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Old 01-08-2020, 08:58 PM   #41
jpwhite
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Closing in on one year of new ownership experience I've concluded the RV industry is a disaster.

The OEM's / supplier relationship is opposite that of the auto industry. No effective quality controls. No apparent mentality of continuous improvement. There is no comparison. All the hundreds of brands are owned by a few conglomerates who output minor variations of the same assemblies of purchased parts from a few massive and more powerful suppliers who make all the frames, hydraulics, tankage, furniture, equipment, electronics and appliances.

Warrantee service is painful. Waiting for ridicules approvals through the layers of responsible legal entities no matter how obvious the problem or well documented it is. No one seems to stock parts, so getting them is a waiting game and a crap shoot as to whether the right one is delivered and undamaged. All this results in significant down time for an expensive asset in the first year of ownership and missing out on the intended recreational purpose.

Ok, got that off my chest.
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Old 01-08-2020, 09:14 PM   #42
Gutz54
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Originally Posted by jpwhite View Post
Closing in on one year of new ownership experience I've concluded the RV industry is a disaster.

The OEM's / supplier relationship is opposite that of the auto industry. No effective quality controls. No apparent mentality of continuous improvement. There is no comparison. All the hundreds of brands are owned by a few conglomerates who output minor variations of the same assemblies of purchased parts from a few massive and more powerful suppliers who make all the frames, hydraulics, tankage, furniture, equipment, electronics and appliances.

Warrantee service is painful. Waiting for ridicules approvals through the layers of responsible legal entities no matter how obvious the problem or well documented it is. No one seems to stock parts, so getting them is a waiting game and a crap shoot as to whether the right one is delivered and undamaged. All this results in significant down time for an expensive asset in the first year of ownership and missing out on the intended recreational purpose.

Ok, got that off my chest.
Well I keep hearing similar stories more and more--my wife and I bought a Montana 3811 last year but have only taken her on one short trip--so far no problem. If this is really is a systemic problem they will pay dearly for their lack of quality control and service---someone will come to the plate and offer what consumers want and the rest will quickly go out of business. Customer satisfaction is number one--when a company forgets that simple face they are doomed.
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Old 01-08-2020, 09:28 PM   #43
jpwhite
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Originally Posted by Gutz54 View Post
Well I keep hearing similar stories more and more--my wife and I bought a Montana 3811 last year but have only taken her on one short trip--so far no problem. If this is really is a systemic problem they will pay dearly for their lack of quality control and service---someone will come to the plate and offer what consumers want and the rest will quickly go out of business. Customer satisfaction is number one--when a company forgets that simple face they are doomed.
I agree, the cost of poor quality is huge!

To be fair, I do not think of it as a "Montana" or "Keystone" specific problem. I read the other forums and know the trials and tribulation friends have had with other brands. I see it as an industry problem. Too much consolidation in an industry that still likes to present itself as home spun.
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Old 01-09-2020, 07:53 AM   #44
speedster100
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Not a specific problem to Montana or Keystone, but it is a specific problem to Thor Products across their fleet of various brands. We bought our new 2015 Montana knowing full well that basic maintenance and small repairs would be required. With well over 30yrs of RVing and having owned various rv's from tent trailers to motorhomes that expectation comes with ownership.
Never have I seen the quality of parts, equipment and furnishings as low as with the new RV's, we bought several new 5er's over a period of 10yrs. The 2013 Crossroads unit being the worst of the bunch despite ordering the high end model with full paint and all the accessories. Up to about 2012 it seemed that the industry still had some appearance of pride & quality control with a sense that people expected to have units for several yrs and that those units would be around for years to come.
I've fixed more on this 2015 Montana than all the other rv's we've owned over 38yrs or so of trailer/motorhome ownership and it continues.
The lastest is all the furniture (yes all of it) has the faux leather deteriorating daily, a constant regiment of vacuuming up pieces of crappy faux leather pieces is required, all of the furniture looks like it is 20 yrs old or more with heavy use when in fact it is less than 5yrs old with light use. (We spend the majority of time outside). CRAP.......... that is until you go to try and purchase new RV furniture CRAP and find out what they are demanding for prices.... Are we alone .....nope many of our friends are experiencing the same failures of parts in their BLANK model/manufacturer units including furniture degradation, relief valve failures, broken mid section interior walls, suspension issues, appliance failures, constant replacement of cheap plastic parts, cheap cabinet door closure mechanisms, exterior slide seals etc etc etc.... Meanwhile none of these problems were ever experienced on any of the 1998 -2012 5ers we owned regardless of models, all of them except the one Crossroads unit being Keystones........
Can't imagine trading for new and starting all over again....... The latest furniture issue is absolutely the most expensive R & R as the cost of Theatre Seats & Two Pull Out Couch's are going to run at least $4000 to replace with the same Cheap (Thomas Payne) crap or about $7000 to go to quality leather furniture..... Seriously they know it is all falling apart and delaminating in the 2015 & newer units but won't do a damn thing about it........ The industry does just enough to try and get the unit past the warranty period with all the products and then they don't give a rats ass........ It is going to come to a head when we all stop buying new because we are sick of fixing and chose to keep our old as it is still a better option than new..... Not a Montana issue its an Industry Issue that THOR created !
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Old 01-09-2020, 08:46 AM   #45
richfaa
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Nothing has changed in the RV industry as long as we have owned RV's and that has been 6 of them over 30 years 2 of them Montana's. Thor did not create the problem it has always been there regardless of parent company.


