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Old 05-24-2018, 09:33 AM   #1
dfb
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Looked at New Montanas

Looks like New Montanas are better. Tires are Sailun 16 ply. Roof looks like one piece with better material. Bathroom cabinet no longer sits over the sink. Refridgerator doors designed so as not to hit counter or sides causing dents. Carpet removed from steps. Exterior step s one piece aluminum that lifts up to door. Cieling fan placed so slides dont hit. For the price however, a full rear cap should be standard. Cables on some slides still used..
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Old 05-24-2018, 11:48 AM   #2
jeffba
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Ha we did same thing yesterday.
We looked at 3791RD, 3721RL, 3811MS, 3934FB and 3701LK

All were easy to to dump. Granted teh 3701LK needs a sewer system because of teh rear kitchen.
DW loved the half bath. Didn't like having the kitchen pushed into living room to make room for it.
Same issue with master suite.

3701lk is nice, but the way we travel having to open 2 slides to get to refer may override all that counter space.

3791RD and 3721RL were the favorites.


Quality:
Sailun tires on all of 5 we looked at.
MORryde steps , next gen. piston lift assist. One can raise them with their pinky. (I tried it)
One had a dented refer--transit issue no doubt.
One I open cabinets and it came unhinged sending screws flying.
Another had large water stain on floor from leaking slide.
Salesperson knew what I was talking about when I said "Oh this one does not have a head banger cabinet."

Learned, do not leave DW alone with sales. I did and came into a conversation on moving WD/dryer from ours into a new one.

If we dinged a floor plan you love, please do not take it personally. These just reflect our personal preferences.
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Old 05-24-2018, 01:55 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffba View Post
Ha we did same thing yesterday.
We looked at 3791RD, 3721RL, 3811MS, 3934FB and 3701LK

All were easy to to dump. Granted teh 3701LK needs a sewer system because of teh rear kitchen.
DW loved the half bath. Didn't like having the kitchen pushed into living room to make room for it.
Same issue with master suite.

3701lk is nice, but the way we travel having to open 2 slides to get to refer may override all that counter space.

3791RD and 3721RL were the favorites.


We love our 3791. I can't recall if the 3721 was one we considered, but one of the difference makers was the huge slide out tray on the 3791 RD that the other one did not have.

Quality:
Sailun tires on all of 5 we looked at.
MORryde steps , next gen. piston lift assist. One can raise them with their pinky. (I tried it)
One had a dented refer--transit issue no doubt.
One I open cabinets and it came unhinged sending screws flying.
Another had large water stain on floor from leaking slide.
Salesperson knew what I was talking about when I said "Oh this one does not have a head banger cabinet."

Learned, do not leave DW alone with sales. I did and came into a conversation on moving WD/dryer from ours into a new one.

If we dinged a floor plan you love, please do not take it personally. These just reflect our personal preferences.

We love our 3791. I can't recall if the 3721 was one we considered, but one of the difference makers was the huge slide out tray on the 3791 RD that the other one did not have.
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Old 05-24-2018, 02:03 PM   #4
rollingdownthehighway
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We have the 3700LK and love it, though I agree the rear kitchen sewer connection can be tricky, better have enough hose. We haven't traveled to far with to try and access the kitchen, but accessing the bathroom while rolling is very nice and convenient. We to looked at several floorplans and other models, and the 3700LK had that "this is the one" moment when we walked into it.
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Old 05-24-2018, 03:06 PM   #5
dfb
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Wife loved the model with the dining in front and bedroom in rear. Also the new rear kitchen mod
.
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Old 05-24-2018, 04:03 PM   #6
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Too funny! But true! My wife is the dealers best friend! She always takes the dealer’s side in negotiations...lol
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Old 05-24-2018, 05:01 PM   #7
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We also like the improvements made on the new Montanas..so much so that we are working towards a new 3730fl Legacy ... "a want not a need" as our 3750fl has been wonderful to us and will make the next owner happy too.
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Old 05-24-2018, 05:21 PM   #8
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We bought the legacy...
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Old 05-24-2018, 08:53 PM   #9
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2018.5 3811ms Legacy here and loving it.!!!!
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Old 05-24-2018, 10:56 PM   #10
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Glad to hear they are addressing some of the quality issues!! No doubt, having a lot of angry owners over their china bomb OEM tires of the past has finally got their attention and with the relatively low cost of Saliuns they probably figured good idea to make the change before someone sued the heck out of them after a serious accident!!!


