Question about Chips, Programs, etal

[Glenn and Lorraine]

The big three, GM, Ford and Dodge have been in heavy competition for years and years. Each one wants to have the biggest, baddest truck available. One of the biggest battles is having the engine with the most horse power, torque, etc. Each of them has designed power trains that their engineers feel is the biggest and baddest bar none and you know as they come from the factory these engineers are right on the money.

My question is this.....
WHY on God's Green Earth would we believe some lesser experienced, lesser paid, couldn't get a job at any of the Big 3 engineer when he says he's got the Magic Potion (chip or program) to beef up our diesels??? If this Magic Potion was all it's cracked up to be DON"T you think all of the Big 3 would have already installed it in their trucks???? If not as standard equipment but rather a high end option?
AND why is it that none of these Magic Potion vendors will carry any part of the power train warranty that the Big 3 will void if you add this Magic Potion to your TV???

Just something to think about.

[Delaine and Lindy]

Glenn I agree 100%, I just don't understand why anyone driving a GM Truck with the Duramax/Allison would need anymore Hp or Torq. I haven't owned the other two brands of Trucks but from the spec I believe they also don't need a gadget to give them more Hp or Torq. If you blow a $15,000 dollar engine just for using a $500.00 + or - add on that will cause you to loose your warranty. Just remember you have a Black Box someplace that will tell on you, and GM will know if your using those Gadgets. But you read everyday about someone using those add ons. Oh well its whatever a person wants I guess, but they have more money that I do. Also thats the biggest reason I want buy a used Diesel Truck, you never know this day and time what has been plugged into those Trucks... GBY.....

[Delaine and Lindy]

And I know I read someplace that GM is now checking to see what your running or if you have a tuner. There are several Truck owners GM types that are removing the DPF system and say some of the tuners will delete the DPF from the computers. They then bypass or remove the DPF. I do remember there was a huge fine for removing the Catlatic converters when they first came out. So if you do buy a used 2007.5 GM or newer look under the Truck and make sure the DPF is there. GBY...

[H. John Kohl]

quote:Originally posted by Glenn and Lorraine

The big three, GM, Ford and Dodge have been in heavy competition for years and years. Each one wants to have the biggest, baddest truck available. One of the biggest battles is having the engine with the most horse power, torque, etc. Each of them has designed power trains that their engineers feel is the biggest and baddest bar none and you know as they come from the factory these engineers are right on the money.

My question is this.....
WHY on God's Green Earth would we believe some lesser experienced, lesser paid, couldn't get a job at any of the Big 3 engineer when he says he's got the Magic Potion (chip or program) to beef up our diesels??? If this Magic Potion was all it's cracked up to be DON"T you think all of the Big 3 would have already installed it in their trucks???? If not as standard equipment but rather a high end option?
AND why is it that none of these Magic Potion vendors will carry any part of the power train warranty that the Big 3 will void if you add this Magic Potion to your TV???

Just something to think about.

During a 4:30 Am fuel up on the way to work I chatted with a CUMMINS service tech. I asked him about Banks additions. His comment was, "The boss says if Gale Banks designed it we will back our warranty if Banks equipment is on the engine. Gale Banks is the engineering expert when it comes to diesel performance."
Banks Power claims they will fight for warranty support if their equipment is on the truck. Yes that was a tech's statement but interesting.

Why does the big three claim they will not support. My opinion is they design there trucks with an over engineering factor to ensure it lasts the three year or what ever the warranty is for their truck. An example. My 03 3500 has 3.73 rear gears and pulling specs say CGVW is 2100. If it had 4.10 gears it is rated at 2300. This is pulling. They do not change anything for braking or any other supension. So where is the protection?
I claim in their warranty.

If you don't want to do things to your truck fine. Just let those that do, do their homework and pay as may.

That is my opinion.

[racerjoe]

My son works at a large ford dealership. if they get a diesel in with a bad motor, they will pull a head off to inspect the piston top. If they find a certain pattern from the injector spray imbedded into the top of the piston, they know it was chipped and turned up to max. Which will void the warranty. if you use an adjustable style setup,make sure you don't run it on the highest set point. it may run like a jet,but not for long. There are a lot of good inprovement systems out there ie: Gale banks, etc, but the owner has the last say in how much power they want to have and how big their checkbook is if they make the wrong move.

