Wind generators

[Rondo]

Administrator- Didn't know where to post this so change locations if needed!!
Went down to the Nebraska State Fair yesterday and while walking around the grounds saw a "small" windmill for generating electricity for a household. The blade diameter was no bigger than 4 ft and the gentleman that talked to us said it was more than enough to supply a stick house all the electricity it needed and still be able to sell some back to the power company. He also said they make one that fits on or works with an RV or camper. It is smaller yet and works great. He has one either on or for his fifth. I'm going to check into this more and maybe will never need to hook up to power again! Sounds to good to be true! He said it uses two deep cycle marine batteries for the storage so it would work well for us with the Monties and etc.

[HamRad]

Rondo,

There is no reason that a properly sized windmill would not work to supply a lot of power. I have seen a couple of the RV windmill setups. One was attached to the RV and the other was setup by itself. It had a lot of guy wires to hold it in place.

From what I understand there are a couple of problems. One is noise from the operation of the fan itself and second is vibration. I suppose the vibration issue would be most noticeable if the device is mounted on the RV.

One of the nice features of a windmill is that you will get power both day and night as long as there is a wind blowing. This is in contrast to a solar system which only produces power when the sun is up.

Setup is another problem. If you move a lot it could be a real hassle to setup and breakdown. For folks who spend a lot of time in one spot I'd think they'd be almost ideal.

They are not cheap. I guess they do not take a lot of maintenance.

Let us know if you end up getting such a setup.

HamRad

[HughM]

I've seen wind generators on boats and I heard them too!! They do create some noise with the blades turning. They might be OK in a remote campground but I doubt your next door neighbor at a dry campground would enjoy it as much as you do.
Hugh

[Rondo]

Dennis and Hugh-- the one we saw yesterday was very quiet and he had it mounted on a 2 X 4 frame something like a small billboard! We were standing right underneath it (it was about 4 ft above our heads) and there was enough breeze to turn it even in the middle of the fair grounds and it made no noise what so ever. It was spinning pretty good too. I am assuming that the ones for the RVs are about 3 ft in diameter or less. He guaranteed us that it would put out enough or more power than we would actually need. Don't know what you do with the balance in the RV or Monte but I guess it would have some sort of cut off switch or something when you weren't using it to full capacity and your batteries were fully charged. If you use it at the stick home you can set it up with the power company you have to put power into their lines with a reverse meter and you get paid for it then. I'll try and get more info on it and post it if I can! It seems the way to go especially if you're boondocking or in State Parks or rally's that don't have electric hookups!

[HamRad]

Rondo,

I'd be very careful about believing everything I was told about a product from someone who is selling it! But I know they are making huge advances in this technology.

And yes. There is a limiting device on the system. Once it gets to a certain level it will kick on the limiter. There is also a speed limiter on the fan. If the wind gets too powerful the device will kick it into neutral. This prevents the windmill from burning up.

You would want to check and double check laws and regs for mounting a system in a residential area. I suspect there are severe limits on windmills in such areas. In CA the power companies are required to buy excess energy from solar and windmill systems. It's my understanding that it takes them a long time to actually get you hooked up to such a process. But they do do it eventually.

I would think state and federal parks would also have some regulations about using such a device. I did see several systems out at Quartzsite but that is BLM land. I do not believe there are any or many regs about usage there. Or maybe they just look the other way.

Let us know what you find out. It is an interesting topic.

HamRad

[Exnavydiver]

I just googled RV wind generating systems and got several sites. I found a promising unit that is made for house or RV, it has a 46" diameter blade which makes each blade is about 23inches long. It has to be mounted on a 1.5 inch schedule 40 steel pipe. Needs no controller as it is internal. 400 watt output at 28mph wind, startup speed is 8mph. Can be used either 12 volt or 24 volt, 36 volt and 48 volt units are in production. 710.00 complete and 895.00 for marine model if you are going to be within 20 miles of saltwater. Only difference is powder paint and anodizing for exposure to salt. Whole unit weighs 14 LBS... Dave

[Mrs. CountryGuy]

Well, this sure is an interesting subject!!

