wet shackles

[blarkman]

I can,t find the post on the Moryde wet shackle kit
bob

[richfaa]

Just purchased the wet shackle kit from Mor-Ryde at the Fall rally.The price was 121.90. You CAN do the replacement yourself if you are mechanically inclined and have the proper tools. I fail in both areas.

[illapah]

What is a wet shackle kit? I must need one.

[hazmic]

They are grease able with a grease gun. They are a good investment whether Mor-ryde or Dexter.

[pud2]

Can you put the link for it? I didn't see the wet system on there web site.

[richfaa]

Got my wet shackle kit from Mor Ryde at the rally..part # LRE12-001 Price was 115.00 plus 6.90 Ind tax. Phone numberr at Mor Ryde is....574-293-1581 web site www.morryde.com. My dealer will install them for 2 hours labor..I am NOt handy.

[Fire5er]

I thought Dexter was the vendor for the wet shackle kit?

[Lady RV]

Dear MOC Members,

I received this from Aram Koltookian at Keystone. Those of you concerned about the your shackles may find this of interest.

All my best,
Lady RV

quote:
MOR/ryde International, Inc.


1966 Moyer Avenue P.O. Box Elkhart, Indiana 46515 (574) 293-1581 Fax (574) 294-4936 www.morryde.com


Date: September 18, 2007

To: Keystone Montana Owners Club

From: MOR/ryde International

Re: Use of Wet Bolt Kit vs. Standard Non Wet Bolt (Attaching Parts Kit)


Following the MOR/ryde seminar at the Montana Owners Club Rally in Goshen there has been much discussion and debate about the use of wet shackle bolts w/ grease zerks and bronze bushings verses the industry standard non wet bolt w/ nylon or plastic bushings. We are concerned the information shared may have been presented in a way that led to a misunderstanding of MOR/ryde's position on the use of standard bolt vs wet bolt packages.

While upgrading to a heavy duty attaching parts kit (Wet Bolt Kit) can provide added protection against wear, the use of this kit is in no way a requirement to ensure safe and reliable towing.
Keystone goes to great lengths to ensure that the products that they offer meet and/or exceed the consumer's expectation for value and safety. Keystone Montana as the leading manufacturer of fifth wheels in the industry is second to none with respect to product testing. Our experience is that Keystone tests more that any other 5th wheel manufacturer. Earlier this year a Keystone Montana was again subjected to a durability test at the Bosch Automotive Proving Grounds that simulated approximately 45,000 road miles. That unit was equipped with the MOR/ryde Suspension System and standard non wet attaching parts. The standard attaching parts remained intact for the entire test and upon inspection at the conclusion of the test showed standard wear to the shackle links and attaching brackets on the MOR/ryde system. MOR/ryde would interpret this test result in a positive light and the results would be as anticipated. MOR/ryde has also conducted several durability tests of our suspension system with the standard bolt package and the test results have been positive.

The non wet shackle bolt w/ nylon or plastic bushing used by Keystone Montana is the standard suspension used by most manufacturers in the industry including those who also use a MOR/ryde suspension system. As with most OEM components (Recreational Vehicle, Automotive, Transit, etc.) companies often develop aftermarket upgrades in an attempt to increase aftermarket sales revenue. The upgraded components do offer value. Wet bolt kits are just that, an aftermarket upgrade that offer a means of lubricating the bronze bushings located in the spring eye and equalizer through the use of grease zerks on the bolts. There are pros and cons to this set-up. They will extend the life of attaching parts (shackles/brackets) but must be installed properly for the bolt and bushing to take on grease. They do incur added cost, which in many instances, may not be necessary as standard shackles can last thousands of miles as evidenced during Montana's durability testing.

The key with any attaching parts kit is to periodically inspect for signs of excessive wear, cracking, or hole elongation. The recommended interval for inspection as indicated in the axle owner's manual is every 6 months or 6,000 miles for attaching parts and 12 months or 12,000 miles for leaf springs and spring hangers. Suspension attaching parts are wearable components that can and do wear at different intervals depending upon factors including weight, loading, and road conditions. While upgrading to a wet bolt kit will extend the life of attaching parts, it is impossible to accurately say by how much. It is also important to understand that an upgrade to the wet bolt kit is not necessary to ensure safe and reliable towing. MOR/ryde has sold tens of thousands of our suspension system equipped with standard non wet bolt kits and are very pleased with the results. MOR/ryde does not view the use of wet bolt kits as necessary or mandatory and has shared this position with Keystone and other OEM's.

MOR/ryde apologizes to Keystone and to the Montana Owners Club if any of the information presented at the seminar led Montana owners to believe that an upgrade to a wet bolt kit is necessary. MOR/ryde's position on this upgrade is that it is simply something to keep in mind should the need ever arise. Please feel free to contact us directly if you have any questions or need additional information.

[Ozz]

Thanks, Lady RV for the post, I was a little concerned.
Could any members post pictures of worn parts, unit model, and list the miles on the parts??

