Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Montana Owners Club - Keystone Montana 5th Wheel Forum > GENERAL DISCUSSIONS > General Discussions about our Montanas
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-03-2020, 07:46 PM   #1
dieselguy
Montana Master
 
dieselguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Haysville
Posts: 4,261
M.O.C. #3085
I'm just not getting it

I know the MOC has always run heavy on real life opinions by full and long timers, but there has to be a bunch of us that aren't. After going to a couple of RV shows recently I'm a bit puzzled by the majority of floor plans currently out in the $50,000+ price range. There is little usable counter space, limited storage for pots - pans - dishes - drink glasses - appliances ____________ BUT bye Ned there is a 30 cubic foot bottom freezer residential fridge in near every one?????????? Yeah, I know some of you would trade your first born before going without one of these refrigeration giants. For the rest of us unless dropping down to a lower price level RV ... why must we sacrifice counter and storage space to satisfy what's trendy?
 
dieselguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 07:56 PM   #2
DQDick
Site Team
 
DQDick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Wilsey
Posts: 18,799
M.O.C. #11455
The only thing that got us to trade our 2010 for a 2017 was more usable counter and storage space, but it was the only model we'd seen in years that we felt that way about.
__________________
Dick, Joyce, Diego, Picatso and Gustav
2017 3720 RL, and 2013 HC 343RL
Pullrite Hitch, IS, Disk Brakes, 3rd AC, Winegard Traveler, Bathroom door mod, Dometic 320, couch for desk swap, replaced chairs, sun screens, added awnings, etc.
DQDick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 08:25 PM   #3
Jamesb
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Boone
Posts: 311
M.O.C. #21011
You are soooo right. Lol. They don’t really look like they even fit right. If they would just improve the existing gas/electric models I would be happy. But that’s another thread. Storage is hard to find in the kitchen area for pots and pans.
Won’t be long, they’ll be putting full size residential ranges/ovens in Montana’s, like Luxe does.
__________________
2018 Montana HC 362RD
2016 Chevrolet 3500 Duramax HD SRW
Jamesb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 09:05 PM   #4
jeffba
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bastrop
Posts: 2,892
M.O.C. #20753
Isn't the RV and res refer both 18 CU feet?
__________________
Mocha, one-eyed toothless, hurricane survivor, Pirate dog
2019 20th Anniversary Edition 3701LK
B&W 20K for Ford OEM Puck
2018 Ford F-350 Lariat CCLB PSD DRW KJ5CQH
jeffba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 09:49 PM   #5
socoinc
Montana Fan
 
socoinc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: Nampa
Posts: 114
M.O.C. #21247
I don’t understand it either. I’m guessing most of the people on this site are retired husband & wife. I could see a bigger refrigerator with kids. But with 2 people it’s a little much. Our friends have a Residential frig. I looked in the back & there was something in a Tupperware from when Reagan was President.
socoinc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 10:47 PM   #6
Texan
Montana Master
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: new caney
Posts: 1,050
M.O.C. #19873
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffba View Post
Isn't the RV and res refer both 18 CU feet?
I have the rv fridge and it is I believe 12 or 13 cubic feet. I wish it were 18 cubic feet.
Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-2020, 10:56 PM   #7
Last2Die
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Menifee
Posts: 1,109
M.O.C. #22986
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffba View Post
Isn't the RV and res refer both 18 CU feet?
Mine is 18.3 cuft. pretty large !!

https://norcold.com/product/norcold-...-refrigerator/

Tony
__________________
2018 3920fb 2020 GMC Denali 3500 4x4 Duramax, 10 speed Allison. LB SRW, Firestone air bags with Airlift wireless onboard compressor. Anderson Ultimate Hitch. MX4 folding cover. 50gal titan in bed transfer tank. Onan 6500 lp genset installed by me ! Had: 2 HF 3500 Inverters with Parallel Kit
Last2Die is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 12:03 AM   #8
jsb5717
Montana Master
 
jsb5717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 1,455
M.O.C. #23668
Actually, not all have the extra large fridge. I've seen some with the more standard 8CF fridge with an extra pantry. I've also seen many rigs with nice, large pantries in several of Keystone's sub $50K offering. I hear what your saying but I believe there are good options for storage out there. But I guess that depends on what you would consider "good storage". What size trailer are you looking for? What's your budget range?
__________________
Jeff & Sandi (and Teddy - 7lb Schnorkie)
2018 Montana HC 305RL / HW Progressive EMS
2015 RAM 3500 Laramie Longhorn Crew Cab 4x4 DRW / Demco Recon Hitch on RAM Puck Ball
jsb5717 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 07:27 AM   #9
Dave W
Montana Master
 
