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Old 06-13-2008, 07:25 AM   #21
richfaa
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Well we finally fell victim to the long awaited and anticipated..John won't hold water problem. It was inrermittent for a long time then last week it just gave up. Spoke to a nice lady at Sealand who said a new and improved kit will be in the mail Monday..No charge. that completes the retorfit of our waste system... New black tank , plumbing and now a "John rebuild kit". Only the John remains...
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Old 06-13-2008, 09:30 AM   #22
Dean A Van Peursem
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Rich,

Does it ever end? I suspect we have the same Dometic model 210 Traveler Lite we have and are getting a new and improved version of part number 385310681 Ball, Shaft and Cart Kit. As far as I know we are not yet having that problem but if it is leaking slowly that may be why I have another slow leak coming down the treaded sewer fitting and the plastic sewer pipe in the garage. But if the integrety of the sewer piping is good it shouldn't leak even if the ball valve is leaking.

Initially, I thought the floor flange seal part # 385311267 was leaking allowing water to get to the outside of the seal ring but since I don't get any water on the bathroom floor I'm beginning to doubt that. I sent an email to Dometice asking them to send me a new upgraded seal kit and they kindly referred me back to Camping World for $30 plus replcement kit for the Floor Flange Seal Kit. I must be missing something, but a new 3" rubber or wax seal can be purchased at any hardware store for way less than $5.00. I must not understand what is in that $30 plus kit. Something doesn't add up here.

If Dometic is sending out a new Ball kit and associated parts free, replacement to 385310681 I better see if I can get one of thos too in case I have that problem or am about to. But I don't remember ours not holding water. I better check that again.
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Old 06-13-2008, 09:48 AM   #23
richfaa
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No it never ends Dean and it is nothing that I did not expect hence the Service contract( extended Warranty) These are high maint units and we can barely keep up.. Good thing we have this forum as it keeps me ahead of the failure curve.
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Old 06-16-2008, 12:22 PM   #24
Dean A Van Peursem
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Well, folks I have found the black tank leak and it is a big one. The tank is leaking very heavily at the bottom bulge to the right of the black tank drain piping. Of course I pulled the underbelly cover on the right side which is a long way from the exit hole on the tank. Can't see it real well from this side but appears to be a fairly long crack as the water is just pouring out. What has me very confused is I ran the flushing water a long time to partially fill the tank with the drain valve closed no leak. Then hooked the water to the regulare city water line hookup and ran it for quite some more time by opening up the toilet flush valve. After some time the leak showed up and then leaked for a long time. Why do I have to put so much water in to get it to leak. I would think the tank drain outlet would be the lowest part of the tank. The 3400RL is parked and leveled almost perfectly. Something doesn't make sense at all.

The only possibility is that it is leaking from near the top of the tank but just appears to be leaking from the bottom near the drain. Where did you folks have cracks in your tanks? I guess I'm going to have to drop the other side of the underbelly to see if I can see/find where it is really leaking from. Is it possible I just have a drain pipe fitting leaking coming out of the bottom left front of the tank? What kind of cracks did you folks have and where were they? I beleive Rich said his crack was on top of the tank somewhere. What a disaster.
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Old 06-16-2008, 02:02 PM   #25
HamRad
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My leak in my gray tank was where the outlet goes into the tank. I guess it is just a weak connection process. But some folks have had leaks at the top where the vent pipe connects to the tank. Others have had an actual split tank on the bottom. One fellow recently fixed his bottom leak using a plastic "welding" process.

It can be a tough job finding exactly where the leak is located.

Good luck and let us know what you end up doing.

Thanks,

HamRad
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Old 06-16-2008, 04:46 PM   #26
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Dean, It is possible that the weight displacement of the additional water put more stress on the crack making it open up wider. I have learned that plastic does some crazy things as the weight on the base and side walls change.
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Old 06-17-2008, 03:30 AM   #27
richfaa
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The tank is ABS material. Took a real good look at both the old and new tank while they were out of the camper during replacement. Close examination of the "crack" on my tanks made the us think that it was a manufacturing defect as the crack was a jagged tear near the very top where the tank is flanged to fit on the steel angle support. Get under there and read the part numbers off the tank and the measurements. There will also be a yellow paint letter indicating a left ot right drain.

travel star the tank vendors 574-533-0447 They are in Goshen. I suggest talking to them to make sure you get the proper tank. The tank cost 245.00. They said shipping was 132.00 (then) Note that the dealer ordered through Keystone and there was NO shipping charge, We got the tank in less that 2 weeeks. Cost of repair was just short of 800.00..(covered by my Extended service contract)
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Old 06-17-2008, 12:40 PM   #28
Dean A Van Peursem
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For some reason, even though I'm subscribed to this thread, I'm not getting notificastion of added messages. I even unsubscribed and resubscribed with no change. Something is fishy in Denmark.

