Go Back   Montana Owners Club - Keystone Montana 5th Wheel Forum > GENERAL DISCUSSIONS > Tow Vehicles & Towing
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 10-24-2019, 07:10 AM   #21
kjmcdowell77
Established Member
 
kjmcdowell77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Omaha
Posts: 47
M.O.C. #22739
Quote:
Originally Posted by mazboy View Post
Always have wife look as you move.

And yes I do a window when not listening to her

Oh well, that's life
I had my wife watching and asked her to make sure that I didn't hit the truck with the trailer. She misunderstood and was looking at the back bumper and the lower part of the coach. She really felt bad as it was her first time guiding me into a back in pad. We usually are lucky and get pull through spots but this time our regular park was almost full up and we had to settle for a back in. I think this is a lesson well learned and I'm reasonably certain it won't happen again. Fortunately my insurance policy only has a $50.00 deductible for glass breakage. Broke it Saturday afternoon and had it fixed by Monday. No harm no foul, but good experience for future reference.
__________________
Kelly McDowell
Omaha NE
2018 High Country 321MK
2017 Silverado 2500HD Duramax Diesel
kjmcdowell77 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2019, 09:57 AM   #22
Slow Hand
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Livermore
Posts: 214
M.O.C. #17391
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtlakejim View Post
And I may be wrong but I suspect that the long wheel base will have higher resale/trade in just like the dually. For certain the Crew Cab holds its value better. That might be a topic for another debate: which truck holds its value the best. I vote that it is most likely going to be the 1 ton long wheel base crew cab dually 4x4. That is certainly the most commonly used large 5th wheel towing truck hands down. Only seems logical that the most popular truck would have highest resale right?
As for resale on the trucks you describe i never see long bed dually's on dealer lots around They just don't sell here so resale may be difficult in some areas.
Slow Hand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2019, 10:05 AM   #23
Theunz
Montana Fan
 
Theunz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Catoosa
Posts: 472
M.O.C. #18384
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtlakejim View Post


And I may be wrong but I suspect that the long wheel base will have higher resale/trade in just like the dually. For certain the Crew Cab holds its value better. That might be a topic for another debate: which truck holds its value the best. I vote that it is most likely going to be the 1 ton long wheel base crew cab dually 4x4. That is certainly the most commonly used large 5th wheel towing truck hands down. Only seems logical that the most popular truck would have highest resale right?
Like powerholic, I too have never been to a campground where duallys outnumbered SRW trucks pulling 5th wheel trailers.

Here is the results of a survey conducted in 2018 on trucks sold in 2013 showing 5 year depreciation percentages. It was conducted by iSeeCars.com, and used results from 3.6 million sales. Any vechicles with outlier pricing were removed from survey results. It clearly shows 3/4 tons to have better resale values then 1 tons or 1/2 tons.

Chevrolet Silverado 2500, 29.5 percent
Toyota Tacoma, 29.5
GMC Sierra 2500, 30.6
Ram 2500, 33.7
Chevrolet Silverado 3500, 33.8
Ford Super Duty F-250, 34.3
Ram 3500, 34.3
Ford Super Duty F-350, 35.3
Toyota Tundra, 37.1
Honda Ridgeline, 37.2
Nissan Frontier, 37.8
Chevrolet Silverado 1500, 39.7
GMC Sierra 1500, 39.9
Ram 1500, 42.7
Ford F-150, 44.1
Nissan Titan, 44.7
__________________
2015 3100RL legacy...2005 Ford F-250 CC SB. Tows like a charm! 4/19 Updated to 2017 Chevy 3500 CC SB SRW -hope it tows as well as my F 250 did!
Theunz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2019, 07:32 PM   #24
beeje
Montana Master
 
beeje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 1,366
M.O.C. #17894
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slow Hand View Post
As for resale on the trucks you describe i never see long bed dually's on dealer lots around They just don't sell here so resale may be difficult in some areas.
To my knowledge GM has not made a short bed dually in quite some time.
__________________
2014 GMC 3500 Dually diesel 4x4 CCLB. Curt q24.
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes.
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS to be installed 6/2020
beeje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2019, 08:59 PM   #25
mtlakejim
Montana Master
 
mtlakejim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bee Branch
Posts: 2,258
M.O.C. #20693
Well I did say "I may be wrong".


