TOW VEHICLE CHOICES

[CmdrDewey]

In the two and a half years that I have been a member of the Montana Owners forum there have been many inquiries about what truck to buy. It is cold and windy and I don’t feel like playing outside so I’m going to provide my opinion. This is long but I hope at least some of you find it instructive.

I stress that it is just that-my opinion but it is based on a lot of experience. I first traveled coast to coast in 1968 driving a Datsun Roadster hauling a small utility trailer with all our camping gear. We went 8,000 miles in about eight weeks and slept in the tent 50 days.

Since that time I have owned three different tents, four different slides in campers, three fifth wheels and I have rented both a Class C and a Class a motor home. I have spoken publicly about the subject. I also have more than thirty years association with fire and rescue having been a fire chief and the founder, director and training officer of an ambulance service. I bring a safety perspective to this topic.

Many people go out and buy a truck and fifth wheel (I am only talking about that configuration in this article) having no experience with either. The truth of the matter is that a truck rides like-well, a truck. Frankly that is the very characteristic that makes them suitable for hauling a 5ver. Before anyone makes a huge and very expensive mistake, I suggest you decide if a truck is for you. It has been for me for thirty-five years but they aren’t for everybody.

My personal preference is for 4x4 but again, that isn’t for everybody. I prefer it because I live in Maine and even though we now spend most of the winter in the south, we can have bad weather any time of year. I have also used four wheel drive a dozen or so times in the south including Georgia and Texas (think mud) and North Carolina and South Padre Island (think sand). I also like it because Ford (and I expect Dodge and GM) put extra suspension in the front end to help carry the weight of the extra running gear. It also helps carry the overall weight. Ford also uses a steering stabilizer not present in the 4x2. As I said, this is a matter of personal preference but before you spend big money on either, I suggest you become familiar with both.

Similarly, there is a huge debate about dual versus single rear wheels. I have singles. The chief advantage of dual wheels is that you can CARRY more weight. My fire department has a Squad truck on an F 350 chassis with duals and a Wildcards truck on an F 550 with duals. Both fine trucks and both ride very well. Although not such a limitation as it used to be, you can PULL less weight. There is plenty of anecdotal evidence that dually is more stable but I know of no scientific study that proves that either way. I have never had stability issues with single rear wheels and there is a lot of anecdotal evidence about that as well. The other alleged advantage is that you have control in the event of a blowout. I’m sure someone will be along to tell me of other advantages but I don’t know what those might be. There are disadvantages as well. Your truck meets the road on four corners. Only half of those corners have tire redundancy. I check my tires regularly, replace when necessary, keep them properly inflated and rotated and the lug nuts torque to specs. I have never had a blow out on the truck. I have also been trained what to do if I have a blowout. That is a nonissue to me. Duallys cost more, tires cost more and are virtually impossible to change on your own. Inside tires are harder to check and therefore don’t get checked as much. Duallys are not welcome in a lot of places including many drive thrus and carwashes, residential areas in some places and some state and national parks.

What it comes down to is personal preference. As I said above, become familiar with both before plunking down your hard earned cash.

Now the third thing that becomes a matter of personal preference is 250/2500 vs 350/3500. I haul with an F 250. My GCVWR is 20,000 pounds and I am under that. I have what is now the smallest and lightest Montana at 12,220 (rated). I would not haul anything bigger than 13,000 with my truck and I would be over weight. I would be comfortable going to 15,000 on the new Ford but that also would be over. People on this forum haul every model Montana with a 250/2500 and I have never heard any problems reported. Personal preference but do your homework.

Next issue is long versus short bed. In my opinion the length of the bed does not matter but the length of the wheelbase certainly does. A longer wheel base rides better. Now wheel base vs trailer length in a travel trailer is crucial. It is not as important for a fifth wheel but IMHO it is important. The comparison is not totally accurate but picture if you will three men carrying a 4x12 piece of drywall across the lawn with a strong cross wind. With one in the front, one in the middle and one at the end, the pressure of the wind is equally divided. Move the guy in the middle to right behind the front and the guy in the back has to work much harder to stay stable. With my long bed, the guy in the middle is near the center. I have 18 feet ahead of the hitch and 28 behind it. A longer trailer and shorter truck become much more like my second example above. With a 5th wheel configuration this is not crucial but a ride and handling will be improved. Make an informed choice.