And, I know just the windy place, snicker, RGV.

But, I do wonder what commercial campgrounds, or state ones for that matter, will have to say about this.

Will be looking forward to reading more MOC experiences and tales on this one!

[Exnavydiver]

Solar systems producing 240 watts cost in the realm of 3900.00 dollars. If this small unit produces 400 watts for 710 it is a no brainer. Although the wind doesn't always blow but the sun usually comes up in the morning so it is a judgment call... Dave

[Rondo]

Why would a CG care if you have a wind generator on your unit or not! It just saves them some power usage even though they charge you for it! I'm rather surprised that some of the CGs don't put something like this in to cut their costs. I'd think that having two or three of the smaller sized units around a campground could handle nearly all of the pads in it especially if it has any wind or breeze at all. Here in Nebraska we almost always have some breeze and I know they would work here! I will be looking into one for the farm and I know the local power company would go along with me also. They have already gone with a company here and put one up to supply the company with all their electricity and still have plenty to put online! Of course this is one of the BIG units with the blades that come in on flatbed semis! We were talking to another group down at the fair also and they are pushing the use of wind generators and looks like it's going to be manditory to have so much of each states required electrical usage be from wind generators in the next 10 years or so. Minnesota and Iowa, here inb the Midwest, along with Texas and California are leading the way for the states right now!
Dave where did you find that one for the $7-800+ range? As soon as I contact the gentleman on the one at the fair I'll post it also!

[HamRad]

Rondo,

Following your logic about CGs allowing windmills you'd think they'd welcome gas/diesel/propane generators. We all know that is not the case. In most CGs you are not allowed to use your generator.

I can think of several reasons CGs would not allow use of windmills. One would be the sight of them. Second would be the noise they make..... regardless of how quiet the one you saw at the fairgrounds. Third would be possible liability issues.

Don't get me wrong I'm in favor of them. I'm just pointing out possible problems.

By all means get one for your farm. I saw many farms in your area as we drove to the first MOC Rally. Many of those farms had one or more windmills. I do not know about the mandatory usage of these devices but I'm in favor of that.

You, indeed, live in a part of our country that can truly benefit from this technology. Go for it. Just check out any possible rules and regulations that might effect its usage.

Good luck.

Dennis

[Rondo]

Oh we have windmills alright, but unfortunately they are all for pumping water. We no longer have a working one at the farm but when it did work, we could pump water to all of the stock tanks and also pump it to the house if the power went out! Didn't get any hot water because of the lack of electricity but did have it to drink and heat up for baths and etc. Here around the Omaha area (farm is about 40 miles west of here) we have about three of the big windmill
generators. The State Capital, Lincoln, has two of them that supply power for some of their needs and as I said earlier, the Omaha Public Power District here has one at a private plant in Valley, NE. If you go north of Des Moines, IA and you get close to the Minnesota border, you run across miles and miles of the generators. Nebraska is kind of backwards or slow in their development of things-- can tell that by the casinos on the east side of the Missouri River in Council Bluffs, IA.. The fine people of Nebraska won't vote in casino gambling but if you go over there at lest 3/4 of the vehicles have Nebraska plates on them! Dah!! OK, I'll get off my soapbox!
I know I have to get permission to put one up but I've seen them before at farms and it shouldn't be to hard to talk the local power company into it since it will benefit them also by putting a generator in.
Yah, I can see the point of a CG not wanting the gas generators but if the wind ones were as quite as the one yesterday, there would be not problems on noise at all! It was turning pretty fast and we couldn't even hear the "whirl" of the blades. I will definately be looking into this unit. I'll keep you all posted!

[HamRad]

Rondo,

If the windmills I saw were bringing up water then they were bringing it up from China! No. The ones I saw were the huge electrical producing ones..... not water ones.