But on the other hand if you only look at what is towing 35' or larger 5th wheels then I strongly suspect that 1 Ton long wheel base crew cabs are in fact in the majority. I know for a fact they are here in the Escapee park where I am at. There are about 15 large 5th wheels here and I think all those owners have 1 ton long wheel base crew cab duallies. And this is a park full of very experienced Full time RV owners. Aside from the fine folks on this forum, I don't think there is any group that I would trust more than the folks in this park for advice. They know what they are talking about and give good dependable advice based on real world experience.


Maybe my misunderstanding is that I assume that ALL Montana's are on the larger and heavier side? Are there any floorplans that are under 35' in the line up?


From my experience, it just seems like the vast majority of "Big Rig" owners (especially highly experienced full timers that travel a lot) almost exclusively own 1Ton long wheel base crew cab duallies. I am sure a good reason for that is you need the additional tow capacity that a dually offers with a trailer that heavy. Or maybe it is that most of the full timers tend to be early retirement folks with more disposable income. I'm not trying to be ugly with that comment it's just an observation.


But for absolute certain, the owners in the oilfield tend to pull with heavy trucks. We are just used to oversizing everything and absolutely aren't sissy about driving a heavy duty piece of equipment. Around SE New Mexico there are more RVs than you can shake a stick at and the big ones are nearly all towed by big duallies.
__________________
James & Irene Wilson
Bee Branch, AR.
2017 Ram 1 ton diesel duallyCrew Cab/Long Bed
2018 Montana High Country 381TH Garage Full of Toys
mtlakejim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2019, 10:30 PM   #26
Theunz
Montana Fan
 
Theunz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Catoosa
Posts: 472
M.O.C. #18384
Jim, I think the crux of the matter is that you are residing in a park that caters predominantly to long term residents. This type of park shouldn't really be called a RV park, but a trailer park (no disrespect intended) as its clientele are not using their trailers as "recreational" vechicles, but as mobile homes. Because of their intended usage these people are carrying much more weight in personal belongings and therefore need the added capacity of a dually. If you get back to the Corp and state parks you will see many more 35' or so 5th wheels pulled with SRW trucks and a lot of them will be 3/4 tons. Most of these campers are probably only carrying 1000 or 1500lbs of gear and are nowhere near their GVWR. Even on a two or three week trip I doubt if I exceed much over 2000lbs of gear which is only half of my trailers cargo carrying capacity. The fact is that full timers are a small percentage of RVers even though this form may be skewed more towards full timing. I will however agree with you that those with the larger fully loaded to capacity 5ers will benefit from the added payload of a dually. As far as resale, I suspect the reason duallys don't do as well as 3/4 tons is that most buyers of used trucks feel that the dually has been used harder tha a 3/4 ton.
__________________
2015 3100RL legacy...2005 Ford F-250 CC SB. Tows like a charm! 4/19 Updated to 2017 Chevy 3500 CC SB SRW -hope it tows as well as my F 250 did!
Theunz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2019, 07:25 PM   #27
beeje
Montana Master
 
beeje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 1,366
M.O.C. #17894
There is no way (besides weighing everything) to be certain how much weight we all carry along with us. But I suspect most if not all are WELL beyond 1000-15000lbs.

Think about that, we travel with full water 500lbs/several coolers of ice with beverages 200lbs?/tools 50lbs/firewood300lbs/chairs25lbs/grill25lbs/propane30lbs/clothes25lbs/fridge full of food75lbs etc.= 1230lbs, Just guessing.

Our unit weighs 12150 completely empty+1230=13380lbs loaded in this example.

I know for a fact we have been at our max of 15560lbs several times (I weighed it).

