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Old 11-30-2013, 03:15 PM   #21
Irlpguy
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The topic of what tow vehicle is right for a particular RV has been debated over and over and will continue to be debated.

One must keep in mind the considerable variety of owners getting into the RV lifestyle, some have none or minimal experience driving a truck period, let alone a one ton dually. That can be intimidating and will be somewhat of an issue even for those who are familiar with driving a SRW truck compared to a dually as an everyday vehicle. I have driven a dually for so long in my rental business and the last 12 years hauling my RV I am quite comfortable with it and will parallel park in any spot a SRW can park in.

You must also keep in mind whether the SRW meets the GVWR rating required for the particular RV you are towing. In some cases it will, in others it will not, in the latter case you should invest in a DRW.

Anyone who doubts the additional stability of a dually over a SRW only needs to haul a camper to appreciate the difference, while it is a different load than a 5er there is no question in my mind they are more stable.

I would never want a short box, SRW TV simply because I want the added length in the box for my big storage box, containing my 3000W generator and still have room behind my hitch for a spare tire, but that is not what everyone wants.

IMHO, If you are not comfortable driving a dually, and yet that is what is required to meet the GVWR you need for a specific RV and load, then you might want to consider a smaller RV. Your decision should be based firstly on the capacity of the truck and secondly whether you will use it extensively for other uses.

My opinion carries no more weight than does anyone else, it is just my opinion.



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Old 11-30-2013, 04:15 PM   #22
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by woodman

If you want a dedicated truck for pulling your 5th and aren't concerned about parking, decrease in gas mileage, extra overall cost compared to a SRW, then the dually seems like the great match. We have a SRW F350 that pulls our 3625 with ease, but I also use my truck for a number of other things and am not interested in adding width for my other uses. Like so many things, it's an individual choice and if you exercise reasonable judgement in weight and speed, you can enjoy many safe trips.
IMHO, since this truck is used for hauling a large 5th wheel, parking, mileage, extra cost, and other things are irrelevant. If it takes a dually to haul the 5th wheel and be within specs you get the truck you need to do that, not the truck you want because you want to do something else.
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Old 11-30-2013, 04:31 PM   #23
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Irlpguy
My opinion carries no more weight than does anyone else, ...
Sounds like your opinion could use a dualie so it could carry more weight... Sorry, Ed... couldn't resist...
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Old 12-01-2013, 02:24 AM   #24
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X3 I agree with this. Choose the truck that best fills your needs.
The 3500 SWR does it for me.


What is the GAWR of the axles on your SRW truck?
What is the GVWR of your truck?
What is the actual weight of the truck ready to tow? Per axle?

Thanks Jim

Hi Jim,

Answers to your questions.

1. The GAWR of the axles of my 2012 3500 Extended Cab SRW Truck are:
Front - 6000#(I have the plow package thereby higher rating for front)
Rear - 7050 # (Limited because of tires)
2. The GVWR of the truck is 11,600 pounds
3. Actual weight of truck loaded with two Honda 2000 generators, 6 gallons of regular fuel, two passengers, one dog and a full tank of diesel and diesel exhaust fluid is :
Drive axle - 3460#
Steer axle - 4760#
Gross weight - 8220#

Weights of my rig 2014 3725 and truck on scale. (Trailer loaded plus full tank of water which I usually don't do.)

Steer Axle - 4800#
Drive Axle - 6620#
Trailer Axles - 11260#
Gross weight - 22680#

My Math:

1820# under GCWR (truck GCWR is 24500#)
180# under GVWR (truck GVWR is 11,600#)
430# under rear axle rating (truck GAWR is 7050#)
1200# under front axle rating (truck GAWR is 6000#)
3200# pin (hitch) weight (22.13%)
14460# gross weight of Montana (Montana GVWR is 16000#)
1540# under Montana's GVWR
Maximum Trailer weight for Truck is 16,900#
2440# (under maximum trailer weight for truck)
GAWR for Montana is 6750# per axle. I have the Marabomb ST235/80R16E rated at 3420#( will be changed out)
More math,(making assumption the weight is equal on all tires, which I know isn't the case.)
2815# per tire (605# under tire rating of 3420#)

The only thing that has changed since I weighed in September is the BD3 air hitch. I believe it is a bit more weight, but I will find out when I reweigh both in April on trip down south.

This is a bit more information that you requested Jim, but I think if folks weigh their rigs and know their weights they can make better choices of the type of vehicle the meets their needs. As you can see, I am close to my maximum both with the GVWR and Rear Axle Rating (limited because of tires to 7050), but still within the ratings. This truck meets my needs perfectly. Some people will want more margin, and I am fine with that. Again it is their choice. I may be a little silly about weighing my unit yearly, but I have found that the rig will slowly puts on weight just like me if I do not keep it checked. My DW is a great cook and our 3725 has a lot of space to put things. My past SOB was also kept in check by yearly weigh ins because my past tow vehicle was a 1999 Dodge with the Cummins and a GVWR of only 8800 pounds. It didn't take much to be over. I was lucky that the pin weight didn't exceed my ratings, but again I had to keep things in check. Towing ability was never a issue, more than enough power.

