Factory tour and new stuff. - Montana Owners Club

dsprik · 05-16-2006, 05:05 PM

OK, guys and gals.... Cheryl and I just got back from Goshen. We took the Sprinter tour first. Nate was our guide. Very cool watching them move those huge fifth wheels sideways through the factory.

He explained that they workers work from 4:30 am to 2:00 pm. They are on an hourly wage along with a production incentive pay. He said many work right through their breaks. There was a steady stream of job applicants, as college students and high school students are gearing up for summer work.

Then we went over to the Montana plant. Jim was our guide - didn't catch his last name. Mark Kroll called me just before we arrived and let me know that it was not his turn to give the tour. Here's what we discovered. Since our Unit is scheduled for the end of may, it probably will not be started until the week before. They are putting out 22 a day. They just happened to be doing 3400's when we were there.

Changes: Alright! How many of you knew about the "Egyptian Gold" trim option??? Cheryl stopped at the end of the line where they were putting in the furniture, and she saw several couches sitting, ready to be put in. She spotted this one - wish I would have gotten a pict - and yelled for Jim to get over there. She said, "Is this my new Desert Sunset couch???" It was REALLY sharp looking decor. Jim told her no. That that was the "Egyptian Gold" option. Cheryl was stunned, "I can't get this???" Here's where I took over. I told him we were never told about this trim, and that we want this in our coach. He grimmaced, and told us that they get this material in sporadically, and that if we wanted this trim, we would probably have to wait until August sometime to get our Montana finished with this material.

I asked him if this trim is not advertised, how are people ordering it??? He said that some units with this "unadvertised" trim were sent to some dealers, and their customers saw this trim there and ordered. Cheryl was visibly upset. It is an absolutely spectacular design. I told him I could make some phone calls. I accidentally offended him by telling him that I would get ahold of Mark Kroll and see what he could do. Oops... Mark and Jim are both in the same positon, apparently. I could tell by the expression on his face that I had made a blunder - not that that's a rare occurrance for me. He told me that Mark wouldn't be able to tell me anything other than what he was telling me. I'm still going to make some phone calls. If we didn't know about this trim before we plunked down ~$45K for a fifth wheel, AND since it was an available option when we ordered (Jim said that they had had that material going into coaches since January), AND if it's not scheduled to start being built for another 1 - 2 weeks, I want everything possible done to get that new interior color and furniture. 'Nuff said.

Next, ALL frames are NOW powder coated. I though they were before??? Jim said they JUST started doing this 2 or 3 weeks ago.

Trusses - problem. As we went above to look at the roof, I asked Jim why there were intermittent BLACK PAINTED trusses mixed in randomly with the non-painted aluminum. He said, they had run into a problem with a thin coating of oil, all of a sudden, showing up on the aluminum trusses. So thin, the workers didn't notice it, BUT - and here it comes, folks, because I know I saw this posted a while back as an issue - the GLUE holding the ceiling to the trusses wouldn't hold due to this thin layer of oil, and the ceilings started coming down. They believe they have solved the problem. However, they are not taking any chances and they are mixing in these more expensive painted trusses (about 1/4 or 1/5 of the trusses) randomly. Some are even next to each other. Not sure if that's a pre-designed pattern, or if the workers are told to just mix them in. That should have caused and "Ah Hah!!!" somewhere.

Next: I mentioned the noisy water pump. Jim went around the side and started to say, "And we have tried to isolate the pump and the furnace to limit noise...", and he turned around and looked at the pump and stopped in mid sentence. He said, "Wait, these are different pumps... These must be brand new that they just started putting in today." He was genuinely surprised. He seemed happy that they were making that change. He mentioned that maybe Montana had switched to a quieter pump. I hope so.

I did mention the propane line rubbing through. We looked at this, but it was dark and hard to see. There is the metal hole and then the line seemed to be clamped tightly against the hole at the 10 o'clock postion in the hole on the left side, and at the 2 o'clock position on the right side of the coach. I could not budge them - and I tried. Jim said he could not imagine that being able to move enough to rub.

How many of you like the mirrors? Great! They changed them. I left my camera at the Sprinter plant (recovered it later). Had to take these pics with my camera phone and enchance them as much as possible with pic software. These new CONCAVE mirrors just starting going on ALL new Montanas as THREE days ago. They look really cool. Hopefully they are functional, too. Jim turned to me and asked if I wanted one. I stupidly said no. I could not think of why I would want one laying around the house. I could have at least gotten better pics for the forum, if I would have taken one - dumb.

Overall, Cheryl and I were impressed. The employees all are VERY proud that THEY get to work on the Montana line. I'm happy to see that pride.

Here's 2 pics of the mirrors. They are concave (actually convex). Hope you can get the idea:

I'll let everyone know how my quest to change trim to Egyptian Gold comes along. Jim thinks that they just would not have the material available. He said we would have to "sell" our 3400 and "re-order"another with Egyptian Gold. NOT a likely scenario. It is a big deal to Cheryl, so I'm going to push for it. This material is hands down more beautiful than ANY of the other color schemes. Can't believe I didn't get a pic... Sorry.