HamRad

[SlickWillie]

Problem I see with these small units are that they provide DC voltage. That would make you need a large storage bank of batteries. You could then use an inverter for AC voltage, but current would be limited. I've not seen the large commercial wind turbines, other than on a trailer or barge, but my suspicion is they actually generate AC voltage.

I suppose in the proper climate, where you don't need to run the AC unit, they might work OK for boon docking. But, is there enough wind in any of those places? Perhaps they might work well here in the winter season. We definitely have the wind. With the cost of electricity now, it might be worth a shot. We're currently paying 17 cents per kwh now.

On the noise issue, I don't see a problem there. Many of the sailboats here in the harbors have the marine wind generators, and I have yet to hear any really noisy ones. Of course, I don't hear a lot of things I used to.

[mobrownies]

For safety reasons, most states and jurisdictions have rules regarding connecting generators to the grid. On a one-way system an electrician can throw a switch, breaker or fuse and know that the downstream line is dead. However that would not be the case on a two-way system where you have a generator that could back-feed the line. Like a back-flow preventor on a water system, there are probably equipment out there that can prevent electrical back-flow for a price.

400 watt output is more than enough to keep batteries up and run a few 12volt accessories, but it won't operate a refrigerator, microwave, water heater or airconditioner. So power management would be a challenge. IF you are into boon docking, something like this could be great.

[Steve and Brenda]

Just be careful of what salesmen at county fairs tell you. Which power utility buys back DC voltage? None. I bet that 99.8% of our homes run on AC power. I don't know of many stick houses that run on DC voltage as the battery bank would have to be tremendous and require some robust power inverters to supply the 200 amp current draw the average American household requires. I have an UPS in my lab that provides back-up power to our entire building and the number of 24 volt truck batteries and voltage inverters occupy the space 2 car garage. They replace these truck batteries twice a year by the way.

Wind generators must create 120 volts AC at 60 cycles-per-second frequency in order to be sold to a utility. In order to do that you need a constant speed drive transmission to regulate the fan's unpredictable rotational speed into a constant generator speed. If commercial turbines could be made smaller and still generate adequate power you think the route from West Texas to North Dakota would have smaller windmills?

[MacDR50]

I have a ex-navy buddy who has a 10 acre homestead just north of Prescott Ontario. He is a compulsive tinker and is always looking for some restoration project. A number of years ago he bought windmill generator at an junk sale along with the original tower. It was built in the 30's. Here is a link to a site that gives you some information on the unit. http://www.wincharger.com/ He has it charging four 100 A/HR reserve AGM batteries which are connected to his electrical system in two out buildings through an inverter and an automatic switch. It also provides power directly to two low voltage pumps that aerate his trout pond. It took him over a year to recondition the unit but it works with very little maintenance. I saw very similar models featured in Harrow Smith magazine a few years back. BTW he has since found and reconditioned a water pump wind mill.

[Dave Anderson]

Rondo, Did you get the name of the Co. produceing it or a website? As a boondocker I'd be VERY interested in a wind gen. that small Solar is great ,but on cloudy days no amps. BUT usually lots of wind , particularly at Quartzsite! Sounds like a great alternitive. ................Dave A

[chas]

quote:Originally posted by Rondo

Administrator- Didn't know where to post this so change locations if needed!!
Went down to the Nebraska State Fair yesterday and while walking around the grounds saw a "small" windmill for generating electricity for a household. The blade diameter was no bigger than 4 ft and the gentleman that talked to us said it was more than enough to supply a stick house all the electricity it needed and still be able to sell some back to the power company. He also said they make one that fits on or works with an RV or camper. It is smaller yet and works great. He has one either on or for his fifth. I'm going to check into this more and maybe will never need to hook up to power again! Sounds to good to be true! He said it uses two deep cycle marine batteries for the storage so it would work well for us with the Monties and etc.

[Exnavydiver]

Google Air-X Wind Turbine

[clutch]

I saw two wind generators in Parker Az last winter. They both made a lot of noise and their neighbors were glad when they left. The ones I saw had blades about 2' in diameter and they were spinning 24 hours a day.