ALERT! The price of fuel dropped

[Delaine and Lindy]

John your correct, the day after the President removed the ban on off shore drilling Oil prices went down. And most of us know that, and if we could get help from others and open Anwar the price will go down more. We must Drill any place there is Oil. And everyone knows, over 70% of America agree's, Drill now not later. I sure wish our land had Oil like West Texas, we would be drilling. Alernative sources aren't here yet. We have massive amounts of Oil in our Country we should be going after it. I also agree with Mr T. Boone Pickens, natural Gas will be the quickest alternative at this time. We have trillions and trillions of cubie feet of Natural Gas. Take a look at those flames around the Oil wells that Natural Gas being burned off. Oh yes Honda already has a Natural Gas car available. We must keep the pressure on our elected officals. GBY......

[richfaa]

I am sort of a environmentalist myself in that I am from Pittsburgh, Pa and from the steel area and I well remember pre EPA Days and the paint on my Chevy being eaten away by the emissions from the ford plant in Brookpark, Ohio. We don't want to go there again..There is a balance.In reading up on ANWAR one thing stands out. Only a small % of the preserve would be effected by oil production . Yet we are led to believe the entire preserve will be laid waste.

[HamRad]

Let's hear it for the President. He's saving us. Let me see.... is he an oil man? Is his daddy an oil man? Has he done nothing but support the oil industry since he took power? So of course we know he has only our best interest at heart! You all do remember that press conference where he was asked about the high price of gasoline and he said he didn't even know what it was! He thought everything was going just fine! If the oil lobby tells him to jump he simply asks "how high"?

All you "let's drill everywhere" types would be right if it could only be guaranteed that the oil would be consumed here in the US. And while laws could be passed to try to effect this the oil companies would never let it happen. After all they are almost all multi national entities with no allegiance to the United States. They simply want to make money. They don't care how much we have to pay for a gallon of fuel. And guess what! When we get all this "new" oil being delivered we're that much more DEPENDENT on oil. That is what we don't want.

If you think this temporary reduction in fuel prices is going to keep going down you'd better think again. It ain't gonna happen.

Dennis

[Trailer Trash 2]

I dont mind drilling for oil in as many areas as possable, so long as the oil stays here in the USA. Remember ta Alaskin pipe line? didn't we build it? now it belongs or being leased to British Patrolum. which dont even maintain it.

[richfaa]

The consortium of companies that own TAPS today includes:

BP Pipelines (Alaska) Inc. 46.93%
ConocoPhillips Transportation Alaska, Inc. 28.29%
ExxonMobil Pipeline Company, 20.34%
Unocal Pipeline Company, 1.36%
Koch Alaska Pipeline Company, L.L.C., 3.08%

These are the companies that built the pipeline.

http://www.bppipelines.com/history.html

This is BP North America

[richfaa]

I think what most of us are saying is that we need to be less dependent on foreign oil and we have plenty of resources here in North America and we wonder why they are not being utilized, in a responsible manner of course.I was a bit surprise when I called up information on ANWAR.. My impression from listening to the media was that the entire preserve would be opened up and we would drill 1000's of wells to extract billions of barrels of oil without any controls. That is not the case at all and I wonder why we are being mislead and by whom. It is amazing what can be learned when you search for the facts.

[Trailer Trash 2]

quote:Originally posted by richfaa

I think what most of us are saying is that we need to be less dependent on foreign oil and we have plenty of resources here in North America and we wonder why they are not being utilized, in a responsible manner of course.I was a bit surprise when I called up information on ANWAR.. My impression from listening to the media was that the entire preserve would be opened up and we would drill 1000's of wells to extract billions of barrels of oil without any controls. That is not the case at all and I wonder why we are being mislead and by whom. It is amazing what can be learned when you search for the facts.

Answer:.........Environmentalist..??? Being unsure of my answer

[Icehouse]

The media has absolutely made it appear that all of ANWR will be destroyed if we open it for drilling. No it won't. It is a small, small, small portion of land that is flat tundra in the far north of Alaska. Prudhoe Bay hasn't hurt the wildlife and opening ANWR won't either. There is oil here. There is oil in Colorado. Drill America! At the same time, let's look at alternative energy. Definitely. When Bernie and I build our next house, we are already planning and preparing to use wind energy. Why not? I say open ANWR.
Tammy

[richfaa]

We have nothing against the media but in their quest to sell their product they will "sensationalize" ANWAR is a good example. What is really the case and what the media presents are two different things.. And..I will say it again as to who is at fault that we do not increase our oil production.Any Country or company or group of people who produce and sell oil and that includes the good old USA, Does not want a unlimited supply in the marketplace..The supply must be controlled to keep the profit levels up. It is the capitalist system at its best.Just good business.

[skypilot]

I have to wonder as well - but I know, at least around here, that it is NOT the jobber that is making the windfall at the moment -- they are not seeing the price decrease at the tank farm or from the incoming fuel pipeline as yet. Knowing that the price we are hearing about on TV / news is the price for future delivery, what is the actual price of crude delivered to the refinery a week ago -- that is basically the stuff we are putting in our tanks today. We were / are paying for future delivery but are being pressured by costs already incurred as well. The pricing is so complex yet so volitile --

I thought this was going on a different thread but -- oh what the hay -- it fits here as well.

[dsprik]

Skypilot, just wondering if you are responding to my post at Diesel prices?

This post is probably appropriate for this thread also:

------------------------

quote:Originally posted by dsprik

This AAA graph below seems to to getting a little more eye catching. Around here the situation is such that many gas station owners are dropping their prices as fast - or sometimes even faster (one case) - than the price they are paying in order to draw in as much of the shrunken consumer base as possible into their stores for inside sales. Not sure if it's like that around the country, but the station owners around here are NOT dipping into this windfall. Someone else is.