I hope this helps,

Jay
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Old 12-01-2013, 03:39 AM   #25
jlb27537
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Jay, Thanks, exactly what I was looking for. My concern was rear axle specs. Your trailer weights are very close to mine.

Mine is not a daily driver, thank goodness. 22' long and 8' wide does not fit @ Walmart.

Thanks again Jim
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Old 12-01-2013, 05:36 AM   #26
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IMHO..............At some point plain ol' common sense has to step into the picture. If I am in an accident, pulling a trailer that exceeds the weight limits of the truck I am using........guess who's insurance will NOT cover you!!!!!
Get enough truck to do the job!
Again, just my humble opinion.
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Old 12-01-2013, 05:50 AM   #27
JandC
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Any members out there that are current or retired over-the-road truck drivers? Would like to hear their thoughts since this issue has come up in different posts. The gentlemen I purchased my Monte from was a retired driver and he had a 3/4 ton beefed up Ram SRW.
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Old 12-01-2013, 08:05 AM   #28
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by dsprik

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Irlpguy
My opinion carries no more weight than does anyone else, ...
Sounds like your opinion could use a dualie so it could carry more weight... Sorry, Ed... couldn't resist...
Darn I knew I should have gotten the dually version of my opinion when I had the chance...LOL

JandC wrote:
Quote:
quote:Any members out there that are current or retired over-the-road truck drivers? Would like to hear their thoughts since this issue has come up in different posts. The gentlemen I purchased my Monte from was a retired driver and he had a 3/4 ton beefed up Ram SRW.
I know several truck drivers that have no clue what the weight of their TV's or RV's are. They "had" to know what those weights were when hauling because they had to cross weigh scales and would face pretty stiff fines if they were overweight.

I include my Son in law in this group as he does not know what either their RV or horse trailer weighs when loaded, not does he know what the pin weight is on the horse trailer.

It is a whole different ball game when you don't have to prove to anyone you are not overweight.

There are some like jhudson and others who are very aware of the weights of their RV and TV. I also know exactly what mine are when ready to hit the road. Many owners don't know, don't care and that will never change.

This of course is just another of my SRW opinions....





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Old 12-01-2013, 09:20 AM   #29
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by jhudson

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by dsprik

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by woodman
If you want a dedicated truck for pulling your 5th and aren't concerned about parking, decrease in gas mileage, extra overall cost compared to a SRW, then the dually seems like the great match. We have a SRW F350 that pulls our 3625 with ease, but I also use my truck for a number of other things and am not interested in adding width for my other uses. Like so many things, it's an individual choice and if you exercise reasonable judgement in weight and speed, you can enjoy many safe trips.
2Xs on this.
X3 I agree with this. Choose the truck that best fills your needs. The 3500 SWR does it for me.
X4
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Old 12-01-2013, 10:57 AM   #30
jlb27537
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[/quote]
X3 I agree with this. Choose the truck that best fills your needs. The 3500 SWR does it for me.
[/quote]

X4
[/quote]

Hi, Your sig shows a 2004 F350. My research shows you are probably over both the GAWR and the GCWR of your truck.
http://www.ford-trucks.com/specs/2004/2004_superduty_1.html
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Old 12-01-2013, 12:13 PM   #31
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by jlb27537


Hi, Your sig shows a 2004 F350. My research shows you are probably over both the GAWR and the GCWR of your truck.
http://www.ford-trucks.com/specs/2004/2004_superduty_1.html
Hi all,

I find this thread very interesting. Many, many opinions, and I think that is great. What is also interesting, thanks to Jim, is to point out that many of the older trucks even dually trucks don't have the ratings that the newer trucks have. In fact that the newer 3500 SWRs have higher ratings than some of the 3 to 4 year old dually trucks have.

What does this all mean? Well to me if your truck suits your needs and you are happy with it, that's great. My old Dodge and SOB were a great pair together but when I replaced with my 2012 Silverado, the Dodge didn't even come close in any aspect. This is to be expected because of the 13 years difference in technology. So if an when I replace the Montana, I most likely will have to replace the truck unless I down size. I really cannot imagine me getting a larger rig, but if I get a something with more weight....it's dually time.

