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Old 01-26-2020, 02:15 PM   #21
Hamlej
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Yes, I have used our Lithium batteries down to as far as 10% of our available 400 amps on a cloudy day. The batteries stay above 12.5v all the way down to that point. We use solar to recharge or the inverter/charger with generator or shore power. You can upgrade your factory charger to work with Lithium at a very reasonable cost. I purchased 4-100a batteries so that I could upgrade 1-100a battery at a time because of cost.
 
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Old 01-26-2020, 02:45 PM   #22
Randy Auman
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Lithium Upgrade

A couple of years ago I installed two Lion Safari Lithium batteries and they work well. I did not replace my converter and was told by Safari that the only problem with not replacing it was the batteries wouldn't be charged up their maximum charge without a different converter but that it wouldn't

damage them. The reason I didn't replace the converter is that the Solar panel can top off the lithium batteries.
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Old 01-26-2020, 04:48 PM   #23
Nat_Park_Travelers
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You need to check the absorption and float voltage specs of the battery and of the converter. If the battery is rated at 14.4 - 14.9 absorption (which most lithiums are), then your converter must be able to output in that range. Same thing goes for the float stage - most lithiums are rated at 13.6v float and your converter would need to be able to accommodate that. On the other hand, you might want to upgrade your converter anyway if it 1] is not a multi-stage converter, and 2] does not provide high amperage charging. The higher the amps during charging, the faster your battery will get fully charged. I have 400ah Battle Borns and a 3000w pure sine inverter with a 125amp charger section and it works great. I also have 1200w of solar on the roof and it all plays together very nicely. Also lithiums do NOT need to be equalized, so you would set that at 14.4v and turn off equalization.
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Old 01-26-2020, 05:17 PM   #24
djrich
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I have two 300AH LiFeBlue batteries and have been nothing but happy with them. I have drawn mine down to 2% with no problems. I have a 2019 3790RD and the converter could be adjusted to the correct setting. Life is good!
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Old 01-30-2020, 06:01 AM   #25
BiggarView
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Some will argue, correctly, that AGM cost far less than LFP. No argument there. The issue with getting the same usable AH output in AGM as LFP is the weight penalty. That weight can seriously cut into your CCC which could be an issue on some rigs with lower CCC ratings. You still need food clothes and gear... heavy batteries could compromise your plans... Just sayin'. Its not all about the money, or the AHs... ya gotta do other math before you pull the trigger on a large AGM battery bank, just as your budget has to be able to withstand the massive upfront cost of LFP. What works for one person does not mean it will work for somebody else.

Another point, many people simply won't recover the cost of LFP during the time of RV ownership. Dedicated long time Fulltimers will likely see the benefit but W/E campers likely will not. A well maintained and properly sized battery bank be it LA, AGM or LFP will last a significant amount of time but as always YMMV as they say. And you though the decision was going to be simple....
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Old 01-31-2020, 02:02 PM   #26
McRod
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Tesla Powerwall 2 (13.5kwh) is $6.93/AH
Lifeblue 300AH (12v) is $9.33/AH
Renogy 170AH (12v) is $8.82/AH
Lion Energy 105AH (12v) is $9.51/AH
Battleborn 100AH (12v) is $9.99/AH
SimpliPhi (3.8kwh) is $8.51/ AH

Just FYI when your LifePO4 shopping. The prices are off the shelf and don't include discounts or incentives.

The battery figures have all been converted to 12v (some are only offered in 12/24/48 volt or DC-AC configurations). So you may need that level of system. Watt hours have been converted to Amp hours on a 12v system to keep everything apples to apples.

The home battery market is where you will get the most bang/buck. Many of the home batteries include inverters and battery management systems.

Obviously, there are pros/cons to each. e.g availability, ease of install, etc. For example, Powerwall has 9 month waiting list and you will need to convince a certified installer to hook you up to keep the warranty (no DIYers).

If you are looking at spending $6k investment in batteries, I would lean towards the home battery market. I only mentioned 2 here, but there are at least 10. LG and Panasonic (Tesla) being the leaders. Many are "drop in" solutions.
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Old 01-31-2020, 06:28 PM   #27
Daryles
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djrich View Post
I have two 300AH LiFeBlue batteries and have been nothing but happy with them. I have drawn mine down to 2% with no problems. I have a 2019 3790RD and the converter could be adjusted to the correct setting. Life is good!
Your converter, that you were able to adjust for lithium came with your Montana?
What model converter do you have?
It's on the label inside the fuse panel door.
I have a 2019 3130re. The converter is
Progressive Dynamics, model PD4575K18LS8.
https://www.etrailer.com/RV-Converte...575K18LS8.html

In the Owners manual it says mine may have this switch. I have not taken it apart yet to find out.
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Old 01-31-2020, 08:15 PM   #28
lightsout
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djrich View Post
I have two 300AH LiFeBlue batteries and have been nothing but happy with them. I have drawn mine down to 2% with no problems. I have a 2019 3790RD and the converter could be adjusted to the correct setting. Life is good!
Technically you cannot draw your Lithium's down that low, fact is Lithium batteries have a built in switch that has a pre determined minimum that shuts the battery down at that point while it still has a sizable charge left. Regardless of what some think full drain on Lithiums is also bad for them which is why they have the built in safe guard where as AGM and Wet Cell do not have the electronics to provide that safety.

over discharging a Lithium battery even once results in a permanent loss of approximately 20% of the battery's capacity. Over discharging can also result in a failure mechanism called cell inversion which is one of the things that cause cheap consumer electronics with Li- batteries to fail.

Fortunately most 12v Lithiums have protection built in however you will never be able to drain to 2% let alone 0%. That 2% is only a threshold to the protection shut off level.
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Old 06-04-2020, 01:17 PM   #29
Rollinspo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nat_Park_Travelers View Post
You need to check the absorption and float voltage specs of the battery and of the converter. If the battery is rated at 14.4 - 14.9 absorption (which most lithiums are), then your converter must be able to output in that range. Same thing goes for the float stage - most lithiums are rated at 13.6v float and your converter would need to be able to accommodate that. On the other hand, you might want to upgrade your converter anyway if it 1] is not a multi-stage converter, and 2] does not provide high amperage charging. The higher the amps during charging, the faster your battery will get fully charged. I have 400ah Battle Borns and a 3000w pure sine inverter with a 125amp charger section and it works great. I also have 1200w of solar on the roof and it all plays together very nicely. Also lithiums do NOT need to be equalized, so you would set that at 14.4v and turn off equalization.
Did you have to do anything to restrict/control the charge coming from your truck while towing? The truck charges at a different rate than a lithium needs. don't want to damage the truck.
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Old 06-04-2020, 05:52 PM   #30
mazboy
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i think rj got his answer on the battery....
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