More than likely same thing with the steps. They are probably being proactive trying to avoid a major lawsuit related to someone getting hurt on poor quality steps!!!


I doubt they are intentionally trying to improve the QUALITY of their coaches. It is much more likely that they are trying to reduce their product LIABILITY exposure. Major corporations are very sensitive to being sued but very slow to respond to customer complaints or recommendations.........
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Old 05-25-2018, 07:36 AM   #11
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Jim and Irene, your last statements couldn’t be further from the truth. The folks at Keystone have listened to the owners and improved their units every year. They follow the forum, know the issues and try to find cost effective methods to address them. I probably won’t change your mind, but I can say, especially after spending three days with them this week, they are as committed as ever to continually upgrading their units. They know their customers well and sometimes we won’t pay more for their unit, even if it’s for our own safety. For some of our members, another brand sitting next to a Montana that’s $200 less because of the Tires will result in a lost sale. They always offered G614s as an option. Years ago they updated the wheels so you could make the change without having to buy new wheels as well. Go back and look at a 2005 unit (we had one) to see how many changes they have made. (By the way, ours had Goodyear Marathons that we’re good, made in the U. S.) And many improvements are a result of the MOC. Sorry about the long post, but the head of Montana personally sat with us to ask our opinions when the 3160 was still on the drawing board. Find that with another brand. We as owners want everything for the lowest possible price. They try to give us as much for our money as they can while hitting the target market for Montana’s. Join us at the Rally in September and see if your opinion changes.
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Old 05-25-2018, 10:18 AM   #12
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Rames 14.. im the kind of buyer that says if i need to spend more to have tires that are more reliable, or a roof that is better, carpet that wears better then I say do it. Spending 300 more on better tires to reduce the chances of causing an accident, or thousands in damages to the rv is worth it. I have learned a long time ago that spnding less IS MORE EXPENSIVE. On spending 90,000 dollars 200 will not cost a sale. But a bad reputation due to cutting corners can cost many more sales. Id love to see aluminum roofs and siding again. Aluminum roofs dont get torn, and aluminum siding is easier to repair and much easier to keep looking new. Im my opinion..
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Old 05-25-2018, 01:08 PM   #13
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Not if you get hit with a bad hailstorm. We had 9300 damage to a 28 ft bumper pull
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Old 05-25-2018, 01:31 PM   #14
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Wow! That stinks!
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Old 05-25-2018, 02:50 PM   #15
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Jim and Irene, your last statements couldnít be further from the truth. The folks at Keystone have listened to the owners and improved their units every year. They follow the forum, know the issues and try to find cost effective methods to address them. I probably wonít change your mind, but I can say, especially after spending three days with them this week, they are as committed as ever to continually upgrading their units. They know their customers well and sometimes we wonít pay more for their unit, even if itís for our own safety. For some of our members, another brand sitting next to a Montana thatís $200 less because of the Tires will result in a lost sale. They always offered G614s as an option. Years ago they updated the wheels so you could make the change without having to buy new wheels as well. Go back and look at a 2005 unit (we had one) to see how many changes they have made. (By the way, ours had Goodyear Marathons that weíre good, made in the U. S.) And many improvements are a result of the MOC. Sorry about the long post, but the head of Montana personally sat with us to ask our opinions when the 3160 was still on the drawing board. Find that with another brand. We as owners want everything for the lowest possible price. They try to give us as much for our money as they can while hitting the target market for Montanaís. Join us at the Rally in September and see if your opinion changes.
I havenít had the same experience with Keystone as you. They have acted EXACTLY as I would expect a big monolithic company to act any time I did attempt to get in touch with them!