Just how big a job is this to replace the black tank? $900 sounds like allot but how many hours really? And what does the new tank come with? How does one remove the belly pans that have holes cut in them for piping? Does one have to cut and redo the pipes to get the belly pans off? I see the black tank has an eventual bolt together splice which will make that a bit easier. Those who have had the leak at the vent pipe --- how and where does that enter the tank? It would seem to me that would have to be cemented in after the tank is installed and then it would be impossilbe to get to that area.
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Old 06-17-2008, 03:27 PM   #29
richfaa
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The service contract allowed 5 hours total..2 to remove and replace the under belly and 3 to replace the black tank. The dealer labor charge was 89.00 per hour.His actual labor charge was 4.08 hours..364.90.

The new tank comes with nothing...just the tank.All of the plumbing was done by the dealer at a cost of 71.87 (home depot)All of the plumbing from the inside compartment to the tank was replaced.

Total parts tank, plumbing and hardware totaled 325.87..labor was 364.90 and service contract or not would be worth every penny to me.

The tank vendor will not ship to you but will ship to a dealer..tank 245.00 shipping quoted by the vendor was 132.00(a month ago)
the was no shipping charge on the invoice when the tank was ordered via Keystone.

It took every bit of the time alloted for the dealer tech(who I know very well, we once worked for this dealer) and he had replaced many tanks..

The actual price was 729.00 43.18 of which was Ohio sales tax.


If you are very handy, know a lot about plumbing, do not mind working in a confined space, (under the camper) .it may be a job you can handle. Ole Rich is none of the above.
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Old 06-18-2008, 09:27 AM   #30
richfaa
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Just replaced the seals and springs on the Sealand Model 210 John. Straight forward job...Very easy and the thing now does not leak>>. The culprit was mineral buildup.We spent last winter in the SW and this winter in South Central Florida. I had to scrape the deposits off with a knife.. Lime-a -way is a very good product to get that stuff off..melted it away. Got to find a way to keep those deposits down. Called the vendor to ask about maintinence..Silly me I still think the vendor knows more about the product than I do.. I have heard of using many things to lubricate the seals and all of them Vaseline, WD-40 anything with a petroleum base is NOT recommended. Again if we resort to reading the instruction manual it is all there. She suggested Pam or a furniture polish between the seals.
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Old 07-02-2008, 08:04 PM   #31
Dean A Van Peursem
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Well, I've tried to pull the underbelly on the left sie to see if I could observe where the big leak is on our black tank when nearly full. For the life of me I am unable to figure out how to pull down enough of the underbelly to see much of anything. Too many pipes in the way such as the gas line to the kitchen and the sewer exit pipe. Is there some trick to this that I haven't figured out? At the moment I would just like to get in there enough just to find where it is leaking and if lucky maybe identify which tank I have currently installed. But I'm stuck. Anyonme been down this road on their own and can give me some guidance? It could be as simple as the vent pipe has come loose or something but I can't figure out how to get far enough in there to see anything of substance.

I've tried a couple of times and I'm presently resigned that I will need to get a dealers help but if there is a way for me to do some of the preliminary investigation I would at least know what I'm facing and then could anticipate what the finacial damage might be. We don't have an extended warranty and this probably will be the first out of warranty expense we have had.

Our original dealer, D & L in Wenatchee, WA, has been very helpfull in the past but in this case they are not responding at all. It is hard to beleive they are really busy right now since RV dealers are dying on the Vine here due to the high fuel prices. I work on this in spurts but I get so frustrated I have to walk away from it for awhile to regain a helathy attitude.

Then to add insult to injury this forum doesn't give me an indication of when a message has been added to a thread that I have subscribed to. Don't know what the problem is on that either. So if you respond it may be awhile before I come back on because I sometimes forget I won't get a MOC notice about new entries on a thread.