So lets say somewhere in the middle at 14500lbs x 20% pin weight=2900lbs.
That's well beyond ANY 2500 truck and some 3500 SRW trucks.
__________________
2014 GMC 3500 Dually diesel 4x4 CCLB. Curt q24.
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes.
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS to be installed 6/2020
beeje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2019, 08:21 PM   #28
dfb
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Gardnerville
Posts: 691
M.O.C. #17163
Took two years to find a ram 3500 long bed dually, auto level, 4:10 gears aisin auto.. lots of little kids trucks tho..you know, short beds with 60 inch tires jacked up to the stratosphere.. black rims, tinted windows!. What a waste...
dfb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2019, 08:23 PM   #29
dfb
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Gardnerville
Posts: 691
M.O.C. #17163
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slow Hand View Post
As for resale on the trucks you describe i never see long bed dually's on dealer lots around They just don't sell here so resale may be difficult in some areas.
Thats what we needed.. a long bed dually.. with the max ratings for towing, weight, torque, hp...
dfb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2019, 10:01 AM   #30
mtlakejim
Montana Master
 
mtlakejim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bee Branch
Posts: 2,258
M.O.C. #20693
[QUOTE=Theunz;1164195]Jim, I think the crux of the matter is that you are residing in a park that caters predominantly to long term residents. This type of park shouldn't really be called a RV park, but a trailer park (no disrespect intended) as its clientele are not using their trailers as "recreational" vechicles, but as mobile homes. Because of their intended usage these people are carrying much more weight in personal belongings and therefore need the added capacity of a dually. If you get back to the Corp and state parks you will see many more 35' or so 5th wheels pulled with SRW trucks and a lot of them will be 3/4 tons. Most of these campers are probably only carrying 1000 or 1500lbs of gear and are nowhere near their GVWR. Even on a two or three week trip I doubt if I exceed much over 2000lbs of gear which is only half of my trailers cargo carrying capacity. The fact is that full timers are a small percentage of RVers even though this form may be skewed more towards full timing. I will however agree with you that those with the larger fully loaded to capacity 5ers will benefit from the added payload of a dually. As far as resale, I suspect the reason duallys don't do as well as 3/4 tons is that most buyers of used trucks feel that the dually has been used harder tha a 3/4 ton.[/QUOT

Your somewhat correct, this is a retirement park and about a third of the folks here will never move their trailer. However it tends to be the folks that do move around on occasion that have the duallies. And nearly all of them have very large trailers. Some of the folks here even have two trailers. One will be the larger one that they leave here full time and the other will be a much smaller one that they take short trips with. We have even considered getting a slide in for our 1 ton so we could tow the 24' enclosed trailer behind it.

"Trailer Park" does have a negative connotation. I think "Snow Bird Park" might be a more accurate description as many of these retirees are using this park as a wintering location. It is an Escapee park. Most of the folks here a very well off with very nice and expensive rigs. It should be noted there are at least 6 Montana's in the park and several Class A diesels.

However, my commentary on this forum are biased as I think of the Montana line as being high end LONG and HEAVY trailers.

So again I ask, are there many Montana's that are less than 35'?
__________________
James & Irene Wilson
Bee Branch, AR.
2017 Ram 1 ton diesel duallyCrew Cab/Long Bed
2018 Montana High Country 381TH Garage Full of Toys
mtlakejim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2019, 10:03 AM   #31
jsb5717
Montana Fan
 
jsb5717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 322
M.O.C. #23668
It does seem that "popularity" of style is regional. Around here there are a lot of SRW short beds. That what I prefer and have. However, there are quite a few long beds and duallys available as well.