*On Edit~ Jim also mentioned that the new updated brochures should be available with the next few weeks.

*On 2nd Edit~ (How many of these am I going to have???) Bath room vanity drains into gray tank. As Rich mentioned, you cannot run your washer unless you are now in a full hookup (unless you don't like your neighbor). Only outlet is directly to the outside.

JH Sechelt · 05-16-2006, 08:08 PM

Dave,
Thanks for the great report. But I think you should go back and get us a picture of the "Egyptian Gold" trim option.
Keep us all posted of how you make out with any changes.
J&D

CountryGuy · 05-17-2006, 03:36 AM

Good report Dave, isn't it amazing to see them built??

richfaa · 05-17-2006, 03:49 AM

Nice report..so I've got to watch for our ceiling falling down at least we know why if it does..that's good..They make so many changes our 3400 built April 25th is already obsolete. The mirror only works with the OEM hitch pin..can't see anything with the Mor-Ryde hitch pin.(extended) wonder if the new style mirror will make a difference..will have to ask Mark .We noted that our water pump is not noisy although we have not seen it yet..don't know where it is??? If you get one of those extra dump gates you can run the W/D by opening both gray valves and let the gray water distribute itself between both tanks.What did you think of the Sprinter tour???

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 05:04 AM

Rich, the water pump is sitting right next to the furnace - on the side towards the inside of the unit. I will see about getting pics of the Egyptian Gold trim, John

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 05:13 AM

Carol and Rich, It was amazing to watch those Sprinters built. Those guys really hustle when their on commission (production bonus). It was really amazing to see those huge units slid sideways on rollers by two workers only - on on the front and one on the back. I kinda of wondered about OSHA, though. Mostly college age kids. They had safety glasses, but were in tennis shoes - no steel toes, no hard hats. I'm sure they are legal, but things sure were flying - nail guns going (sprinters are all wood frames), workers shouting instructions and throwing air hoses around. You are dodging and stepping over moving air hoses all the time during the tour. Many times, Nate, had to yell above the din just so we could hear him. It was just Cheryl and I by ourselves on that tour that day. That was really nice.

VanMan · 05-17-2006, 06:43 AM

Do you have to make an appointment so many days ahead of time for the appointments ? only certain days of the week? how do you set one up?

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 07:05 AM

I just called Bill Tea at Town & Country. He knew what I was calling about. Mark Kroll had already called him and alerted him. Either Jim had alerted Mark as to our dilemma (probably the "I'll call Mark" comment), or they already read my post.

The trim is called "VENETIAN GOLD", not "Egyptian Gold". The factory has a order lineup that is hard to disrupt, as you can imagine. They will give me my option as to when we want to take delivery of our 3400 - end of May with the Desert Sunset, or later (will require a new order) with the Venetian Gold. Cheryl and I will make a decision on whether to delay taking delivery or not.

I have called the plant and talked to Pam. She is going to try to take a pic of the Venetian Gold trim - couch and whole setup, if possible - and email it to me. I will post ASAP. Probably a link, as the size will be too large for a post pic.

The sales rep that gave the tour was Jim Edmundson. He did a great job, and I am sending a "Thank You" note to him.

richfaa · 05-17-2006, 07:17 AM

For the tour you need to find out for sure what the times are then show up at the main office at the proper time. All the tours leave from there.I found the Water pump today and it is screwed directly to the floor,It was a rats nest in there,Wires hanging all over the place and the furnace ducts were taped up with sticky tape that I could pull off with little effort..There was also gaps in the tape so hot air was escaping around the connection..Lots of Tie wraps and duct tape needed. Not much skill or professionalism among those workers.But then again it is not their fault.They can only do as good as the training they get from Management..Spent about 3 hours dressing things up and it now looks good.

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 07:45 AM

VanMan, I agree with Rich. Doesn't hurt to call ahead (574.535.2100) and let them know you're coming. They treat you very well. Montana tour is 2 PM on Tuesdays. The Sprinter tour, while actual work is being done, is the same day at 1 PM. I'd make both. Montana tour is when the workers are not there. We had three couples take the tour, including us. One couple had driven from Iowa to see a "working plant". Their salesman had told them that the workers would be working when they toured. They wanted to be able to talk to the workers. They showed their keen disappointment immediately to Jim. He handled it very well and they gradually became more friendly and ended up enjoying the tour and thanking Jim.

If the Sprinter factory was any indication, those workers were flying around, and they would never have a second to stop and talk, anyway...

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 08:38 AM

OK, folks... Here you go. Just remember, if this is an option you want, it may take longer, as he said that they get the material comes in sporadically.