Jay
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Old 12-01-2013, 01:03 PM   #32
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I have Allstate insurance. I ask my agent "If my camper is over my trucks weight limit and I have an accident will Allstate cover me" He called Allstate they said yes you will be covered. If you think about it could they deny coverage if a trucker was over weight. What about if you were speeding or you ran a stop sign. They would never pay a claim if every time some one broke a law they didn't haft to pay a claim.
Lynwood
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Old 12-01-2013, 06:26 PM   #33
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When we bought our trailer we did a lot of research and determined that our truck would safely tow it. We have taken it to the scales three times and are within the ratings of the truck. After reading this thread and others on tow vehicle ratings I did some research on design safety factors that are used for the frame and axles. From what I have been able to find the material strength is 3 times the forces applied. Would I want to test my truck at three times the rating of the axles and frame ratings I don't think so. But this gives you an idea why some people have reported that they have been able to load these truck way beyond the ratings with out any apparent issues. I would have to wonder what the long term effects would be to frame and axles if continually overloaded at 2x and I am not going to find out.

Like others have pointed out do your own research and determine what your comfort level is. Once you have the trailer go weight it a scale and determine the weights and compare to the ratings. I know it helped us fell more comfortable with the truck and trailer we have.
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Old 12-02-2013, 01:28 AM   #34
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When we first started shopping for a truck we found a salesman that had a good reputation for matching the truck to the job to be performed. After looking over all of the Montana weight ratings he said that a 3/4 ton would pull the loaded Montana in most situations, but would bog down in hilly terrain. We got a one ton and have not had a pulling issue anywhere we have been.
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Old 12-02-2013, 03:25 AM   #35
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Do not forget legality issues. Several years ago, going through St Louis, we were hit by a car entering the interstate. Even though the other driver was cited and we were not, we were escorted by the state trooper to a scale for a determination if we were within weight limits. If we were not, ticket coming, and if at fault, we would have had much trouble on our plate. I could probably put air bags/helper springs on a F150 and pull my Montana "for a while", as long as I did not have to stop.
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Old 12-02-2013, 03:35 AM   #36
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That says it all!


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Old 12-03-2013, 09:15 AM   #37
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by bobcat92

When we bought our trailer we did a lot of research and determined that our truck would safely tow it. We have taken it to the scales three times and are within the ratings of the truck.
Hi Bob, I would be interesting seeing your actual weights. The 2x logic is fine, but what is on the plate in the door jam is what the courts look at.

If you go to page 54 of the linked PDF, the load rating of a F250 CC 8'box PSD truck is 1,795lbs. Figure 2 adults, fuel, hitch and you are down to a payload capacity of 1,000lbs.

https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/non-html/2002/fsersdcd.pdf

Your 3100 pin, loaded for camping will be close to 3,000lbs. Yea you can put larger tires on it, add air bags, etc. that does not change the rating of the truck.

Jim

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Old 12-03-2013, 01:31 PM   #38
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Someone please tell me why a 3/4 ton would bog down in mountains and a 1 ton would not pulling the same weight. I assume this is going up the mountain. I understand the weight ratings and such but this comment is confusing. Please enlighten me!
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Old 12-03-2013, 03:07 PM   #39
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by navybanker

Someone please tell me why a 3/4 ton would bog down in mountains and a 1 ton would not pulling the same weight. I assume this is going up the mountain. I understand the weight ratings and such but this comment is confusing. Please enlighten me!
Navy Banker. The bogging down in the mountains is not the issue. The issue is what did the maker of the vehicle rate that vehicle for.

A 2002 F250 and a F450 have the same engine and transmission. However the brakes, rear axle, suspension, tire size are different.

For a owner to say a truck will tow it, or haul it, Yes that is probably correct.. But the Factory rated the vehicle on a lot of components and even while it will "tow it" that does not make it right/legal, depending on which side of the fence you are on.

Those of us that have been doing this for 20+ years, will be doing it with a TV that is "legal" All Axle weights are in limits, the GVWR is within the manufactures specs, and the being 140lbs under legal limits will just not be good enough.

OK, now lets look at SRW vs DRW. Some SRW are only available in 3.55 or lower while a DRW is a 3.73 or 4.10. That in it's self should tell you that a SRW is just not geared to tow a heavier load.

I have seen guys towing way beyond the trucks capacity, but I opt on the side of caution and my TV fiting my towed weight.

Hope this helps. Jim
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Old 12-03-2013, 03:40 PM   #40
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by navybanker

Someone please tell me why a 3/4 ton would bog down in mountains and a 1 ton would not pulling the same weight. I assume this is going up the mountain. I understand the weight ratings and such but this comment is confusing. Please enlighten me!
They don't bog down performance wise, but do physically since the 1 ton has heavier springs. Also, 3/4 ton truck come with lighter wheel and tire ratings. In theory, you could change those items on a 3/4 and have the same rating as a 1 ton (single rear wheel, of course), but from a legal standpoint, the law goes by the rating on the door jamb. Having said all that, I have never seen, nor know of anyone who has been pulled over for weight issues. I know it happens, but apparently not very frequently.
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