Dave W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 1,788
M.O.C. #14547
The very reason we have a 343RL High Country is that it has a REAL 'L' shaped counter instead of a very small island kitchen that virtually all other 5ers seemed to have when we purchased it 2014. And it has 'only' a 12 cu ft Norcold reefer which works out just fine for the two of us. It also doesn't have a pantry which was added later in the year but we still have more storage space then we use. Bling - not much really compared to many others we looked at before purchase and since. OMG it only has one bathroom = how many do you really need for 2 people in 38-40 feet.


It's all in you needs and expectations. Ours evidently are pretty small compared to many others so I try not to be too judgemental on others tho do fail on occasion
__________________
Dave W
2014 Montana High Country 343RL (Sold!)
2011 Ford 6.7 Lariat CCLB (Went to PU Heaven)
2019 F150SC XLT SE Sport,w/full tow package
Dave W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 09:34 AM   #10
mtlakejim
Montana Master
 
mtlakejim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bee Branch
Posts: 2,620
M.O.C. #20693
I don't see where going Residential vs RV fridge makes that big a difference in counter space. Our floor plan comes in two versions (HC381TH and HC380TH). The ONLY difference in the two is one comes with Residential and other comes with RV fridge. The counter and storage space is EXACTLY the same on both. More to the point the Fridge space is exactly the same size as well (but I am fairly sure the interior of the residential is larger). So "I don't get" the argument that somehow the "trend" towards Residential fridges is have a major impact on cabinet space? I will put the one caveat out there that on our floor plan the fridge is slide out on opposite wall from the kitchen countertop (no island in this model. And since a residential costs considerably less than an RV fridge I would think it would leave more money for more cabinets?


When we bought our unit we had NO idea that we would be full timers. We bought it to use on weekends to pursue our passion for kayaking. It was great for that application but is somewhat lacking as a full time unit (primarily due to relatively small bathroom and lack of kitchen counter space). I am fairly convinced that they build campers for families and Class A for couples. And honestly to a large extent that makes sense. You rarely see a family in a big Class A. I will argue one thing though. If you don't understand why full timers prefer a residential then your obviously not a full timer!!!


I do agree that there needs to be a LOT more variety in what they offer. Tastes and needs run across a wide range. For instance there is a trend out there with some RV builders towards white painted cabinets while another is going towards gray laminates. The wife and I really love natural wood finishes. Granted that isn't a floor plan issue, just an appearance one.


I also agree that there could be more storage and counter space built into these units. One of the things that I have noticed on the 381TH Facebook page is all the cabinet mods being done (especially in the kitchen area). If your handy there is always the option to add what you want......


Overall I think the trends on RVs is dictated by the industries perception of what they can build the cheapest and move the most of. The Economics of Scale is how they are looking at it. If they can build a thousand of the exact same thing and sell them all. Why would they build two of something else? The less options they offer the cheaper they can build them. The cheaper they build them the less they cost and the more folks can afford them or the more profit margin they have.
__________________
James & Irene Wilson
Bee Branch, AR.
2017 Ram 1 ton diesel duallyCrew Cab/Long Bed
2018 Montana High Country 381TH Garage Full of Toys
mtlakejim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 09:53 AM   #11
JABURKHOLDER
Montana Master
 
JABURKHOLDER's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Cuyahoga Falls
Posts: 699
M.O.C. #18572
I suppose if you've got the time and the money, you could go custom built.
__________________
ATC/NAC Jerry A. Burkholder, USN (RET.)

