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Old 03-16-2012, 02:49 AM   #1
racerjoe
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2012 super duty (gas)

Does anyone use a 2011 or 2012 super duty with the new v8? the one that they replaced the v10 with? Want to order a new one,not sure if towing power is the same or as they say better.
Would like a diesel,but at this time do not have enough use for one to justify extra expense. Only use a total of maybe 4000 mile a year.
I figure this one will get me until traveling will get more frequent.
whats your thoughts???
 
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Old 03-16-2012, 03:26 AM   #2
1retired06
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Diesels are expensive, particularly if unnecessary. Not knowledgable on how Ford is getting more power out of 8 cylinders than they did with 10, but I would look carefully at the weight you are or anticipate towing and distance. Looked around the park here, no 2011 above gassers to ask.
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Old 03-16-2012, 06:25 AM   #3
racerjoe
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thanks for looking. I think they have gotten these motors to put out about 400 pds of torque. we have a 2950rk which max's out at about 11500, Our towing is all within 150 miles and no long trips planned for quite a while. you know somebody has to work,(feel sorry for dw ) we have a sd v-10 now and it does the job well,just want to move up till we both retire and then move to a diesel for traveling.
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Old 03-16-2012, 08:16 AM   #4
Art-n-Marge
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A few things to consider.... whatever torque a gasser provides, the diesel (405#s you mention above is about half what the diesel provides at 800#) will be better translating to better towing and pulling.

When you look at the power charts, the gasser doesn't start reaching it's best range until you are at its highest RPMs (4500), which means the gasser is almost maxed out as it approaches it's best performance. The diesel reaches its power range early in RPMs (1600) and this means as the engine RPMs are increased there is plenty of power to spare up the RPM range. This is one reason why diesels don't have to struggle and whine anywhere near a gasser when the strongest pulling is needed. Finally, the diesel uses less fuel at its strongest where the gasser will get sucked dry much quicker. Your MPGs will vary.

There are plenty of times where one "settles" for a gasser for cost or infrequent towing usages, just know that when you try to work the truck it WILL struggle more than its diesel counterpart and at less weight ratings.

I opted to pay a little more for the diesel for the comfort when it's being worked hard. I saved lots of money buying the best truck I might need now and for towing, rather than buying two trucks (a gasser, then a diesel). I have found all kinds of reasons for using my beast (trips, hauling, towing, helping others) since I do have it and this has been a great investment so far.

Here's a link to the 2012 Ford trucks comparing the gas versus diesel. As expected, the diesel has higher rating in ALL areas. If your needs are satisfied with the gasser then you are good to go:

http://www.ford.com/trucks/superduty...ations/towing/

Your money, your choice, but you do have a right to experience the "darn, I wish I had that diesel right now". In the meantime, DO NOT expect to tow or haul as much with the gasser. But do keep in mind the diesel has its limits, too. Then duallies, and stronger frames and suspension increase the capabilities. It can be tough determining your long term decisions right now, but just keep within capabilities for the best in safety for you, your family and others around you.
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Old 03-16-2012, 09:32 AM   #5
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Ford's recent reputation with new engines is not good, although they were diesels.
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Old 03-16-2012, 12:27 PM   #6
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I have been pulling my 2955 with a 2002 GMC 8.1 Gasser. I pull the mountains of Va and Wva with no problem I am out their in the hammer lane with the Dielsel's. in the last 10 years I have never thought I should of purchased a Diesel
We just love our quiet low maintance cost Gasser
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Old 03-16-2012, 01:06 PM   #7
gbsb
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We tow a 40 foot Fuzion toyhauler around 17000 pounds withe trike loaded in it with a 2001 GMC cc dually 8.1 gas with allison automatic no problems so for but i've only been towing for 4 years now. And the injectors don't cost $2000. ot the fuel pressure regulator $1200. We full time and seems like alot of folks are having a lot of expensive problems in their diesel pickups.
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Old 03-16-2012, 02:06 PM   #8
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I switched from 2008 ford f250 diesel to 2011 F350 gas. I only need the F350 to tow my camper which weigh's 12000 lbs loaded. I work full time so I camp about 7 times a year mostly local but once a year a long for me trip of about 800 miles towing. I ordered the F350 with 4.30. The big difference I notice is going up a steep hill the engine does wind up but keeps the speed at 60 mph. I will never see the long steep hills out west so this works great for me. The mileage not towing is about the same not towing (15 mpg).
Towing I get about 1 mpg less towing. Most of the driving of my truck is not towing.
I don't miss the maintance cost of diesel or finding diesel stations when traveling.
Also gas is about 50 cents a gallon cheaper and the gas engine is $8000 cheaper which more then pays for less mileage when towing. If I did a lot of towing I would get a diesel
But I don't and yes the gas engine will tow 12000 lbs 5th wheel up 4 degree grade at 60mph. This is the steepest hill I've gone up sense I started towing in 2009.
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Old 03-16-2012, 06:05 PM   #9
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I agree with Art. If you really want a diesel, rather than take a huge price hit on the gasser when it comes time to sell or trade, just do the diesel the first time around. I had the same thoughts, and figured at my age, I should never even have to get another truck. The diesels should easily get a couple hundred thousand miles without even worrying. That sweet spot is really important too as to how hard the engine is working, or as in the case of the diesel, not working hard. I have done the gas engine and being just within tow specs and this time wanted to have a rig that was built to tow. Just my thoughts.
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Old 03-17-2012, 03:44 AM   #10
1retired06
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If you go to dieselstopforum, you can find out quite a bit about Ford's new 6.7 diesel, which is getting great marks from owners. Cummins designed with Ford, first in-house Ford product replacing previous outsourcing for the 7.3, 6.0 and 6.4. (Navistar/Int Trk). My 7.3 and 6.0 were trouble free, cannot speak to the 6.4. I love the 800 pounds of torque I get with the 6.7 and trouble free so far.
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Old 03-17-2012, 04:03 AM   #11
Phil P
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Hi

We have 2 trucks. The 2009 Duramax 3500 DRW rear wheel drive only. My wife’s truck and she uses it as a daily driver and gets around 16mpg. Around town and 12 mpg towing. We presently have 50% towing and 50% around town.