There is a rapidly expanding profit margin somewhere here. Jobbers??? At this time and place in our economy this bothers me. I am 100% free enterprise, but this is unnecessary money going out of my pocket that I (and millions of others) can't afford right now...

(Specifically looking at the WHOLESALE AVE - RETAIL AVE gap from 5/1/2008 to present)

Facts:

Price of oil has fallen 15.75% in the last two weeks. $146 to $123 (as of this AM).

Price of Diesel has dropped $4.845 to $4.736 (2.25%)

Gas has dropped $4.114 to $3.958 (3.79%).

Am I the only one who is uncomfortable by this chart? The wholesale price of gasoline has dropped right with the drop in the price of oil. We consumers are taking it on the chin again.

SOMEONE is getting rich here while consumers are hurting badly. This is NOT JMHO - that is FACT. Nowhere in the last year (maybe longer) has someone had this large - and getting larger - of a profit margin.

I know there are MOCers here that could [s]speculate[/s] (sorry, bad word) offer some insight as to where this money is going?

*On Edit~ Unless I misunderstand this chart from AAA's website, it isn't the refineries making any of this windfall profit either. Someone in between them and the station owners???

[dsprik]

Skypilot, the futures market price difference would make sense if the chart above showed similar fluctuations BEFORE 5/1/2008. Everything, including Retail Ave, very closely follows the Futures pricing the entire previous months of the year. NOW, all of sudden, it doesn't...

[Icehouse]

Here is an article in today's Anchorage Daily News about ANWR. Interesting read.
http://www.adn.com/anwr/story/477144.html
Tammy

[Thunderman]

Considering what we have seen so far due to the high price of oil, how can any one oppose drilling for more oil anywhere. The high prices for food,the devastating effect on the economy and the loss of thousands of jobs should be enough to paint a picture of what the future will be if we stay on this course.
The politicians want your vote and will flow with the tide...we just have to let them know where the tide is flowing.

[richfaa]

Now why is this not general knowledge...

"Those calling for drilling say oil development would barely touch ANWR, disturbing just 2,000 acres of a 19.2 million-acre outback. And exploration would not tromp on the spectacular Brooks Range mountains or their scenic foothills. Rather, it would be limited to the pancake-flat coastal plain along the Arctic Ocean."

[HamRad]

Rich,

You always need to consider the source of the information. In this case I suspect the information is being presented by the oil industry. And we know that the most important thing for them is our well being.

What do you think they would say? Yeah we're going to build numerous roads and support structures all over the place. If it were me I'd say it was going to have little to no effect on the environment.

Thunderman,

If there was some guarantee that any and all oil from the "let's drill everywhere" approach would reduce the price of oil or that the oil would even be used here in the US I'd be standing in line to help them. But there is nothing to indicate that that is what will happen. Besides that we must get off our dependence on oil. We must start developing alternative forms of energy. If not now, when?

HamRad

[skypilot]

I think it is actually following the graph -- believing as I do that the companies raised their prices in anticipation of higher priced crude -- i.e. we have to have the money in the bank to buy the stuff when it arrives. Now, we are on the back side of the curve (crude going down some) but they, either because they are cautious or (heaven forbid) because they see profit $$$$ , are now holding at the higher price waiting to see what the market does. I need to do some more reading on this (been very busy at work and by the time I get home, just to beat to read up much) but it seems to me that oil pricing is behaving much like the rest of our economy has in the last 2 decades -- fast to rise but slow to react when the market changes downward..... regardless, I don't think this rollercoaster ride is near over yet.

I just went back and looked at the graph again and I notice that we also had a slight hiccup back 11/1/2007. This one is much more divergent but I think we're now seeing the national retail starting to correct itself. Will be interesting to see how it looks 8/1/2008.

[dsprik]

This is an excerpt from one article on falling gas prices. This was quoted in other news articles, too.

quote:Prices at the pump are poised to dip even further, and could cost as much as 25 cents less by Labor Day, AAA spokesman Geoff Sundstrom said.

"People say typically prices shoot up like a rocket, fall like a feather. But this time ... it looks like it's different," Sundstrom said. "The retail sector is interested in bringing these prices down as fast as they can to stimulate business in their convenience stores."

... In the latest sign that Americans continue to struggle with soaring energy prices, filling station operators hungry for business ratcheted down the average price for a gallon of regular gas by 2 cents, according to auto club AAA, the Oil Price Information Service and Wright Express.

Sundstrom said such a large decline suggests demand is fading. Retail prices have fallen about a dime per gallon in just the past week.

"We're seeing a historic change in driving habits," Sundstrom said, although he added that "we still have a long way to go before we get back to the comfort zone, if you will, for the consumer."

(AP Business News)

I don't know... relative to oil prices it still looks like a "feather" fall to me...

[Mrs. CountryGuy]

Geesh Dave,

When ya run out of $$, you don't drive, eh??? Seems simple enough to me! No wonder a lot have adjusted their driving habits. Can we all go, DUHHH??

(Pitty the pour working folks, who HAVE to drive)

Anyway, didn't we see jumps of 5 to 15 cents over night in the price of gas (we don't watch the "D" price as much).

So, 2 cents down overnight is suppose to thrill us?? And a dime in a week don't get much dancing done either.

On the positive side, hey, it is at least going the direction we would like to see, eh??? DOWN!!!

Excuse me, if I refuse to do a happy dance just yet, eh??

[dsprik]

Carol, my "Happy Dance" will be at $2.99/gas. Hopefully I will be wore out by the time the Rally rolls around...