[richfaa]

When the Ford Dealer saw my guage on the dash they asked if I had a chip /programmer installed I said no and told them that it was a pre turbo EGT guage and monitored everything at the diag port. They told me that one can not hide the fact the motor is chipped sort of like deleting a file on your P.C it is not really deleted you just can't see it and with the proper software and knowledge you can bring it back.. I agree with the initial post ..we will never chip..however they do what they are advertised to do and the older motors may need them to bring them up to todays spec's. we also can confirm John's conversation with a Cummings rep . At a emission seminar we attended,School busses use a lot of cummins motors,was asked the question about warranty and Banks equipment in that they would honor any warranty as long as the failure was not caused by negligence. It is of course a personal choice..my personal choice is no add ones.

[SlickWillie]

quote:Originally posted by Glenn and Lorraine

The big three, GM, Ford and Dodge have been in heavy competition for years and years. Each one wants to have the biggest, baddest truck available. One of the biggest battles is having the engine with the most horse power, torque, etc. Each of them has designed power trains that their engineers feel is the biggest and baddest bar none and you know as they come from the factory these engineers are right on the money.

My question is this.....
WHY on God's Green Earth would we believe some lesser experienced, lesser paid, couldn't get a job at any of the Big 3 engineer when he says he's got the Magic Potion (chip or program) to beef up our diesels??? If this Magic Potion was all it's cracked up to be DON"T you think all of the Big 3 would have already installed it in their trucks???? If not as standard equipment but rather a high end option?
AND why is it that none of these Magic Potion vendors will carry any part of the power train warranty that the Big 3 will void if you add this Magic Potion to your TV???

Just something to think about.

I'm not going to dwell on the tuners, we have already disagreed on that one. But, this is big business. I'm not too sure the Big 3 would pay more than these guys make. If I recall correctly, at least one of these tuner manufacturers has a former GM engineer on staff. There are many different brands out there and many folks will go through several before deciding on one particular brand. Not sure what the latest craze is now, perhaps EFI Live. I don't need one, and I've been too busy fishing and crabbing to keep up with the diesel forums.

[PowellsMonty]

I know for a fact that Ford will not warrant anything chipped.

[SlickWillie]

quote:Originally posted by PowellsMonty

I know for a fact that Ford will not warrant anything chipped.

Yes, and they will try to BS you into thinking they know a programmer was on one too.

[Glenn and Lorraine]

quote:Originally posted by SlickWillie

Yes, and they will try to BS you into thinking they know a programmer was on one too.

And they will be 100% correct. You cannot hide what you have done. You cannot delete what is already in the computer just as you cannot fully delete anything from your own personal computer. Sure YOU can hit DELETE and you will no longer see it or find it but it will be there forever. I am far from a computer geek but I know that deletion only means the average user thinks it is gone but a geek knows better and can retrieve it if so inclined. I have seen it done when I lost an entire website I was building. I had already spent over a week on it when I accidently hit delete. I was beside my self but a geeky friend was able to restore everything. It was still on my hard drive but it didn't show any where that I had looked.

[richfaa]

Ole Rich ,As a former Government Computer Geek, will verify that Glenn is absolutly correct as is Ford or any other manufacturer. Nothing against chipping or programmers but you got to be prepared to take your chances.

[bsmeaton]

Does bold mean you are yelling?

Let me answer a question with a question -
WHY on God's Green Earth would we believe some lesser experienced, lesser paid, couldn't get a job at any of the Big 3 engineer when he says he's got the Magic Potion [s](chip or program)[/s] (air bag or rubber block) to beef up our [s]diesels[/s] 3/4 ton suspension??? If this Magic Potion was all it's cracked up to be DON"T you think all of the Big 3 would have already installed it in their trucks???? If not as standard equipment but rather a high end option?
AND why is it that none of these Magic Potion vendors will carry any part of the [s]power train[/s] suspension warranty that the Big 3 will void if you add this Magic Potion to your TV???

Wonder if the on board computer can tell that you are running overweight or exceeding the specs?