The final choice is gas versus diesel. I have diesel and me wish I had bought one year ago. I haven’t kept complete records but I am convinced that my per mile cost is only a fraction of what my cost was with my last truck which was a gas F 250 hauling a 26-ft 5ver. Three years ago I was in Billings, Montana in a campground where people were gathering to leave for Alaska. I saw only one gas truck and he told me he regretted the purchase. My 110,000 Miles of experience tells me that serious haulers drive diesel. It is certainly personal preference but do your homework.

I don’t think anyone will say that you should have anything less than E rated tires. I certainly won’t.

Now once you own that truck I suggest you leave it in stock condition at least in the beginning. There is plenty of time to do add ons later, after you know what, if anything needs tweaking.

Every truck manufacturer has a sticker somewhere that tells you what the tire pressure should be. Follow the recommendation unless you are an automotive design engineer and know more than your manufacturer. Be aware of the ride quality of your vehicle and check and/or replace the shocks when it starts to deteriorate. I needed new shocks and was interested n the adjustable Rancho 9000. My tire guy told me that because of my air bags I did not need the adjustable and put on Rancho RSX. They cost about half as much and I’m happy. My point is to check before you go with what you think is the latest and greatest.

[sreigle]

Lots of good information, Dave. Just a couple of comments, if I may.

I had a 1968 Datsun 2000 Roadster (the 2000 was made for Australian road racing. Top speed purportedly 145 mph). I loved it even though the turn signals were on the right side of the steering wheel but cannot imagine towing a trailer across the street, much less across the country! For those unfamiliar with this car, think MG B.


Dave, the new Fords, 2005 and newer, have higher ratings, which I think you implied. My F250 has GCWR of 23,000 and tow rating of 15,400, significantly stronger and larger frame, brakes, and, on the 4x4, front control arms and other suspension components. It's more tow capable than the prior years' 1 ton F350's. I think I'm just adding to what you were saying.

I wanted to add to the shortbed/longbed discussion. You are correct the important part is not shortbed or longbed, it is wheelbase. Some people assume shortbed means short wheelbase. That is true only when both are the same cab configuration. For example, the supercab (extended cab to GM folks) shortbed Ford has a longer wheelbase than the standard cab longbed. My crewcab shortbed has a wheelbase longer than both of those and of any longbed except the crewcab. So folks should pay more attention to wheelbase. Bed configuration affects only whether a slider hitch is needed and if they intend to haul long things in the bed.

Tire pressure. I agree about using the mfrs recommendations as on the sticker when not towing but I do not agree for towing. Those recommendations are for everyday driving, not towing. Rear tires need to be aired for the load on those tires. Adding the Montana pinweight that will in many cases mean taking those tires to the max psi of 80 (load range E tires). I think you meant that but just forgot to say it. I don't think the sticker on mine mentions anything about this.

My F250 came standard with Rancho shocks. I'm not sure the model number but they say Rancho all over them and are red over white. They are not the 9000 adjustables. I intend someday to go to the adjustables even though I have the airbags. My reason is that we like to do a lot of backroad exploration and the eaiser 4x4 trails. Airbags won't help me there unless I need more clearance and I hope not to get in that situation. I want the adjustables to make the ride more comfortable over those very rough roads.

Dave, this is not meant as a criticism but as comments, maybe for situations a little bit out of the ordinary. Good info.

[ols1932]

I have one of the older F-250's with the Power Stroke engine. Having added the Banks Power Pack, I have not increased the manufacturers specs for amount allowed to be towed. All I've done is increased the power I have available to pull what I have. I feel that I should have a little larger truck but financially am unable to do so right now. On top of that I like the service I'm getting from my F-250 with 135,000 miles on it.

Orv

[Montana Sky]

One is not going to get any better information than right here. So far my truck has done a great job towing my coach, guess I will be happy with that. =)

[Dave e Victoria]

I truely loved my 2003 2500HD. It hauled my 3295RK BigSky without a hitch (sic). It was barely within all the weight specs and never worried me on the biggest hill, sharpst down grade or longest day. Then we bought the Cambridge. It still did everything i asked but, the tire rating had me worried. Now we have Bubba. A bit of a problem to park and a little over on some specs but the 2500HD taught me not to worry. It does the job and it is all I ask.
Dave

[mobilrvn]

Just got a '06 2500HD Duramax with the new Allison six speed, SRW and am in love with it! Had a '99 F350 dually powerstroke but the Banks "Smart lock" destroyed the transmission and efforts at repair failed twice in Mexico. Was worried about pin weight and stability, but no problem. Plenty of power and the transmission is a dream, especially when you go to manual and can select any of the six gears by a flick of the paddle switch. Only caution I would make is to make sure to install at least a pyrometer (the boost gage completes the package). Climbed some serious mountains returning from the Baja on the toll road between Tecate and Mexicali. Had to back off the pedal some to keep the temp in the safe range--no telling where it would have been without this timely warning since the truck just wanted to go.

