Structural Issue?

[Wally Dad]

I noticed today that the right sidewall is separating when we hitch up. When we loaner the landing gear, the sidewalk reseats and the aluminum skirt beneath it buckles slightly. We also have a seam in the bedroom floor that runs sideways along the point the bed slide travels. I’ve attached some pics.

We are in WY on our way to Colorado Springs for a month. I hope to get it into a local dealer then. Has anyone experienced this? Any advice?

[mazboy]

call me. you have frame flex. I hope this is still a new trailer. message me your phone number.
I've gone through 3 montanas with this issue.

[richfaa]

You MAY have frame flex there is also a issue were the sidewall separates from the aluminum framing it is attached to. It looks like frame flex but the frame is not broken. You need to call the service center and describe the problem. We have had Both issues on our two Montanas.

[Wally Dad]

Originally Posted by richfaa

You MAY have frame flex there is also a issue were the sidewall separates from the aluminum framing it is attached to. It looks like frame flex but the frame is not broken. You need to call the service center and describe the problem. We have had Both issues on our two Montanas.

Thank you. Since we are on the road, I'm not near my dealer. Hopefully I can get someone in Col. Springs to look at it. Are you suggesting that I call the Keystone office in Indiana?

Thanks.

[mazboy]

ken, again, call me. i messaged you.

[richfaa]

Originally Posted by Wally Dad

Thank you. Since we are on the road, I'm not near my dealer. Hopefully I can get someone in Col. Springs to look at it. Are you suggesting that I call the Keystone office in Indiana?

Thanks.

Yes I am.They may give you some support. No matter the issue it will be a issue that may be beyond the ability of a dealer to address. I really doubt if the average dealer will be able to tell which problem it is without removing the front cap..You do need to know which problem you have as frame flex as in a broken frame in the overhang can be very serious.

[rohrmann]

We had what appears to be the same thing you show in the photo. We had a broken frame, visible looking forward in the drivers side propane compartment. The rectangular steel beam that goes across from one side to the other was broken where it was welded to the vertical frame that goes down to the main frame. We were lucky to have found a mobile RV tech that was also a welder. He was able to complete repairs in about six hours while we were at a park. The place where the arrow is pointing was the only weld attaching the large gusset to the broken beam, and the place that is circled is where that beam broke all the way through. We had to drop the Filon from the from of that exterior wall all the way from the pin box. We also had to remove a section of the thin plywood from the front of the broken beam so he could weld there also. He could not weld the top of the beam because the bedroom floor is right above it. He welded both sides of the gusset, the bottom and both sides of the beam. He also cut a couple of gussets from 1/4" plate and added them to the large gusset connecting to the beam. While the Filon was down, we also removed the pin box, and he found numerous spots where the welds had cracks, allowing the pin box to flex up. He spent quite a bit of time grinding and then welding those up too. Good luck on getting your rig repaired.

[Ram Montana High Country]

Originally Posted by Wally Dad

Thank you. Since we are on the road, I'm not near my dealer. Hopefully I can get someone in Col. Springs to look at it. Are you suggesting that I call the Keystone office in Indiana?

Thanks.

Really - Call Ken - it could get worse in a jiffy or just hang around, an ounce of prevention is called for

[BandBmalin]

What causes this flexing and breaking? Should I upgrade my pin box to some sort of an air ride like flex air to help cushion the ride some? Are fifth wheels more delicate than I thought (This is our first)? Is this something that shows up during your first few times towing or after 3, 5, 8+ years?? After reading this thread, I'm getting a bit concerned now.

[mlh]

I think you should upgrade to an air ride pin box. That would put less stress on the frame.
You may have broken welds in the front frame. I’d watch it while you hook and unhook your camper. How much movement are you getting? Is it getting worse staying the same? If it is worse take the plastic off of the bottom of the front and see what the problem is. If it’s bad get to a welder and get it fixed.
Lynwood

[Wally Dad]

Originally Posted by Ram Montana High Country

Really - Call Ken - it could get worse in a jiffy or just hang around, an ounce of prevention is called for

Ok, so can you be a little more clear? Who should I call? Keystone customer support in Indiana? Thanks

[Ram Montana High Country]

Originally Posted by Wally Dad

Ok, so can you be a little more clear? Who should I call? Keystone customer support in Indiana? Thanks

Ken, I think, sent you a PM - do you know how to open a PM? Top of the page.

fifth wheels are not necessarily delicate - companies doing assembly work are generally not robots - so human error can creep in.

Upgrade ??? do a little research and make an informed decision - I did it for added insurance and my neighbor did when he bought his first - who is a "PE", so extra research is done before acting … unfortunately when we BUY THE FIRST, too much faith is usually give to the dealer to steer us in the right direction.

Some say they tow better - I like the way mine tows but then again, NOT pulled any others.

It would be great if we could try different hitches, king pins, etc before pulling the trigger … not to happen.

As to your current situation - take some time to talk to folks that have the same issue - they may have some short cuts or help to making a good decision. I'm guessing, you under warranty yet - Montana or Lippert might be able to have someone close to your location come fix the issue as mentioned above - a few phone calls can go a long way.

Hope that helps

[prndl]

From reading your OP is sounds like the movement happens when you hook up and when you use the landing gear. Your picture shows some significant movement. I would be concerned. Do as Ram Montana High Country says and call. To continue to tow with that amount of movement will do more damage and could possibly be an accident looking for a place to happen.

[Mudchief]

When hooked up to the truck if the gap shows and when you put the legs down it goes away. Then is mostly lack not a frame flex. It is mostly like richfaa states above it is the side wall separates from the aluminum. This is a common problem and Keystone knows how to fix it.

[BiggarView]

Wally Dad, could you provide us with year and model of your trailer? It might be helpful to know if this is a new issue or a known issue with some older model years. There could be other factors, like how you are loading your trailer, the conditions you are towing it under, even the tow vehicle and hitch could be the root cause among others that could contribute to a possible failure rather than a structural defect or manufacturing defect. As for getting a air ride pinbox or hitch... those can be worthwhile changes once the condition itself has been addressed.

[Wally Dad]

Originally Posted by BiggarView

Wally Dad, could you provide us with year and model of your trailer?

We have a 2018 3950BR. We tow with an F350 dually and use a B&W Companion hitch. We've traveled about 16,000 miles over the last 1.5 years - so our structural warranty should still be valid. I have used CAT scales several times and we have always been below the maximum and at an appropriate pin weight.

Does that help?

Ken

[Wally Dad]

Originally Posted by mazboy

call me. you have frame flex. I hope this is still a new trailer. message me your phone number.
I've gone through 3 montanas with this issue.

I responded to your PM and included my number. Our trailer was purchased in January 2018, so it is still under the 3-year structural warranty.

[BiggarView]

It could be model specific. I see Keystone discontinued the 3950BR.... could it have been model issues? or low sales. Sounds like you have a structural or Mfr defect based your details.

[richfaa]

Frame flex, that is a failure in a weld in the front structure was a big issue prior to 2005. In 2005 `they added some gussets in a attempt to solve that problem. We saw the added gussets in the 2005 models on the assembly line prior to the purchase of our 06 3400.It helped but did not end the frame flex problem. There are a lot of other things that can break the frame in that area.

[mlh]

Like Rich said. This isn’t model specific it’s Lippert specific. Then we have personal pulling cars and boats and who knows what else with their campers when the frames are barely strong enough to support the camper.
Lynwood