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12-18-2018, 11:29 AM
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#1
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Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: Bloomington
Posts: 57
M.O.C. #22743
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Caution: Propane gauges blamed for furnace ignition failure
I have been having intermittent problems with the furnace recently, and thought I would share my experience and the solution (fingers crossed).
The Problem
Intermittently, the furnace would fail to ignite. The problem seemed to occur on the coldest nights, in the wee hours. We would wake to temps in the low 60's in the coach. I could sometimes nurse things along by turning off the thermostat, waiting a few seconds, then turning it back on. However, that proved to be only a temporary solution. While the furnace might run for a few more cycles, it would ultimately fail to the point where nothing I could do would get it going again, and we would just have to endure the early morning cold with the fireplace as the only source of heat until daytime temps warmed to the point where the heat pump could be used.
With benefit of daylight, and some hints from this site and others, I removed the outside furnace panel to see what I could find. The red light blinking pattern indicated an air flow/limit fault. (I could not find a clear, authoritative explanation for the potential causes triggering that error and possible solutions.) Sometimes, when ignition failed, I could turn the furnace switch off, then back on, and it might ignite for a few cycles. I think that was basically accomplishing the same thing as turning off the thermostat inside, then turning it back on. Either method would only work temporarily, then nothing I could do would get the furnace to light.
Based on information on this site and maybe elsewhere, I wondered whether our use of magnetic covers for some of the heat registers was contributing to the problem. We stopped using them, but the intermittent ignition behavior persisted. (To conclude this particular rabbit trail of thought, the service manager later told me using a cover or other method to restrict output from a register had nothing to do with the problem, and it is perfectly alright to use them.)
Nothing else obvious stood out. There was plenty of propane on board. Switching tanks accomplished nothing. Stove burners operated fine. When we took it in for service, the mechanic could not get it to fail (of course). We took it back to our site, and on the next cold night it failed (of course).
The Solution
Back to the servicing dealership for a second visit. This time, the service manager (who was out for a doctor's appointment on the previous visit) noted we had gauges on the tanks similar to the one pictured. (Note: The image is from a Lowe's product, but ours were not purchased there. Just using it as a representative example.) His experience over many years with such gauges is that they cause more harm than good by eventually restricting the flow of propane. He removed the gauges. Since then, the furnace has been working fine. It hasn't yet been 24 hours, so if something changes, I'll update this post. But we made it through a cold night last without any issues -- and used the magnetic register covers.
I'm posting this because others may want to be aware of the potential issues with these propane gauges. We're just getting started with our RV adventure, and we made it through a few weeks before the problem described above began. Looks like we'll toss the gauges and use more rudimentary methods to determine the levels of propane in our tanks.
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12-18-2018, 12:00 PM
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#2
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Lake Havasu City AZ.
Posts: 1,811
M.O.C. #10552
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I learn something new every day. Thank you.
__________________
Wayne and Ann Moore
2015 Ford F-350 King Ranch
Firestone air bags, bed saver.
Add 40 GAL tank in bed.
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12-18-2018, 12:07 PM
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#3
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Tacoma
Posts: 1,567
M.O.C. #20475
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I had a buddy that had those and had all kinds of problems till he took them off!
__________________
Bob & Carol Washington St
2017 HC HM352RL 2018 Dodge 3500 laramie CC LB 4x4
Curt Q25 with puck system, Factory air bags
Happy Trails
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12-18-2018, 12:13 PM
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#4
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Pensacola (mail forward service)
Posts: 3,198
M.O.C. #13740
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I bought the trump hand held unit to keep tabs on the propane level in the tanks. Great device.
__________________
2012 F350 6.7 L dually, 2013 3800RE with 6 pt leveling, Sumitomo 17.5" load range h tires, Samsung 18 cu ft residential fridge, 8k Morryde I.S. with disc brakes. Full timing since 2012.
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12-18-2018, 03:08 PM
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#5
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Montana Master
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hagerstown
Posts: 865
M.O.C. #16013
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https://www.amazon.com/AP-Products-1...evel+indicator
I bought these units seems to work very well and has saved my butt more than once. Just a little finicky after you put the sensors on the bottom of the tank you have to let the gaseous liquid settle after moving the tank before you try the inside gauge, I mean like 5 mins before it finally stops sloshing around. The other possible problem, some tanks (in the minority) do not have a small flat area on the bottom in the center of the tank to mount it the outside sensor on.
They work for me no more guessing.
__________________
2018.5 3791 Rear Den Montana, on the lake no 3rd A/C, Mini Split, just do it
Electric Brakes ..... Disk Brakes, it`s the only way
F350 Ford Dually 4:10`s w/bags (payload 5595 lbs) Sumo Springs 63 gal aux tank
Reese Goosebox Mor/Ryde SRE 4000 X Factors Monroe shocks.... real smooth ride
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12-19-2018, 12:32 AM
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#6
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2017
Location: new caney
Posts: 1,050
M.O.C. #19873
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I have the same gauges and have had no problem with furnace but found these not to be very accurate so removed them. I have automatic change over so when one gets empty and changes over I have the empty one refilled within a couple of days. It helps that I have 40# bottles so I don't have to fill as often as the 30# bottles. Thanks for sharing the problem.
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12-19-2018, 07:45 AM
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#7
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2018
Location: livingston,tx
Posts: 558
M.O.C. #21685
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We have used the same type of gage on a 5 gal. tank, not very accurate.
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12-19-2018, 08:36 AM
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#8
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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We use the guage that came with the RV 12 years not a problem.
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12-19-2018, 02:30 PM
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#9
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Hixson
Posts: 3,436
M.O.C. #11397
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We are having the same problem with our furnace with the same exact symptoms. Dealer checked it and couldn't get it to fail and I have replaced the pigtails and regulator/auto changeover which made no difference. We do not use any type of gauge for propane as we just fill empty tank as soon as the switch over has occurred. I have also tried a new Dinosaur brand board in it. It's driving me nuts!