[stiles watson]

Good stuff, Dave, and well said. My whole rig is 55'long and my Ford F250 says, "What load?"

[315RLS]

[quote]Originally posted by CmdrDewey
Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts and experience regarding TVs. As you can see from my signature I have both a TT and a extended wb van. I am considering, and it will be a longggggg... consideration of moving to a 3500/dualy diesel and possibly a Keystone Raptor or KZ MontegoBay because we travel with a fair number of Golden Retrievers (*possibly Montana will come out with a toy-hauler floorplan by the time I get around to laying out all this cash :-). Anyway the continual threads on TVs are very helpful. Thanks

[Garin1]

Good post Dave, sometimes it just takes a rainy day to get the good info out.

[Montana Sky]

315RLS,
Have you looked at the Keystone Raptor? Was in one the other day, must say they are one amazing unit. The garage area was huge, could get a golf cart in there along with a few other toys. I was amazed at how tall the Raptor is, would sure require watching the overhead objects pretty close.

[Joyce H]

Dave, Very good information. This type of post is what this forum is all about. When reading through the post I was pleased we had made the right decision when we purchased our truck. We had light duty pick-ups in the past, but went with the F350 for the Montana. We wanted the 4 WD because of the vacation home we have in WV where we sometimes go for Christmas and there is plenty of snow and ice. Thank you for all the input.

[CmdrDewey]

Thank you all for the kind comments. It is nice to know when one's efforts are appreciated.

[Native Tex]

Dave good information and pretty much right to the point. Next time I get caught inside on a rainy day I think I will do a similar epistle on one of my facorite topics as well. Thanks.

[Longwell]

As a "newbie" I really appreciate all the time and effort you took to post this subject.
Your experience really shows. I have driven almost every type of vehicle EXCEPT a pickup with a 5er, so it will really be valuable to know these things when I get ready to spend money I don't have.
Thanks again.
Larry

[Wrenchtraveller]

Well, life is about choices and we base these choices on our own experiences. I owned 3 diesel Fords over the last 11 years and my 95 and 2000 7.3s were awesome, reliable engines.

In 04 I bought a new 04 6.0 PSD Ford and I was one of the unlucky ones with that engine. Poor mileage and being stranded alongside the road 3 times has left me no fan of the 6.0 PSD

I guess you can say I am brand loyal to the point of being stupid but I love Ford pickups and I have bought 8 brand new ones over the last 31 years so I got my dealer to take back my lemon 6.0 and I ordered my 05 from the factory with a V10 gasser. So far, I love the thing and it uses only about 20% more fuel than my 6.0 did. It has never let me down so far.

Ford is getting Navistar to build a new 6.4 dual turbo PSD that will be out in 07. These turbos will be a fixed vane design, which IMO is more dependable than the variable vane turbo now used in the 6.0 PSD.

Here in Canada a turbo for a 6.0 is over 5000 dollars so if you ever have to buy one of these when you are off warranty, any fuel savings you may have accumulated will be long gone.

I truly wish all you 6.0 owners the very best of luck with your 6.0 PSDs, and I am not sure what I will do down the road. I may own another diesel someday, but not a 6.0 PSD

Take care and best of luck with whatever TV you decide to go with and I hope to see Toyota get into the heavy duty pickup market soon. Things will get very interesting, I am sure.

[richfaa]

We along with wrenchtraveller ordered our 05 F-350 with the V-10.With the new motors, fuel, EPA standards being uncertain and our lack of confidence in the 6.0 psd we thought that was the interim thing to do. We also along with WrenchTraveller are members of and closely monitor several Forums on the subject. We also live in Ford country and have those sources of information. We are hoping for the best in 07/08 as we expect our travel to change were we would warrant a diesel. Does not look real encouraging right now but it is early in the game. A article in our morning paper indicated that 3.00 Gal + gas is a certainty this summer...it is 2.699 to 2.899 now...