I have a 202 Dodge 1500 not much good for towing any thing but get around 18 mpg around town and 8 mpg towing (not the Montana).

I would suggest you compare your total use as compared to 4,000 miles of towing. You may find an advantage to the gasser.

As for the reliability of the engine. All manufacturers have problem with the first couple of years of production.

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Old 03-17-2012, 02:47 PM   #12
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If you don't have enough use for a Diesel by all means don't buy one. If you aren't going very far and aren't in a big hurry you do not need a diesel engine. If you were going to be pulling up some high mountains you might wont a diesel a non turbo engine looses 3.6% of its power for every 1000 feet of elevation. Ford's new 6.7 Diesel is probably the best Diesel ever put in a pickup. The new V8 will serve you just fine, and it's a hole lot cheaper, gas is cheaper than diesel, maintenance is cheaper. Go for it.
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Old 03-17-2012, 03:38 PM   #13
helmick
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We do love the Diesel, but I have talked to some MOC members that have had no trouble towing with the new Super Duty Gas engine.
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Old 03-17-2012, 03:57 PM   #14
racerjoe
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I'm back, thanks for the responses so far. My biggest issue is popping for a diesel to let it sit in the garage for maybe 2 weeks at a time in the winter.If it doesn't snow,a lot of times I just use my wifes car instead of driving anywhere with the plow hanging on it. My son is a service adviser for a large ford dealership and he see's many issue with diesels that do not get a lot of use. Like I would be doing.I should also say that many problems were with the re-gen system,that wash out the cylinder walls with a lot of small runs,it keeps wanting to re-gen.
PhilP, I only drive maybe a total of 4000 miles a year, towing the Monte,maybe 600 miles a year,so not much. I think we are going to go with a gas S.D. Lariat with a 430 rear gear,which puts a gross tow of 15000 pds. more than enough for our trailer and a little extra,just in case :-)
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:09 AM   #15
Tom S.
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by racerjoe

I'm back, thanks for the responses so far. My biggest issue is popping for a diesel to let it sit in the garage for maybe 2 weeks at a time in the winter.If it doesn't snow,a lot of times I just use my wifes car instead of driving anywhere with the plow hanging on it. My son is a service adviser for a large ford dealership and he see's many issue with diesels that do not get a lot of use. Like I would be doing.I should also say that many problems were with the re-gen system,that wash out the cylinder walls with a lot of small runs,it keeps wanting to re-gen.
PhilP, I only drive maybe a total of 4000 miles a year, towing the Monte,maybe 600 miles a year,so not much. I think we are going to go with a gas S.D. Lariat with a 430 rear gear,which puts a gross tow of 15000 pds. more than enough for our trailer and a little extra,just in case :-)
Sitting for a few weeks is not an issue. Trust me, mine has set for a month or longer without any issues. Here are the pros and cons as I can see them:

Cons to buying a diesel truck:
Initial cost
Additional weight
Fuel costs
Fuel filter maintenance
Noise
Fuel smell

Pros to buying a diesel truck:
Better resale
Better mileage, especially when towing
No spark plugs to change
Better for towing
Better braking when towing (tow mode)
Engine longevity

I have owned 9 trucks in my life time. Only one was diesel (my current one). I will probably never own another gas powered truck. Despite weighing far more than some of gas powered truck (especially the 1/2 ton models), this truck gets far better mileage, hooked or unhooked. Maintenance is more, when you figure in changing the fuel filter, but I still do my own maintenance so it's not an issue for me. Even though I have a performance exhaust, I don't mind the noise - in fact, it's probably quieter than a gas engine would be with a similar exhaust system. I am also amazed at the prices I see used units selling for. They really hold their value.

You mentioned probably going the diesel route when you retire. If that's in the near future (say 5 years), why not buy now? With care, these trucks have logged hundreds of thousands of miles (many have even gone a million). This truck won't be any cheaper in 5 years!
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:33 AM   #16
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Regen issue was with the 6.4; engineered out with the 6.7
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:37 AM   #17
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racerjoe
Great choice for you. Only using a truck 4000 miles and pulling 600, you don't need a diesel.
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Old 03-18-2012, 04:57 AM   #18
1retired06
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With the 6.7 diesel, scratch noise as a con. Quiet
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Old 03-19-2012, 12:37 AM   #19
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I had a F250 V10-sold it went diesel dually and I am not going to look back! BTW my Chevy 2011 3500 is quiet compared to the wine of the F250 at 4,000 RPM.JMHO
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Old 03-19-2012, 03:26 AM   #20
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by 1retired06

With the 6.7 diesel, scratch noise as a con. Quiet
Second that... My first diesel, but I can't believe how quiet it is, especially when you're inside with the windows up - just like a gasser can barely hear it.
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