Desert Sunset:
http://tinypic.com/zx8kld.jpg

Venetian Gold:
http://i4.tinypic.com/zx8kys.jpg
(The pic does not do the colors justice. It is a beautiful material)
Also, the recliners are a solid "spruce" color that Cheryl says "brings out the colors of the couch", whatever the heck that means...

A big THANKS to Pam Yoder at the Keystone/Montana plant for runing out and snapping these photos this morning.

virgil47 · 05-17-2006, 12:32 PM

Dave,

Curious, did you hear any mention about a Montana branded toy hauler?

Bruce Lenhardt · 05-17-2006, 01:00 PM

We took delivery of our new 2955rl on May 1. We ordered it with the new Venetian Gold interior. Thanks to our dealer (Rollin-On RV Schererville, Indiana) who told us about the new interior. It did indeed delay the shipment by about two or three weeks. We do like it.

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 01:20 PM

No, Virgil, I did not hear any mention of this.

Bruce, can you do a snapshot of your interior? You have these new "spruce" recliners, right?

boat391 · 05-17-2006, 04:11 PM

awsume job dave & cheryl I loved your report nice to know how the things are put together wish we had the time to travel out there to take the tour maybe in the future We sent about 3 hours talking with the Keystone factory rep Charles Wade before deciding on our 3400 at a local Rv show and got the best feeling about Montana and Keystone. that is what sold us on ours the local dealer is somewhat a putz you would think this was there first sale but we worked through it and brought ours home and so far very pleased I have looked at the wireing and plumbing and have been able to clean up some of the messes next big challenge will be the underbelly holes and brake wireing but it all small stuff so far did need to adjust a few cabinets to make them straight and stay closed I am able to do alot of tinkering myself so don't mind makeing things a little bit better along the way lol thanks again for your report loved it

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 04:46 PM

Bruce Lenhardt has graciously permitted me to post these pics he just took of his Venetian Gold interior in his 2006 2955RL (Delivery May 1). I think you will agree with Bruce and I (actually, our wives), that this is a very eye catching design.

Thanks again, Bruce!

Pict taken earlier today by Pam Yoder, Sales Coordinator, Montana/Mountaineer
http://i4.tinypic.com/zybp05.jpg

Five picts just taken by Bruce:
http://i4.tinypic.com/zybsc9.jpg
http://i4.tinypic.com/zybt02.jpg
http://i4.tinypic.com/zybteg.jpg
http://i4.tinypic.com/zybv2t.jpg
http://i4.tinypic.com/zybvjb.jpg

CountryGuy · 05-17-2006, 05:25 PM

That is nice Dave. Are you going to wait for that color scheme???

SKOOBDO · 05-17-2006, 05:27 PM

Dave, I thought the new decor name was "Venetian Gold". Montana sent me the photo...I have it downloaded on my other computer and will attempt to post it on here for who ever wants to see it. I didn't like it so I chose Desert Sunset. It was just too cheap gold looking. Also, my washer drains into the gray tank..so I lucked out since they must have just changed it. My unit was built just over a month ago. So far, been living in this unit since taking delivery the end of March and not a problem yet. Good Luck on your delivery!

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 05:42 PM

Carol,

Cheryl and I discussed this this afternoon. She was really wants this color scheme. I have talked to Bill Tea and he is in contact with Keystone. They have a pretty set pattern of doing things. These orders, as you know, are set up, signed off by the dealerships, appropriate Keystone and Montana personnel, and organized in a highly structured and efficient system. I totally support their obvious concern of setting a precedent of "doing someone a huge favor" by "cutting in line", so to speak. The last thing Keystone wants to have is customers running in, trying to change their order, saying, "Well you did it for Dave and Cheryl..." (or anyone else)

We have decided to wait for the Venetian Gold interior. We are going to live in this. This will not be a "recreational", occassional use, winterize and store, coach. This will be our life for many years. I certainly do not want to downplay those fellow MOCers who are using them for this purpose, though. But this will be our life, and we may be a little more dedicated to making absolutely sure that this is the way we want it.

They have assured us that they will do what they can for us, which is all I expect.

dsprik · 05-17-2006, 05:55 PM

Allison,

See, I thought the other way around. I thought the Desert Sunset looked cheap and that the Venetian Gold, with it's crisper lines and sharper detail looked much more high end. I'm sure that many don't like either and optioned for the "Saphire". That's probably why furniture stores don't only stock a single style of furniture.

The washer prep to gray (or black) tank was discontinued due to people constantly overflowing their tanks unexpectantly - bad, especially with the black tank. This design change, while possibly frustrating to non-sewer hookup campers, it sure stopped a lot of angry calls coming into Keystone from campers that were taken by surprise (unpleasantly) at just how much water their washer actually went through.

Maybe if they designed a system that allowed Montana owners a bypass OPTION, so they could at least choose which drainage system they wanted. Then it would be their fault if something ugly happened.

*On Edit~ Allison, we only hope that we will have a great, problem free unit like you have. I expect to find some minor things to fix, but I hope our experience in our Montana matches yours.

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