The purchaser needs to do more homework on RV's before they buy example we joined this forum and escapees over a year before we purchased any brand of RV. We had also owned 4 before we purchased the first Montana. BTW we had similar issues on the 2006 3400 Montana go back and read the forum.


We purchase cars and trucks and without thinking expect the same quality and service in our RV's. That quality and level of service was never there. The peeling pleather furniture has been a well known issue for a long time. We would not accept the pleather in our 2013 3402 manufactured BTW in May of 2012. We had it changed out with cloth.


The RV industry is what it is and it is not a pretty picture. We knew what we were buying and the quality of the product no matter what the brand might be. We have not had a problem with service or parts from Keystone.
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Old 01-27-2020, 02:11 PM   #46
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Everything that could have gone wrong with our 2016 Montana High Country has gone wrong. I won't go into everything, but after putting in a new hot water heater on this trip, it worked for 5 weeks. Started getting a DSI fault light while running electric. No hot water. Tried on propane, same result. Talked to repair shop, and advised that we purchase a new control board. Replaced the control board, nothing. Called mobile repair where we are now camped. They tried and could not fix it, and they never heard of this happening. On gas, light came on, but water went to 155+ degrees. Then water will be cold 24 hours later. On electric, DSI light came on. Dometic will not talk to repairman, but said they don't know what's wrong, either. Experts and a lot of other DIY people are dumbfounded and we're on a long trip with no hot water.
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Old 01-27-2020, 05:33 PM   #47
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If the lousy workmanship continues they will pay for it in the end when people stop buying their products
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Old Yesterday, 08:15 AM   #48
bshgto
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If the lousy workmanship continues they will pay for it in the end when people stop buying their products
That isn`t going to happen. If you don`t buy it the guy standing behind you will tell you to get out of the way with his fist full of dollars. This will be born out of ignorance of the product/industry or a real knowledge of the crap your about to buy and have a toolbox onboard that would Tim Allen the tool man jealous. I carry spare parts of most for the systems and have needed to repaire things as they happen on the road or in a campground. If you look at most products for sale today there is a 12 to 20 percent failure rate, ( Amazon ratings for example) Not only do we get a deadly virus from them we get inferior products to. Just the way it is now. So my moto is " Just keep fixing it" or "True cost of onership" to keep the wife happy and we all know what that means.
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Old Yesterday, 08:35 AM   #49
richfaa
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Do in depth homework and research of Rv,s before you purchase it is just common sense.
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Old Yesterday, 12:49 PM   #50
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We purchased our 2019 MHC 375FL in September 2018 and the first trip out the closet shelf completely broke away from the wall which also supported the clothes bar. I talked to my dealership about it, but we were 500 miles from home and used a temporary brace, which later became a rebuild of the shelf with supports than ran to the bottom of the closet floor.

Also, we just got home from the dealership, the original purchases. Opened the first slide (bedroom) and heard a "crunch". Cabinet doors opened up in transit and hinges and trim on the slide were destroyed. I'm a hobbiest carpenter was able to fix them myself. Then went around a replaced most of the catches and attached child proof catches on everything.

Then the bedroom door broke away from the wall... the frame was dangling. And the main entry door would not shut right, and the bathroom door wasn't aligned right either. Warranty did fix those thing.

After that, things started falling apart, like the aluminum sides than run under the underbelly. All the screws holding that aluminum on tore through the aluminum. I suppose the frame flexed. I fixed that myself, especially since we were a few hundred miles from home. I reinstalled the screws with gigantic washers over them and lots and lots of liquid nails.

Then one of the brakes broke . or something. Warranty fixed that one too. I still don't know what happened, I think a spring broke and whatever it was, it ground up everything inside the hub.

The bad part about getting warranty work done from the originating dealership is the horrid wait time.

This is our Keystone trailer and been happy with the first 2. This is our second purchase from the same dealership. When the dealership expanded and made a bigger service center, well, it seems they made the facilities bigger but didn't bring on any more employees. What good is that?

So, everything else that fell off, broke, or I messed up myself, I simply rebuilt, fixed, or modified myself. And YouTube was my best friend.
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Old Yesterday, 05:07 PM   #51
Ram Montana High Country
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We are on our 3rd Montana and have been pleased with them. Like Dick says a lot depends on the dealer.

double DITTO on dealer making a difference and when on the road calling Keystone to get into an authorized service location - they treated ne well last year while on the road
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