pin weight, pin weight carry capacity, carry capacity. Look at the numbers in my post above and do the same with the truck you have and any truck you may purchase ... the truck you have will pull it fine and if that is all you are concerned with...well..OK. Pulling it within manufacturers specs are another story We do not have the truck we wanted...... we have the truck we needed.

We are long timers and use the rig a lot our 06 3400 had two A/C's 15.5 in the back and the low profile 13.5 in the front. the twp a?c came in handy even tho we do not stay in really hot weather. the 13 3402 has the two A/c's both 15.5's and the front is NOT the low profile. we are still plenty low enough.

we have one 3.5 KW generator. We do not full time or boondock. I would NOT purchase a generator if I had it to do over again. It is a nice comfort item but we have never used it for a C.G failure.

[Narlywarrior]

quote:Originally posted by richfaa

Louie...... Pin weight, pin weight, pin weight carry capacity, carry capacity. Look at the numbers in my post above and do the same with the truck you have and any truck you may purchase ... the truck you have will pull it fine and if that is all you are concerned with...well..OK. Pulling it within manufacturers specs are another story We do not have the truck we wanted...... we have the truck we needed.

We are long timers and use the rig a lot our 06 3400 had two A/C's 15.5 in the back and the low profile 13.5 in the front. the twp a?c came in handy even tho we do not stay in really hot weather. the 13 3402 has the two A/c's both 15.5's and the front is NOT the low profile. we are still plenty low enough.

we have one 3.5 KW generator. We do not full time or boondock. I would NOT purchase a generator if I had it to do over again. It is a nice comfort item but we have never used it for a C.G failure.

Hi Rich,

I'm tracking what your saying. Better to have it and not need it then to need it and not have it.

My rig came with two hondas so if I do boondock at least I will have a means to power up.

Two a/c are a must for me. second unit the manufacture recommended is a dometic briskair 15,000btu

I appreciate your suggestions.

Thank you.

Louie

[richfaa]

The dometic briskair is what came OEM in the front of the 3402 Big Sky. You have the generators and that is a good thing. The truck specifications are a on going topic of Discussion.

"it will pull it fine" was not good enough for me. 3/4 ton and one ton can have the same drive train so of course it will pull it fine . The manufacturers specification is what the manufacturer states their product is capable of doing.. any manufacturer, any product. One should know and understand the spec's of their equipment and make the decision based on knowledge.

[Narlywarrior]

quote:Originally posted by richfaa

The dometic briskair is what came OEM in the front of the 3402 Big Sky. You have the generators and that is a good thing. The truck specifications are a on going topic of Discussion.

"it will pull it fine" was not good enough for me. 3/4 ton and one ton can have the same drive train so of course it will pull it fine . The manufacturers specification is what the manufacturer states their product is capable of doing.. any manufacturer, any product. One should know and understand the spec's of their equipment and make the decision based on knowledge.

Roger that......

Understood.

Thank you

Louie

[TLightning]

Narlywarrior...ignore the "shipping weight" unless you plan on going rving with an empty RV...'cause that's what shipping weight is. Use the Montana's GVWR, found on the sticker on the left front. Also, you will notice all the posts saying your truck is fine are from other 3/4 ton drivers...who are over weight. Add me to the "you need more truck" group.

[Narlywarrior]

quote:Originally posted by TLightning

Narlywarrior...ignore the "shipping weight" unless you plan on going rving with an empty RV...'cause that's what shipping weight is. Use the Montana's GVWR, found on the sticker on the left front. Also, you will notice all the posts saying your truck is fine are from other 3/4 ton drivers...who are over weight. Add me to the "you need more truck" group.

Thank you.

I appreciate everyone's option and suggestions. It's a leaning process.

Louie

[Art-n-Marge]

Yup, Narlywarrior. Three more things that have been covered but I will emphasize.

