Quality Control

[c5racer]

For what it's worth.
Read this on another forum and can't vouch for the poster. Just thought I'd post it as he mentions Keystone and Montana.

I have been a slide out group leader for the past 14 years at Keystone,Forest River, and Dutchmen. I would not recommend a Cardinal to my worst enemy, they are absolute junk. The Cedar Creek model is the only Forest River to buy if you want a Forest River product. The Keystone Montana is a decent unit for the amount of production that plant produces. But they are kinda pricey, they build a unit about every 20 minutes, yes thats 23 units a day in about 6 1/2 hours. I have not really seen a Dutchmen for about 6 years so I cannot comment on them. they all have their quality issues with trim and items crooked like windows, water heater doors, etc. but I know the inspectors at Keystone are mostly women and pretty picky(and bitchy too) and they won't let a unit leave until they OK it. Yes, the inspectors have authority over production managers and all. I know it is not that way at anywhere else I've worked. Forest River is pretty bad for the "just get it out the door" mentality. Although the Cedar Creek plant is about 90% Amish and I have worked with many of those guys in the past, they are (in my opinion) very much more quality minded than the average trailer factory worker, and if they see something wrong they fix it, not hide it hoping it "gets out the door" without anyone seeing it. And just so you know for the last 2 or 3 months the entire RV market has been dead. Very dead. So you would definitely have some leverage to make a deal on a unit. I know what they go to the dealer for and what the dealer marks them up. And it is at least 30%. So if your looking for a 60,000 dollar 5 th wheel, you could get one for about 44-48,000 if you stand firm on your offer and not fold from a salesman telling you they don't make that much on a sale, cause they do. But you may want to take a weekend and go camp at a RV campground and talk with as many people as you can about their brand of trailer and quality issues/ age of unit. Thats the best place to get advice, most folks there have had a few different brands and friends that also RV and know of quality issues, good and bad.
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[Montana Sky]

I have also heard the industry is in a slump. Wonder how 2007 is going to pan out??

[Ozz]

He doesn't sound like a fraud, sounds pretty even in his praise and criticism.
I imagine any industry like ours has it's slump period as well.
Good post, I like to hear an insider's view on things.
See you on the road!
Ozz

[mobilrvn]

Dealer markup is at least 40%.

[Emmel]

Working with the dealers this last three years proves they all have a slack period now and into the first of the year. Watch for their sales prices at the shows starting in Tampa and even local shows. Our local show used to be only one weekend but they are so successful that we do two weekends in a row now.I don't argue with the units being produced at a rate of one every 20 minutes, but looking at the way the factory was laid out, it takes better than half a day to produce one. I worked in the aircraft brake production for over 38 years and we built more 747 brakes a day than they do the Montanas. I believe if a person works at a certain job long enough they get pretty good at what they do. Just MHO! I'm allowed that!

[Hemlockusa]

Good Post c5racer - provides food for thought. I would suggest one reason for the slump, they all trying to figuire out how to incorperate the OZZMANS mod's, that would make any production line slow down. ha ha
I have talked to three different RV dealers here in TOPEKA, they are starving so to speak, of course that means better deal's. I think the economy, fuel prices and such are all taking their toll. I would still like to see all of you in BRANSON MAY 07. Safe Travels John

[richfaa]

A note of things being a bit slow. We had no problem at all extending our stay at this resort, Havasu RV Resort, Or Superstition Sunrise RV Resort in Apache Junction and in the prime snowbird season. We extended for two weeks at Superstition sunrise just yesterday. There are a lot of empty spaces here at Havasu RV Resort.

[Native Tex]

Folks it is sort of evident that the market is in a mild slump it you look at the number of units on the dealer's lots these days. Even the high volume guys seem to have a lot sitting and not moving. It is to be expected with the higher fuel prices, and the holiday season. Even the housing market is declining somewhat. This is referred to the supply and demand analogy where the supply is exceeding demands in a slow reacting market. Ho Ho Ho!

[JimF]

Was at Holiday World in Houston last week (have the Monty in for a roof) and they appear to be quite busy. The sales folks were saying that the sales in lower cost units were down but upper end units was up. We are talking $200K up sales for cash. Somehow I don't breath that air...

What the guy was saying about quality was about right, talked to thr service manager at CamperWorld, which was also SouthWest RV and they are a Cardinal dealer. They installed my Washer/Dryer. He went all over my Monty and he said he was blown away by the quality and apperance of our 3400 - we have gel coat and all the other crap you can hang on one. According to him ours threw rocks at the Cardinal and several other units they carried. He also thought it came darned close to the Doubletree - sorta feel he was streching that one some... or maybe not...

[Montana Sky]

Maybe the Double Tree Select Suites, even then I still feel that is a stretch.

[campbud]

Jim what happen to your roof? I see where your montana is a 07.

[JimF]

Had a hole worn in it by the TV Antenna (see all the posts around Nov 1) when it was on its way down from Keystone. Keystone has been good to deal with on this. They have decided that the repair I did was probably better than what they could accomplish so the roof is not being replaced (as of about 5 minutes ago), and the warrenty will remain intact.