I will say this much, knowing what I know now (a lot of it learned right here from the good people of MOC) if I purchase another Keystone there are several upgrades I will make as part of the deal upfront!! Saluin tires, disc brakes, independent suspension, flex king pin and Moyrride steps for sure!! I wonít buy another unit without those!! Because I still work it is highly unlikely I can make the rally. So if you will be so kind as to pass along my request that they offer an HC 381TH floorplan with Montana level trim and offer a safety and ride upgrade that includes the above listed items I would appreciate it. Sure would be nice to not have to pay for those upgrades out of pocket!!!
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Old 05-25-2018, 02:56 PM   #16
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I suspect that most RV buyers wouldn't know the difference between a Sailun tire and sailing in a boat. I bet the percentage of RV buyers who regularly read the forums is pretty small. They just think a more expensive RV is better, and in most cases it is. If most see a tire with a famous name vs. a name they never heard of they are going to think the one they are familiar with is superior. Just like most autos, RV's are built to a price point that marketing has determined will attract the most buyers. As far as the stairs go, while I can see their advantages to full timers or long timers I personally have no problem with the convential stairs, and in fact, due to storage conditions prefer them.
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Old 05-25-2018, 02:58 PM   #17
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I’m with dfb. $200 on a deal isn’t going to make or break. Floor plan was everything to us!!! 200 over the life of a note is insignificant!

Having said that they could still lowball compete by offering an upgrade “package” that would please experienced buyers!!
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Old 05-25-2018, 03:08 PM   #18
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I suspect that most RV buyers wouldn't know the difference between a Sailun tire and sailing in a boat. I bet the percentage of RV buyers who regularly read the forums is pretty small. They just think a more expensive RV is better, and in most cases it is. If most see a tire with a famous name vs. a name they never heard of they are going to think the one they are familiar with is superior. Just like most autos, RV's are built to a price point that marketing has determined will attract the most buyers. As far as the stairs go, while I can see their advantages to full timers or long timers I personally have no problem with the convential stairs, and in fact, due to storage conditions prefer them.
Actually I agree with you on all but the stairs (our OEM folders are junk) but we have 20 acres to store ours on and will be building our own plenty wide storage (as a direct result of hearing about the issue from folks like you so THANK YOU for pointing the issue out).

I agree most folks wonít know better. I was one of them even though I had a 5th wheel Keystone already. Lesson now learned and thanks to MOC much better informed!! But based on this my recommendation is valid that they could offer a safety and ride upgrade package. That way they hit both the lowball and the experienced buyers without any floor plan changes!! That means increased market share!!!
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Old 05-25-2018, 04:03 PM   #19
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Rames 14.. im the kind of buyer that says if i need to spend more to have tires that are more reliable, or a roof that is better, carpet that wears better then I say do it. Spending 300 more on better tires to reduce the chances of causing an accident, or thousands in damages to the rv is worth it. I have learned a long time ago that spnding less IS MORE EXPENSIVE. On spending 90,000 dollars 200 will not cost a sale. But a bad reputation due to cutting corners can cost many more sales. Id love to see aluminum roofs and siding again. Aluminum roofs dont get torn, and aluminum siding is easier to repair and much easier to keep looking new. Im my opinion..
DFB,

I have no interest in old school aluminum. Most of us are able to buy a Montana for a lot less than $90K.
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Old 05-25-2018, 05:24 PM   #20
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DFB,

I have no interest in old school aluminum. Most of us are able to buy a Montana for a lot less than $90K.
Already after 3 years the gelcoat on the sun side is fading. I use a cyclo polisher. Not fun.. Gelcoat personally is heavier than aluminum. It fades. Im just jeleous of the guy who still has aluminum. Even after 15 years with a good washing they stiil look great. There is no replacement for an aluminum roof. They sticker at 92 for mine.. paid around 64 otd..still alot of money. If i could find one fifth wheel with our features in aluminum id buy it.. or even an
airstream fifth wheel.
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