Rule #1. The Chief is always right.
Rule #2. When in doubt, refer to rule #1.
JABURKHOLDER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 10:19 AM   #12
mtlakejim
Montana Master
 
mtlakejim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bee Branch
Posts: 2,620
M.O.C. #20693
Quote:
Originally Posted by JABURKHOLDER View Post
I suppose if you've got the time and the money, you could go custom built.
And you know full well that is what we have been doing. Although lately the idea of a sticks and bricks in Florida has crept into the picture. We are now looking at possibly buying a second home on the water instead of another camper.
__________________
James & Irene Wilson
Bee Branch, AR.
2017 Ram 1 ton diesel duallyCrew Cab/Long Bed
2018 Montana High Country 381TH Garage Full of Toys
mtlakejim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 10:27 AM   #13
JABURKHOLDER
Montana Master
 
JABURKHOLDER's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Cuyahoga Falls
Posts: 699
M.O.C. #18572
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtlakejim View Post
And you know full well that is what we have been doing.
Actually, I do not know that.

I was using "you" in the plural sense. Nothing personal.
__________________
ATC/NAC Jerry A. Burkholder, USN (RET.)

Rule #1. The Chief is always right.
Rule #2. When in doubt, refer to rule #1.
JABURKHOLDER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 10:34 AM   #14
mtlakejim
Montana Master
 
mtlakejim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bee Branch
Posts: 2,620
M.O.C. #20693
Quote:
Originally Posted by JABURKHOLDER View Post
Actually, I do not know that.

I was using "you" in the plural sense. Nothing personal.
We are all good. No worries


You are correct though that buying a custom $$$ is only way to get exactly what ya want. Even then it depends on what you consider "exactly". Otherwise your depending on what an RV builder thinks he can sell the most of. Its about compromise for the buyer. Same could be said for buying a house that is already built.
__________________
James & Irene Wilson
Bee Branch, AR.
2017 Ram 1 ton diesel duallyCrew Cab/Long Bed
2018 Montana High Country 381TH Garage Full of Toys
mtlakejim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 11:36 AM   #15
Teri M
Established Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Roscoe
Posts: 10
M.O.C. #23672
Frankly though, when we visited Europe, most of their refrigerators are quite small. They only shop for about three days of fresh food as opposed to Americans which shop for a week or more at a time. Maybe look at it that way and see it as a better way to eat healthier! I have a tendency to put way too much food in my fridge both at home and in the RV and then throw too much out. Often when RV'ing, we tend to eat out a bit more just trying the cuisine in different areas of the country and therefore I don't use in time, all that I have bought according to my weekly menus. I seriously need to learn to live more day to day and look for spontaneity. Maybe that should be my New Year's Resolution today as it is my birthday too! lol
Teri M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 11:56 AM   #16
mtlakejim
Montana Master
 
mtlakejim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bee Branch
Posts: 2,620
M.O.C. #20693
Quote:
Originally Posted by Teri M View Post
Frankly though, when we visited Europe, most of their refrigerators are quite small. They only shop for about three days of fresh food as opposed to Americans which shop for a week or more at a time. Maybe look at it that way and see it as a better way to eat healthier! I have a tendency to put way too much food in my fridge both at home and in the RV and then throw too much out. Often when RV'ing, we tend to eat out a bit more just trying the cuisine in different areas of the country and therefore I don't use in time, all that I have bought according to my weekly menus. I seriously need to learn to live more day to day and look for spontaneity. Maybe that should be my New Year's Resolution today as it is my birthday too! lol
Everyone is different but just so you understand, there are a lot of us who are full time staying in one spot (our RV has been parked for a year in same spot and is likely to be here for another 3-4 years). In those situations, the RV is your home and as such more room in a Fridge is not a luxury but essential. And just so you really get an idea of how we use a fridge, our sticks and bricks home back in Arkansas where we will retire to has 2 full sized refrigerators and 2 chest freezers. If we build the metal workshop I plan to we will have a third fridge in it.

We tend to buy meat in larger packages (or even 1/4 cow) and divide it up in vac and seal bags. Likewise we often have fairly good amount of wild game meat and fish. And then there is the feeder bread we buy for ducks and fish on our pond (shopping cart at a time).