Same song - different tune - in my humble opinion.

[Waynem]

isn't the chip the computer?
If so, and you pull the OEM chip out and replace it with one of the super duper chips, the information would be stored on the chip if it is RAM (Not ROM). So, if you have a problem and put the old chip back in, the problem would register on the old chip which the dealer would scan.

Just a thought. Anyone really know how they, the computer, work?

Edited: Personally I believe that the Big 3 as you may call them are in cahoots with the petroleum industry. Otherwise, why would the MPG be darn close to the same as it was 20-30 or more years ago. In 1961 my 1951 ford got 18-20 MPG depending how I stuck my foot into the engine. Today, my wifes Towncar gets 18-20 mpg depending how I stick my foot into the engine. (Ok-24MPG on a superhighway if I'm careful)

Now adding a chip will get you, according to the chip MFg's 3-5 more MPG. Now over time that is a lot of fuel. Now go back to my cahoots sentence and that is why I think that the gripe and complain and cry that you are using an unauthorized piece of equipment and therefore void the warranty. Just my very humble opinion.

[bsmeaton]

The big three have several considerations beyond just muscle competition. They also have to consider longevity, pollution, and even fuel mileage. I suspect they are no different now than they were a few decades ago where they selected a conservative tuning spec that harmoniously balanced performance, emissions, endurance, and economy. Could you push and improve any one of these beyond the factory envelope ......... OF COURSE! ........ Was there a tradeoff...............OF COURSE!, but what's a few MPG when we're hoping for more Mickey Thompson shreddin power!

Guys that re-tune are no different today than before. They do it because they can. First thing I did when the 68 Olds came home from the emissions test was open the hood, push the timing back up to 12 degrees TDC and turn out the fuel mixture screws at the base of that Quadra-Jet 1/2 turn past smooth idle. It "put the roar back into that 455 Rocket"........... or so it seemed.



Holes in top of the pistons meant the same thing to the factory rep back then (pre-ignition through advanced timing) as it did a while ago (nitrous-oxide injections) as it does today (chip tuners). It might void the warranty, but for some of us, "warranty" is not a religious phenomenon to be worshiped and obeyed. It is just money and we all make our own choices and take our own risks when it comes to that regardless of what others might think.

[Waynem]

Aw! I remember the days of hair!!!
Oops! Off-topic.

[mtheo]

I might be naive but I think the big three only add as much to the trucks this year as they have too. If they took them all the way this year how would the up the HP next year with no discrenable differnce to the truck. Every year the up the standards just enough to get new buyers.

[Ozzie]

I think we all know these diesels are capable of quite a bit more power than they are giving us. The difference is, the factory builds the rest of the drivetrain around this incremental power increase we are given each year.
By cranking up the power of the engine, it is putting the other components at risk. A heavy foot can cost you.

[tom41]

4 inch exhaust turbo back, including muffler, DIY 10inch cold air intake, Jodys custom DP tuner 4 mods, modified tranny, 06 tranny cooler, pillar mounted gauges, custom pearl paint, western leather and wood grain interior, custom overhead console, lots and lots of add-ons, and custom features, a "hauling" machine, I dont race, but its there if I want to!! LOL, after all, I am 66 yrs old, nawwww just a recycled teenager!! Of course theres no warrenty on my truck, I own it free and clear, wouldnt even think of trading it for a new truck. No, I wouldnt do all this to a new truck probably. But I have a better then "new" truck I think! Brad, you looking good there Friend!! LOL. If it wasnt for old time hot rodders and custom car builders, Detroit would still be building "model T's" : )

[BigAl52]

Say what you want about the big three and there warranty. Just remember the big three are the same companys who designed junk cars for us to drive in the late 70's and early 80's. There the same companys who had to co build cars with the japannese in order to compete with them. Yeah the BIG THREE aren't they good. They build these trucks like they do so DUMMYS with NO COMMON SENSE can drive them like they stole them and they will still last thru the warranty period. Al

[bsmeaton]

Tom,

That pearl two-tone is my next paint job!

Of course - handling that newly found horsepower is a whole different learning curve .



Maybe I should have focused on better gas mileage instead.............NAAAAW