Any suggestions or comments are welcomne and desired. Thanks in advance.
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Old 07-02-2008, 08:50 PM   #32
HamRad
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Dean,

Regarding your comment about subscribing to a topic. If you go to the top of the page you will see on the right hand side several options and one of them is to "SUBSCRIBE to this topic". If you run across a topic that does not have that option you need to notify the Admins. They can get it added for you.

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Old 07-02-2008, 09:06 PM   #33
Dean A Van Peursem
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Dennis,

I have used the subscribe issue for a couple of years. A couple months ago I quit receiving notifications of when a thread I had subscribed to had a new message. Your message is the first notice I have received for over two months. it must be working again. Thanks
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Old 07-04-2008, 09:37 AM   #34
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Dean, if you unscrew the screws that hold the gas pipe hangers and make a slice from the laundry drain pipe to the edge of the belly pan material you should be able to get the panel out. The same goes for the next panel forward that the black/gray water dump pipe comes through, just make a cut from the pip hole to the nearest edge of the belly panel. I used a utility knife with a new blade and it took my about 7 or 8 passes to cut through, but then the panel came right off. When the dealer put everything back together they used a black tape like Eternobond that is very strong and permanent... Dave and Betsy
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Old 07-15-2008, 04:09 PM   #35
Dean A Van Peursem
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Rich,

Let me make sure that I understand one of your posts that there is only one size tank for our late 2006 3400RL's but can either a left or right drain. Correct? To make sure I understand the right/left issue is that as you face the rear of the RV? If I undertand correctly a left drain would be on the same side as the frnace and a right drain would be on the same side as the toilet drain and tank vent? Am I interpeting this properly? I mentioned this to the dealer we were going to get our Black tank replaced with and they went ballistic. Since we are making a 3 hour trip to our dealer and am asking them to order in advance I wanted to make sure they were ordering the right tank. For some reason that and my question about what the warranty was on the new tank sent them over the edge. I think the Service Manager was having a bad hair day. I'll see if they settle down tomorrow. Do you know if Travel Star has redesigned the tank and/or asking dealers to add additional straps and/or supports when installing this new tank. I guess I need to call Travel Star since my dealer has gone ballistic for some reason.
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Old 07-15-2008, 04:36 PM   #36
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Dean, our 340RLQ Big Sky is the same layout so Here is the way that our tanks are situated. The two front tanks, black and bathroom gray, are mounted crossways. The gray is under the bed and is about 70 inches long, 36 wide, and 10 thick. The long measurement is from side to side as is the black. The right and left designation refers to how the large drain comes out. The two front tanks are about 4 feet apart. The drains are on the road side just under the basement door. each tank has a pipe coming outfacing each other. Each pipe has a gate valve, and both pipes go into a common Y connection that goes through belly pan and to the dump fitting. If you stand by the entry steps and look straight across under the trailer you will be looking across the bottom of the black tank. I will call CW in the morning and ask which tank the ordered for me and post the answer then... Dave
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Old 07-15-2008, 05:19 PM   #37
Dean A Van Peursem
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Dave,

OK, when I had the belly pan loose on the door entrance side I was able to see the Black Tank leak which was running on the front side of the tank down past the near side of the large outlet drain for the black tank. This drain was pointed forward toward where the Gray tank would be under the bed. So then wouldn't our black tank be a right exit version? And then following your description the Grey tank would be a left exit. Correct?
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Old 07-15-2008, 05:24 PM   #38
richfaa
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Weather it is a right or left drain will be marked on your tanks usually in yellow lettering. This is very important when ordering. If you are in doubt call the tank vendor. The tank part number and measurement are marked on the tank on a white tag..This is also very important..Withgout both of those numbers you will not get the proper tank..
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Old 07-15-2008, 05:29 PM   #39
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What Rich said
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Old 07-15-2008, 05:42 PM   #40
Dean A Van Peursem
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So, are you both saying that a replacement tank should not be ordered until one can read both the lettering and the tag? If that is so I'm in trouble. The dealer we had planned to do this at is a 2 to 3 hour drive away. That would mean that I would need to pull it over there, leave it so they could identify the tank, order the right tank, wait for delivery of the tank and then install it. Then I could make the trip again to pickl it up. I sure would like to avoid that if at all possible. If I follow the instructions Dave has given, will I be able to see the markings and tag when I get the belly pan off or will I need to remove the tank to find it?
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