We have learned to trim back and be more minimalist but it isn't by choice.
__________________
James & Irene Wilson
Bee Branch, AR.
2017 Ram 1 ton diesel duallyCrew Cab/Long Bed
2018 Montana High Country 381TH Garage Full of Toys
mtlakejim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 12:54 PM   #17
Teri M
Established Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Roscoe
Posts: 10
M.O.C. #23672
Thumbs up

Wow! That's a lot of refrigerators! Yeah, I wasn't thinking about full-timers. I'm definitely not a minimalist! lol We have two refrigerators and three freezers in our house too. I have't bought a 1/4 or 1/2 cow in a while though. All my kids are grown and the one who eats the most lives in China now. So I'm just trying to downsize as much as I can. Not out of the whole minimalist trend, but because we are getting older and simply don't have the energy to maintain so much stuff anymore. I would love to go full-time but can't talk my husband into it yet. We seriously want to move and start a new chapter in our lives but haven't figured out exactly where we want to move to yet but it is fun moving around in the camper to figure it out.
Teri M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 04:14 PM   #18
jimandlaurie
Montana Master
 
jimandlaurie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Puyallup
Posts: 512
M.O.C. #12948
Send a message via AIM to jimandlaurie Send a message via MSN to jimandlaurie Send a message via Yahoo to jimandlaurie
I'm kinda with ya on not getting it, but like everything MOC there are endless combinations of floorplans, features, add ons , and modifications with Montanas with different price ranges and of course ,new versus used options.
As for refrigerators, we did not want and our dealer even recommended not getting a residential unit considering our current and future RVing lifestyle. They do not stock Montanas with residential refers and only get them if the customer insists and custom orders it, as they have had non-stop problems with them.
That being said, this refer debate looks similar to , tire, Tow rigs and a couple other subjects on the forums.
Maybe that's why RV Shows are a good source of ideas and confusion too...lol.
__________________
2018 3820FK Legacy Package
2013 3750fl
2019 Chevrolet 3500HD High Country Dually
jimandlaurie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 05:00 PM   #19
dieselguy
Montana Master
 
dieselguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Haysville
Posts: 4,261
M.O.C. #3085
So far, responses have been what I anticipated. Full timers prefer the giant residential refrigeration units because that is their home ... I totally understand. But the two things I was trying to point discussion to was there are a boatload of us out here that are not full timers and don't need a RV fridge bigger than the one in our house. Two ... despite a reply a few up, most residential fridges in this years offerings of $50K units at the RV shows are huge and DO take up considerably more room than a gas RV fridge. There is no storage drawer under them because they are ceiling to floor. Usually a residential fridge install deletes the small but deep pantry drawers to the side of a gas RV fridge. Granted, the designers sometimes just move the pantry to another place, but that is a take away of something else's dimensions. Now if you go down say $15K in price range ... the residential fridges do come smaller. I'm not looking for a new fiver as what we have is satisfying and paid for ... this fridge thing just has me spittin nails for some reason ... Ha!
dieselguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-04-2020, 05:35 PM   #20
jsb5717
Montana Master
 
jsb5717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 1,455
M.O.C. #23668
Like everything else, do your research and buy what best suits your needs. As it is it's pretty remarkable what they squeeze into 350ish square feet of living space.

Our newer 5er came with the 12 CF RV fridge, which hit the "just right" mark for us. All of our previous rigs had smaller fridges. When we'd vacation for a week with the family we'd always pack an additional smaller, dorm style fridge. Now we don't need to so we're delighted with the larger fridge.

What doesn't make sense to me is why all of the new rigs have king size mattresses in them. Talk about wasting limited space! We took ours out and put in a queen...much better room around the bed. At least it's better for us.

Different strokes...
__________________
Jeff & Sandi (and Teddy - 7lb Schnorkie)
2018 Montana HC 305RL / HW Progressive EMS
2015 RAM 3500 Laramie Longhorn Crew Cab 4x4 DRW / Demco Recon Hitch on RAM Puck Ball
jsb5717 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Montana RV, Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:30 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.