__________________
2018.5 Montana 3791RD
Full Timers 9/1/2010 through 1/16/2020.
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12-19-2018, 03:25 PM
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#10
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Site Team
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Oro Valley
Posts: 3,923
M.O.C. #20477
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeBeFulltime
We are having the same problem with our furnace with the same exact symptoms. Dealer checked it and couldn't get it to fail and I have replaced the pigtails and regulator/auto changeover which made no difference. We do not use any type of gauge for propane as we just fill empty tank as soon as the switch over has occurred. I have also tried a new Dinosaur brand board in it. It's driving me nuts!
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Have you tried turning both tanks off and then opening the valves very slowly? Also set the thermostat up high - the temp error on the stat can be as high as 5-8 degrees.
__________________
Zack and Donna plus Millie and Ranger
2018 3160RL
"Life is too short to stay indoors, enjoy the ride!"
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12-21-2018, 07:16 AM
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#11
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Hixson
Posts: 3,436
M.O.C. #11397
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ Traveler
Have you tried turning both tanks off and then opening the valves very slowly? Also set the thermostat up high - the temp error on the stat can be as high as 5-8 degrees.
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Thanks, but have tried those.
__________________
2018.5 Montana 3791RD
Full Timers 9/1/2010 through 1/16/2020.
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12-21-2018, 07:47 AM
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#12
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Montana Master
Join Date: May 2018
Location: livingston,tx
Posts: 558
M.O.C. #21685
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Our furnace started acting up yesterday , after inspection I found a dirt dobber nest in the exhaust pipe, still ran intermittently, cleaned carbon build up off of igniter, all is well runs normal.
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12-21-2018, 03:52 PM
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#13
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Marion
Posts: 234
M.O.C. #22281
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I had to have a mobile tech fix my furnace. He said the sail switch wasn't catching enough air and was also sticking to the side of the housing. He bent it a little and it's worked every since ($200 later). He also said if that didn't fix it for good the next call was on him.
He said the furnace was a new design which he really liked except for the way the sail switch sat.
__________________
2019 Montana High Country 384BR
2018 Ram cclb 4x4 6.7 cummins/aisin dually
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12-23-2018, 01:36 PM
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#14
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Montana Master
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: North Lake Tahoe
Posts: 639
M.O.C. #18510
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I have never run out of propane and have never used a gauge. I just keep one tank closed, and if i run out of propane in one, which I did once, I would then turn on the other tank, and get the first tank filled again. So my backup was always having a full tank by not keeping both tanks open and then being surprised that they were both empty.
__________________
2017 3820FK Legacy Edition full body paint Montana, For Sale this November, 2018. 2016 Ram 3500 long bed Dually Cummins Turbo with air bags
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12-23-2018, 02:50 PM
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#15
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Marion
Posts: 234
M.O.C. #22281
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vipermanden
I have never run out of propane and have never used a gauge. I just keep one tank closed, and if i run out of propane in one, which I did once, I would then turn on the other tank, and get the first tank filled again. So my backup was always having a full tank by not keeping both tanks open and then being surprised that they were both empty.
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That's what I do. Plus I have 2 extra 30 pounders. All 4 30 pounders are on the ground under the fifth wheel. I bought pigtails to connect the 2 tanks so I don't have to lift them in and out since I'm living in it pretty much full time while at the refinery and using a lot of propane in the winter.
I bought the hose extensions when I still had the Rockwood Windjammer and was at the refinery last year, since changing the propane tanks on that trailer was a major pain. The extensions have gauges on them which I pretty much pay no attention to. I lift the tanks to check their weight and look at the switchover valve to see if one is empty, then I change it.
__________________
2019 Montana High Country 384BR
2018 Ram cclb 4x4 6.7 cummins/aisin dually
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12-23-2018, 05:07 PM
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#16
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Established Member
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Manitou Springs
Posts: 16
M.O.C. #21185
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I've been having the same issues for a year now. I don't have gauges on my tanks, I've had everything but the furnace replaced, still no luck. It's back in the shop for the 5th time, hope they figure it out this time. I love my Monty, but damn is getting frustrating.
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12-23-2018, 05:45 PM
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#17
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Austin
Posts: 2,410
M.O.C. #21044
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Propane guage
I had the same experience on my Laredo (before Montana).
By the way I have barely used propane gauge for sale cheap.
__________________
MikenDebbie Aggie ‘77 in the sticks near Austin TX
2019 Chevy 3500 High Country DRW
2018 Montana 3921FB
Aussie Gus + Texas Heeler Jimmy
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12-23-2018, 09:57 PM
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#18
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: somerville
Posts: 135
M.O.C. #12636
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Tank Check works great.
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12-23-2018, 10:03 PM
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#19
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Seasoned Camper
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Denver
Posts: 79
M.O.C. #10843
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My furnace had issues a couple years ago, but it turned out that the large propane tank I rented had an excessive amount of ethyl mercaptan (the stuff than makes it stink) and it filled the propane lines on my RV. I had to disconnect everything and drain it, then take apart the furnace to clean the nozel leading into the burner. I cleaned out a couple wasp nests while I was at it. The stove still gives me some problems.
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12-24-2018, 05:29 AM
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#20
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Montana Fan
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Riverview
Posts: 178
M.O.C. #20713
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bshgto: we have the propane monitor (Tank Check LP with Monitor Kit) on our tanks--they didn't work for us. LP tanks were empty but the monitor said they were full. The bottom of our LP tanks are rounded where we stuck the "guage". Since the bottom of the tanks are rounded, is this why the monitor didn't work?
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