First, the shipping weights are gonna be wrong and irrelevant. Even from right out of the factory, these Shipping weights are typically calculated on the BASE unit. Oftentimes they will not consider options that are installed after the BASE unit is put together. So added things like a fireplace, air conditioners, a washer/dryer are not weighed until the unit makes it out of the factory then the final sticker (different from the brochure) is stuck on. My 3500RL had a brochure weight of around 11,000 something, but when I bought the unit, the shipping weight was over 12,000 lbs because of all the extra stuff I got, leaving less than 2,000lbs from the sticker Gross weight of 14,040. Therefore, NEVER rely on shipping weight. ALWAYS refer to the Gross Weight, THEN hope you don't load up the trailer so much that the Gross is exceeded. What is the gross weight rating on the trailer's sticker? Then get to a scale to find out for sure!

The second thing is a proper truck even an SRW with these larger trailers. I was VERY fortunate to satisfy my weight ratings by upgrading my F-250 with the exact requirements to create an F-350, but it is not always this easy. But since I did not "recertify" the truck, I can only use it with the new ratings for personal use. The reason everyone says you'll need a bigger truck is to save you the anguish and research I went through as an example. Your truck and powerplant combination may not give you enough since it is the previous weaker generation truck even if you upgraded the rear end (and maybe the tires or wheels). If your goal is to be weight compliant, save yourself the grief and get a new capable truck and find out the real weight numbers.

The last thing to consider is THE PIN WEIGHT. The Pin weight is the portion of the trailer that is carried by the truck. This is where most trucks get in trouble. For a TT, it is well documented that the bumper pull weight is typically about 10% (or 12%) of the Gross trailer weight. For most fifth wheels you'll read that it can be from 15% (or now 18%) of the gross trailer weight. THEN, for residential fifth wheels this can be UP to 25%. Unlike other fifth wheels like car transporters, horse trailers, utility trailers, there is not as much stuff over the pin and the bulk of the weight is over the trailer's axles. A residential fifth wheel has a large overhang and most of the heavy storage is in the front of the axles which then is carried by the pin. Then add a generator, washer/dryer in a front bedroom configuration, and another A/C and this will add much more over the pin and on top of the truck's rear axle.

I am not a full-timer and my Monty has 19% to 20% of its gross weight on the pin (Wow, I was surprised it wasn't 15%). THIS is why I was overweight. I went by the shipping weight, calculated only 15% and thought I was good. I did sag and bought the air bags to correct the ride and sag. THEN I went to the scales and found I was overweight at the rear end and the gross weight of my F-250. Puzzled, and a lot more research I found out all the things you are now learning. Salesmen lie to make a sale! Some don't know it and I believed them exclusively. My rig weighs 13,500 lbs and I carry about 2,500 lb on the pin which an SRW can satisfy with all the other junk I carry in the truck (including me and passengers) and still have some margin. But not with an '06 F-250 SRW with 6.0PSD and 3.73 rear end.

I am now winded and exhausted reliving all this stuff, but you are at a great advantage from what happened to me. I didn't belong to the MOC and I believed and relied on the nice Sales people. They gave me coffee, water and a couple of free things and I gave them thousands of dollars in return. You are asking ahead of time (somewhat) and I hope you have learned enough to heed lots of advice. Just keep in mind, things fail under normal and compliant conditions, why take a higher risk with your 10 to 11 tons of fun while bounding and bouncing down the roadways being overweight.

Best of luck to you Louie. Please don't regret asking. We'd love to hear what you end up doing. Keep us posted.

[hickory]

Welcome to the forum, Louie. We pull a 2013 3400RL with a 2011 F- 350 SWR. Pulls well and stops well. We have not added a 2nd AC or W/D yet and don't plan to, but never say never. I don't think I'd be comfortable with a 3/4 ton,but many others are doing so. Be safe and happy travels!

[Narlywarrior]

quote:Originally posted by Art-n-Marge

Yup, Narlywarrior. Three more things that have been covered but I will emphasize.

First, the shipping weights are gonna be wrong and irrelevant. Even from right out of the factory, these Shipping weights are typically calculated on the BASE unit. Oftentimes they will not consider options that are installed after the BASE unit is put together. So added things like a fireplace, air conditioners, a washer/dryer are not weighed until the unit makes it out of the factory then the final sticker (different from the brochure) is stuck on. My 3500RL had a brochure weight of around 11,000 something, but when I bought the unit, the shipping weight was over 12,000 lbs because of all the extra stuff I got, leaving less than 2,000lbs from the sticker Gross weight of 14,040. Therefore, NEVER rely on shipping weight. ALWAYS refer to the Gross Weight, THEN hope you don't load up the trailer so much that the Gross is exceeded. What is the gross weight rating on the trailer's sticker? Then get to a scale to find out for sure!