[VanMan]

Hamrad has pix on his picture trail site. He posted a link in his post at http://www.montanaowners.com/forums/...ad.php?t=24467

[richfaa]

I did NOT interpret the information at the seminar as suggesting the wet bolt kits were a necessary replacement. Charlie (8.1al) replaced his at the rally. Don't know how many miles were on them but the OEM that were removed were not a pretty sight. dexter IS the vendor for the entire axle assembly including the shackles..We ordered our wet bolt kit from MOR-Ryde but you are correct..they are a Dexter product. I am having my wet bolt kit installed Oct 2nd and will report on the condition of the OEM shackles.

[bob]

Mor Ryde 10 keystone 0 if Keystone thinks the wear on shackles & pins is acceptable at 10000 mi & 12 months what would the wear be 20000 mi the wear can cause a host of problems it also can lead to a safety factor,industry as a whole should correct this, there are several mfg using wet kits its to bad that Mor Ryde had to back track on this issue Keystone buys their parts so its if you don't play there game you don't play at all. mine have been changed and yes they were worn excessively I would not take Keystones word on this one take shackles apart & look thank you Mor Ryde you're right Keystone is ignoring this issue& hoping it will go away thank you Richard Fry

[HamRad]

Ozz,

My PictureTrail link has an album titled "Shackles and Tank Leak". We have the 3295, 2002 model year. That was before MOR/Ryde started supplying the attaching hardware. And I think we had about 15 to 20K on the rig at the time of shackle replacement.

The Mor/Ryde may be stronger than what I replaced, I don't know. I do know that I would certainly take a close look. And you do have to be at just the right position to see the wear. It is very difficult to see until it is almost too late.

It does appear someone was trying to back off of whatever might have been said at Goshen and do a little CYA. Can't blame them but I'd still check this item often!

Good luck.

HamRad

[dsprik]

My interpretation of what was said at the seminar (I also was there) was that the OEM shackles were designed to last "100 to 1,000 miles". I believe that to be a direct quote - please correct if I need a hearing aid. While that rep may have not been accurate, I did NOT get the impression from the Mor/ryde that there was no need for concern and that the OEM shackles should last the expected life of the rest of the suspension.

Did anyone that was present at the seminar feel greatly relieved and filled with confidence that there was no need to upgrade those shackles, ever? I did not.

I guess if Keystone is confident in there stated assessment, they may want to alleviate fears that have now arisen and possibly slap a voluntary extended warranty on that shackle? Just a suggestion.

[richfaa]

I think that 100 to 1000 ,Miles statement was a slip of the tongue( I heard it also) . I had decided based upon others experience here on this forum and other forums to replace the OEM shackles BEFORE we went to rally. Great Idea Dave " guess if Keystone is confident in there stated assessment, they may want to alleviate fears that have now arisen and possibly slap a voluntary extended warranty on that shackle? Just a suggestion." My assessment is that if you are a weekend/vacationer or a low use camper there will not be a problem.However if you are a long timer/ full timer and put a lot of road miles on the unit I would take a look.

[blarkman]

I took a 6500 mile trip on mine and you can see the elongelated bolt hole on top of the shackle. You have to crawl under the rig to see this looking from the inside out, and hole is at top of shackle. My rig was on alignment rack and tech stuck a screwdriver in hole to show me how it had worn.
How does one check for wear or looseness as we have no torque values for shackles and I understand these can be overtightened. So does this mean every 6-8000 miles we have to replace them or take it to someone who can raise rig to check for wear in shackles.
bob

[sreigle]

With all due respect and appreciation for the information, Aram's explanation is good information but to have any faith in it I need to know one thing: Is Keystone using the same bushing on the 2007 Montanas as were used on the 2003's? If so, then I cannot put much faith in the statements. The reason is we had a failure of those bushings at roughly 30,000 miles. Others here have had failures, too, some with fewer miles than we had, some with more.

Here's a few pictures to punctuate my concerns. I saved these after providing them to Aram's predecessor. Userid is provided with each picture. I know Aram was not involved with Montana when these problems surfaced so he may not be aware of this. If the bushings are better today, then Aram's statement would provide a level of comfort.

Blarkman, somewhere in one of our manuals (the axle manual, I think) it does say these need to be retorqued periodically and it gives torque values. That's on a 2007. I don't know about prior years.

The easiest way to see wear is to unscrew the nut on each bolt enough to see behind it. On mine, I didn't even have to do that.

Gruffy


drhowell


sreigle


patodonn


azstar

Those plastic looking parts at the bottom are a bushing.

[blarkman]

My rig is at RV doctor again and will have to wait till it's done before I can check manuals, thanks for input. Morryde says they have no torque values available
bob

[hazmic]

I have installed the 'Wet-bolt' kits on my last 3 or 4 campers not because they were worn out but because I thought and still do think they are a great idea. Why the manufactures don't make them as a option is beyond me. I think it would be a good addition to any camper. These are just my opinion. My last two campers Mounteer and the latest our Montana were install before we took delivery so they had only the miles on then from the factory to the dealer. I carry a couple of bolts and side plates just in case I ran into someone that needed them.

[pud2]

What i would like to now is this related to the squeeking noise you here when your are pulling into a c.g.? It sounds like it is coming fron the springs. Anybody else here this are is it just me. If so what is the remidy?