The selection of duallys is much larger for the person willing to travel to where they are popular. Texas comes to mind. Also, places with large retirement communities in the southern states where all kinds of trucks migrate.
__________________

Jeff & Sandi (and Teddy - 7lb Schnorkie)
2018 Montana HC 305RL / Andersen Ultimate Hitch on B&W Ball
2012 RAM 3500 Big Horn Crew Cab 4x4 SRW / AMP Power Running Boards
jsb5717 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2019, 10:08 AM   #32
jsb5717
Montana Fan
 
jsb5717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 322
M.O.C. #23668
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtlakejim View Post
So again I ask, are there many Montana's that are less than 35'?
Not many. Mine is right at it. The latest HC model is just under. We picked the model we have specifically so I wouldn't need a dually...just didn't want one. I told the wife that our 5er choice was going to be limited by the truck I prefered as a daily driver. Fortunately, that worked.

I'm pretty sure if she had found a larger 5er that we "just had to have" that I'd be driving a dually
__________________

Jeff & Sandi (and Teddy - 7lb Schnorkie)
2018 Montana HC 305RL / Andersen Ultimate Hitch on B&W Ball
2012 RAM 3500 Big Horn Crew Cab 4x4 SRW / AMP Power Running Boards
jsb5717 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2019, 10:24 AM   #33
mtlakejim
Montana Master
 
mtlakejim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bee Branch
Posts: 2,258
M.O.C. #20693
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsb5717 View Post
Not many. Mine is right at it. The latest HC model is just under. We picked the model we have specifically so I wouldn't need a dually...just didn't want one. I told the wife that our 5er choice was going to be limited by the truck I prefered as a daily driver. Fortunately, that worked.

I'm pretty sure if she had found a larger 5er that we "just had to have" that I'd be driving a dually
I respect anyone who recognizes that you have to match the trailer to the truck! Unlike a lot of SRW owners you do recognize the limitations of same and were willing to make the compromise that required.

I just wish there weren't so many SRW folks out there that RECOMMEND same to folks with no experience. Particularly if the new folks are looking at a larger trailer! When we are handing out advice we should try to do so erring on the side of safety.
__________________
James & Irene Wilson
Bee Branch, AR.
2017 Ram 1 ton diesel duallyCrew Cab/Long Bed
2018 Montana High Country 381TH Garage Full of Toys
mtlakejim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2019, 11:24 AM   #34
jsb5717
Montana Fan
 
jsb5717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 322
M.O.C. #23668
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtlakejim View Post
I respect anyone who recognizes that you have to match the trailer to the truck! Unlike a lot of SRW owners you do recognize the limitations of same and were willing to make the compromise that required.

I just wish there weren't so many SRW folks out there that RECOMMEND same to folks with no experience. Particularly if the new folks are looking at a larger trailer! When we are handing out advice we should try to do so erring on the side of safety.
To quote Clint Eastwood "A man's got to know his limitations".

Yep, either match the truck to the trailer, or the trailer to the truck. Sadly, rookies don't always understand that one should always determine the other. I think RV dealers try to bring some help here...at least ours did. Truck dealers...not so much.

I do appreciate the first timers who come to a forum like this to ask the question before they have made the purchase.
__________________

Jeff & Sandi (and Teddy - 7lb Schnorkie)
2018 Montana HC 305RL / Andersen Ultimate Hitch on B&W Ball
2012 RAM 3500 Big Horn Crew Cab 4x4 SRW / AMP Power Running Boards
jsb5717 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2019, 07:15 PM   #35
beeje
Montana Master
 
beeje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 1,366
M.O.C. #17894
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtlakejim View Post
I respect anyone who recognizes that you have to match the trailer to the truck! Unlike a lot of SRW owners you do recognize the limitations of same and were willing to make the compromise that required.

I just wish there weren't so many SRW folks out there that RECOMMEND same to folks with no experience. Particularly if the new folks are looking at a larger trailer! When we are handing out advice we should try to do so erring on the side of safety.
Wishful thinking, Apparently most are more concerned with the ability of being able to park in their garage/going through a drive through/parking close to the store entrance/going through a car wash. Etc. instead of paying attention to what they should be paying attention to, which are weight ratings in many forms.
__________________
2014 GMC 3500 Dually diesel 4x4 CCLB. Curt q24.
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes.
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS to be installed 6/2020
beeje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2019, 11:29 AM   #36
JABURKHOLDER
Montana Fan
 
JABURKHOLDER's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Cuyahoga Falls
Posts: 491
M.O.C. #18572
Ok, I really had to stop and think about posting a comment.

