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11-08-2007, 08:20 AM
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#1
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Grand Junction
Posts: 246
M.O.C. #4854
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Truck Test
The new Popular Mechanics has a test of the big three diesel TV's. They rate the the Chevy #1 Ford #2 Dodge #3. Chevy out pulled the other two and got better gas milage. 0-60 towing Chevy 18.95 Dodge 21.6 Ford 22.31. Towing Milage Chevy 10.5 Dodge 8.7 Ford 7.6. My 06 F250 4x4 gets 10.2 towing. Don't want to start a TV war, just thought it was worth looking at.
Jerry
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11-08-2007, 10:52 AM
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#2
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Site Team
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Omaha
Posts: 6,749
M.O.C. #7560
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Jerry, I have an HD 2500, Duramax/Allison 6 speed with a little over 7000 on it now and I'm averaging 12.6 towing, 15.6 city, and 19.3 highway without the tow! I talked to my brother who has a 2005 HD 2500 and he does a lot of towing of a gooseneck and he said I won't see the real mileage until I hit 20,000 miles or so and then I should be averaging about 24 highway and about 15-16 towing! I'm going to put on the miles so I can see if the price of diesel stays where it's at or goes down. It's running $3.39/9 here in Omaha now and they say it will be going up to over $4.00 by spring time!
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11-08-2007, 11:05 AM
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#3
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Montana Master
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 20,028
M.O.C. #20
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That's very intersting. I'll have to buy that magazine and read it. What were they towing? I'm towing 14,620 lbs and get 11.6 mpg with 17,000 miles on the truck. The only time I got close to that 8.7 was the very first towing with less than 1000 miles on the truck I got 8.6 towing that same Montana in the Pennsylvania mountains with a strong headwind. When I read these tow tests I really have to wonder how and what they're testing. The numbers rarely seem to match the real world.
Mpg reports don't tell me much unless it also says how much weight is being towed, what engine, axle, cab/bed, transmission, towing speed and conditions. Otherwise it's very hard to compare numbers.
Thanks for the report. I'll look for that issue.
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11-08-2007, 11:15 AM
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#4
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Kingsville
Posts: 473
M.O.C. #6588
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What Steve said! Also, when was the last time you engaged in drag racing while hooked to Monty or SOB?
Bob
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11-08-2007, 01:11 PM
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#5
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Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Snohomish
Posts: 579
M.O.C. #5583
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What month issue of Popular Mechanics was this article in? I just checked the novemeber issue and the aerticle wasn't in that issue.
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11-08-2007, 02:58 PM
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#6
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Grand Junction
Posts: 246
M.O.C. #4854
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It's in the December issue. They towed an equipment trailer with a John Deer excavator, total weight 9,120 pounds. Axel ratios were Ford 4.30:1 Chevy 3.73:1 Dodge 4.10:1. There is a chart with all the info, too much to write here. We may not drag race, but it's sure nice to have the umph to flow into traffic entering a freeway. Also I love to pass those million dollar motor homes going up hill. Still just a kid inside.
Jerry
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11-08-2007, 03:38 PM
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#7
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Cooper
Posts: 1,230
M.O.C. #3029
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A fair test would have been the same gear in each truck.
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11-08-2007, 04:30 PM
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#8
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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Those articles make for interesting reading but IMO don't mean a thing.My shinny new 08 Ford 6.4L with only 2600 miles on it did 10.3 the last tow out with the 3400
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11-08-2007, 05:29 PM
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#9
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Casa Grande
Posts: 5,369
M.O.C. #6333
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Apples vs oranges!!!!
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11-08-2007, 05:51 PM
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#10
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: YUMA
Posts: 861
M.O.C. #2625
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by daneboy
It's in the December issue. They towed an equipment trailer with a John Deer excavator, total weight 9,120 pounds. Axel ratios were Ford 4.30:1 Chevy 3.73:1 Dodge 4.10:1. There is a chart with all the info, too much to write here. We may not drag race, but it's sure nice to have the umph to flow into traffic entering a freeway. Also I love to pass those million dollar motor homes going up hill. Still just a kid inside.
Jerry
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Charlie is correct about the gear axel ratios not much of a true test, the ford with the 4.30:1 is going to be the last off the line just because of the gear ratios.Test them with all having a 4.10:1 and see who wins.............