The second thing is a proper truck even an SRW with these larger trailers. I was VERY fortunate to satisfy my weight ratings by upgrading my F-250 with the exact requirements to create an F-350, but it is not always this easy. But since I did not "recertify" the truck, I can only use it with the new ratings for personal use. The reason everyone says you'll need a bigger truck is to save you the anguish and research I went through as an example. Your truck and powerplant combination may not give you enough since it is the previous weaker generation truck even if you upgraded the rear end (and maybe the tires or wheels). If your goal is to be weight compliant, save yourself the grief and get a new capable truck and find out the real weight numbers.

The last thing to consider is THE PIN WEIGHT. The Pin weight is the portion of the trailer that is carried by the truck. This is where most trucks get in trouble. For a TT, it is well documented that the bumper pull weight is typically about 10% (or 12%) of the Gross trailer weight. For most fifth wheels you'll read that it can be from 15% (or now 18%) of the gross trailer weight. THEN, for residential fifth wheels this can be UP to 25%. Unlike other fifth wheels like car transporters, horse trailers, utility trailers, there is not as much stuff over the pin and the bulk of the weight is over the trailer's axles. A residential fifth wheel has a large overhang and most of the heavy storage is in the front of the axles which then is carried by the pin. Then add a generator, washer/dryer in a front bedroom configuration, and another A/C and this will add much more over the pin and on top of the truck's rear axle.

I am not a full-timer and my Monty has 19% to 20% of its gross weight on the pin (Wow, I was surprised it wasn't 15%). THIS is why I was overweight. I went by the shipping weight, calculated only 15% and thought I was good. I did sag and bought the air bags to correct the ride and sag. THEN I went to the scales and found I was overweight at the rear end and the gross weight of my F-250. Puzzled, and a lot more research I found out all the things you are now learning. Salesmen lie to make a sale! Some don't know it and I believed them exclusively. My rig weighs 13,500 lbs and I carry about 2,500 lb on the pin which an SRW can satisfy with all the other junk I carry in the truck (including me and passengers) and still have some margin. But not with an '06 F-250 SRW with 6.0PSD and 3.73 rear end.

I am now winded and exhausted reliving all this stuff, but you are at a great advantage from what happened to me. I didn't belong to the MOC and I believed and relied on the nice Sales people. They gave me coffee, water and a couple of free things and I gave them thousands of dollars in return. You are asking ahead of time (somewhat) and I hope you have learned enough to heed lots of advice. Just keep in mind, things fail under normal and compliant conditions, why take a higher risk with your 10 to 11 tons of fun while bounding and bouncing down the roadways being overweight.

Best of luck to you Louie. Please don't regret asking. We'd love to hear what you end up doing. Keep us posted.

Hi Art,

I am soooo thankful that the MOC exist. I am not jammed up and I have time to make the right choices. The only two factors now are that 1. I have my buddies 2007 Montana 3400RL its in a warehouse in missouri along with my truck.. He used it one time for three nights and it has been in storage since. There are many things I have learned that I want to do to it. For example. second A/C unit, washer/dryer combo. For now I also got two honda gensets with the deal.

With that said I do own a 2007 F-250 4x4 crew cab with 7.3. It has 35,000 a camber shell, carpeted bed liner, navigation/cd/dvd and converter and three of the largest train horns on the market and a 5 gallon air tank with compressor, roof rack with two of the biggest cargo pods yakima makes. I mean it's the envy of all my pals and is a sweet truck. But I would love to build a F-350 4x4 truck with the 6.7, aluminum flat bed, tool boxes all sides and up top. Crew cab and trick it out for 5th wheel and all towing needs.

I am in Alaska now and headed for texas in October and will start the reach for the suitable replacement then. I have been on line and would like to find a truck on a lot somewhere with no bed just the truck. I have pictures from my travels of the bed I want. I just need to find a truck. I welcome any and all suggestions and will cold call anyone anywhere at anytime if I can get a lead.

Thank you all for your help. I am having a big time learning all I ever wanted to know about this RV lifestyle.

Respectfully,

Louie