Will what I have to say provide any added value ?

Will what I have to say send us down a rabbit hole ?

Do we truly need another debate about trucks ?

I gotta do it:

This is the first truck thread I've seen in quite awhile that hasn't gone completely off the rails.



P.S. If anyone read my thread "What's The Point", this puts me one more post closer to "Montana Master" HAHA
__________________
ATC/NAC Jerry A. Burkholder, USN (RET.)

Rule #1. The Chief is always right.
Rule #2. When in doubt, refer to rule #1.
JABURKHOLDER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2019, 12:30 PM   #37
PeteandJoan
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Round Rock
Posts: 359
M.O.C. #17905
Quote:
Originally Posted by JABURKHOLDER View Post
Ok, I really had to stop and think about posting a comment.

Will what I have to say provide any added value ?

Will what I have to say send us down a rabbit hole ?

Do we truly need another debate about trucks ?

I gotta do it:

This is the first truck thread I've seen in quite awhile that hasn't gone completely off the rails.



P.S. If anyone read my thread "What's The Point", this puts me one more post closer to "Montana Master" HAHA
I'm just here for the great info, not a "title".. and the occasional debates so I can get out the popcorn! haha
__________________
Pete & Joan & "Honey" fur-baby.
2015 Montana 3611RL 2012 F350 6.7 DRW Lariat
Disc Brakes & Sailun 14 ply S637
6-pt Hydraulic leveling
PeteandJoan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2019, 02:31 PM   #38
Keith and Pat
Established Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Maitland
Posts: 22
M.O.C. #22492
We have an F350 long bed SuperCab. Just my wife and I, so all the room that we need in the cab. Plus, it's 14 " shorter than a crew cab, much easier to park.
Keith and Pat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2019, 02:32 PM   #39
Cushing872
Established Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: New Baltimore
Posts: 15
M.O.C. #24837
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjmcdowell77 View Post
We have a 2018 Montana 321MK and have been enjoying it a great deal. However, it is a crew cab std bed and I think you probably know what's coming. We were backing into our slot and I got just a little too close to the cab with the nose of my coach.

The next thing I heard was the sound of breaking glass as the front of the 5er came though the back window. I should have been paying more attention and will certainly do so the next time. I think my next truck will be a double cab 8' bed to eliminate the problem. For the time being, this "college" course on backing up cost me about $1000.00 tuition.

Lesson learned.
For this reason is why I own a Pullrite Superglide Hitch with my 2011 F250. A capture plate goes on your pinbox and as you turn the Superglide automatically travels back about 14 allowing you to 90 degree turn. No getting out to switch levers or no worrying. Worth every penny.
Cushing872 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2019, 02:53 PM   #40
Mark N.
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Ogden
Posts: 628
M.O.C. #13862
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjmcdowell77 View Post
We have a 2018 Montana 321MK and have been enjoying it a great deal. However, it is a crew cab std bed and I think you probably know what's coming. We were backing into our slot and I got just a little too close to the cab with the nose of my coach.

The next thing I heard was the sound of breaking glass as the front of the 5er came though the back window. I should have been paying more attention and will certainly do so the next time. I think my next truck will be a double cab 8' bed to eliminate the problem. For the time being, this "college" course on backing up cost me about $1000.00 tuition.

Lesson learned.
Sorry
to hear about the rear window. I agonized over the bed-length decision 6 years ago with my 3400RL. Because of several reasons (Biggest of which was I hate the looks of the long-beds) I chose a Ram 3500 diesel short-bed. I'm now on my second 5er since then and I've never once been sorry I chose the short bed. The link between the trailer and truck is an Andersen Ultimate hitch.
Mark N. is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Montana RV, Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:25 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×