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11-09-2007, 12:03 AM
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#11
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: St. John
Posts: 591
M.O.C. #800
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I don't know if this site has been posted on here before or not, but I'll do it now. If I've repeated something, I'm sorry. This site is probably about as fair a comparison as any I've seen. It does not delve into MPG but gives a pretty fair performance analysis.
http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/2007...shootout1.html
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11-09-2007, 12:06 AM
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#12
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location:
Posts: 2,376
M.O.C. #6575
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As in my signature, I drive a GMC. GM Duramax is only available with the 373:1 gear. Not sure about Ford or Dodge. Not sure about their mileage either. They all build some good trucks. I'm glad there is competition in the market, which pushes the manufacturers to build a better truck. When I bought my truck, I tried out a '04 PS, and would have probably bought except they wouldn't meet the price I offered. I didn't look at Dodge, but have since looked at the Mega cab. (Soooo much room in that cab) Guess what I'm trying to say is I'm not particularly brand loyal. I like the Duramax, but show me a better product, and when I'm ready to buy a new one, I'll switch in a minute. I feel the same way with the Mountaineer. Just my thoughts in the early morning.
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11-09-2007, 12:27 AM
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#13
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Fort Myers
Posts: 5,933
M.O.C. #4282
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My experience reading forums is that if they would have used a different 2500 HD on another day, they would have had different results. I did not read this article, so I may be off here, but reading several different posts by various GM - and various Ford - and various Dodge owners, I have never seen any identical mileage figures. In fact they have varied widely within the same brand.
Did this test include several runs with different trucks of the same brand? And did they do this testing over a variety of temp, weather and grade conditions? I would hope they did. That is the only way they could conclusively say that they are ALMOST sure of the results.
At the very least, they increased their readership on this issue...
I would never publish any results of any experimental testing without the minimum of the above. Also ideal testing would be running these trucks at different mileage intervals. We all know that the towing/mileage of any single diesel at 500, 20K, 50K, 100K miles is sometimes radically different, and also varies among brands.
I'm sure these guys know what they are doing, but I, myself, would have an asterisk by test results like the one above, if it did not include these tests.
Oh yeah... and having the same rear end gear ratio should have been a given...
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11-09-2007, 02:53 AM
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#14
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Montana Master
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Concord
Posts: 575
M.O.C. #3543
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These articles make for interesting reading but really don't tell you much. I didn't buy my TV to drag race it and fuel milage can vary more based on driving habits than the truck itself so we are all going to get different results than these tests will. The bottom line is if your happy with what you have then who cares what the article says?
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11-09-2007, 05:06 AM
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#15
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Montana Master
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Snohomish
Posts: 579
M.O.C. #5583
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I'm not sure why we are unable to get an apples to apples comparison. Maybe it is deliberate. It sure would help if at the very minimum they could use the same rear end ratio. Or better yet do the test with all the rear end ratios supplied by each manufacturer. Yes, I know that would be expensive for the manufacturers but how else are we going to make the comparisons and make a decision. I sometimes wonder if it isn't all advertising hype and what the manufactures hope for is brand loyalty. I don't think it needs to be this complex either. Oh well, supply us with so much information that we get confused and then we will believe the hype I guess :-)
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11-09-2007, 06:14 AM
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#16
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Montana Master
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 20,028
M.O.C. #20
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Dean A Van Peursem
Or better yet do the test with all the rear end ratios supplied by each manufacturer.
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I really like this idea. Then we'd have an idea of comparison of different axle ratios within a single brand as well as between brands. What a great idea, Dean.
And, oh what a surprise that the 3.73 gets better mileage than the 4.10 which gets better mileage than the 4.30 axle. It oughta be illegal to publish comparisons like that without clearly annotating the results that the axle ratios differ. Not everybody goes looking in the chart to see if those are all apples.
I'm still planning to find the magazine so I can see if they are all crew cabs or are there weight penalties because one is a supercab and another is a crewcab, etc.
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11-09-2007, 06:18 AM
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#17
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Montana Master
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 20,028
M.O.C. #20
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Bob Pasternak
I don't know if this site has been posted on here before or not, but I'll do it now. If I've repeated something, I'm sorry. This site is probably about as fair a comparison as any I've seen. It does not delve into MPG but gives a pretty fair performance analysis.
http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/2007...shootout1.html
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I recall reading this one and I think even in this one they used different axle ratios in different brands so it was hard to really compare.
Also, note that the hill climbs in this one are from a DEAD STOP. They are on the hill before they start moving. And that F450 climbed 100 yards up a 25% (yes, 25%) hill in (shoot, I forgot how long) towing that trailer and starting from a dead stop. They didn't even try that hill with any other truck, not even the other Fords.
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11-09-2007, 06:56 AM
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#18
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: St. John
Posts: 591
M.O.C. #800
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Steve, I think two had 3.73 and one 4.10. They also put gas to gas and diesel to diesel. As for incline starting, Hummer plant in Mishawaka, IN has a hill about 100' high that is 60% grade. All Hummers come off the assembly line, go to that hill, go half way up, stop, continue over, go half way down and stop, then go on to the storage yard.
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