LT vs ST

[LonnieB]

quote:By Biggjb

Lonnie, I have a 2009 2980RL and currently have GY Marathons ST235 80R16 E rated. Fully loaded it is 14400 lbs. I always ensure the tires are 80 psi and check that every morning while on the road. I had one blow-out last year on a very short haul, and I have just went over 1200 miles with no mishap. But the concern of a blow-out on the I-95 was constantly in the back of my mind. I have heard LTs would work better.

The specs I came up with for your trailer are as follows;

Dry shipping weight - 10,415 lbs.
Cargo carrying capacity - 3,940 lbs.
Pin weight - 2,275 lbs.

Adding the dry shipping weight and the cargo carrying capacity together I get 14,355 lbs., which is pretty close to what you listed. Subtracting the pin weight from 14,400 I come up with 12,125 which calculates out to 3,031 pounds per tire.

The most common LT size to replace the ST, is LT235/85R16. This size is approximately one inch larger in diameter and the same width as the ST235/80R16 you are currently running. Another size would be LT245/75R16 which is three tenths inch shorter and four tenths inch wider than what you currently have. Both of these sizes, in the E load range, have a maximum load rating of 3042 pounds at 80 psi. I know this looks like you would be pushing the limits, but that isn't the case. Unlike the ST rated tires, the LT has a large reserve capacity built in, meaning the maximum load rating on the tire is significantly less than the tires actual capacity. This is done due to Federal regulations because these tires must safely carry human passengers at speeds up to 112 mph. ST rated tires are not held to the same safety standards for several reasons, they are NOT legal on motorized vehicles, they are NOT legal at speeds above 65 mph, and most importantly, they are NOT legal to carry human passengers at ANY speed.

A good quality, name brand LT tire, in the E load range will serve you well. Below is an updated list of my personal preferences, along with a "ballpark" price, not including installation. Prices vary across the country, and even from dealer to dealer, so shopping around a little would be a good idea. I recommend going to a REPUTABLE dealer, one that sells a lot of tires, one whose main business is tires.

LT235/85R16E

1. Michelin XPS Rib - $314.00 each.
2. Bridgestone Duravis R250 - $250.00 each.
3. Bridgestone Duravis R500 - $206.00 each.
4. Firestone Transforce H/T - $162.00 each.
5. BF Goodrich Commercial T/A - $188.00 each.

[Biggjb]

Thank you very much Lonnie. I went onto your webpage and found a dealer very close to me in Bradenton FL. He will be my first stop. Will I be able to bring my trailer to hime and have him do the change for me right on site?

[Biggjb]

quote:Originally posted by LonnieB

The specs I came up with for your trailer are as follows;

Dry shipping weight - 10,415 lbs.
Cargo carrying capacity - 3,940 lbs.
Pin weight - 2,275 lbs.

Adding the dry shipping weight and the cargo carrying capacity together I get 14,355 lbs., which is pretty close to what you listed. Subtracting the pin weight from 14,400 I come up with 12,125 which calculates out to 3,031 pounds per tire.

The most common LT size to replace the ST, is LT235/85R16. This size is approximately one inch larger in diameter and the same width as the ST235/80R16 you are currently running. Another size would be LT245/75R16 which is three tenths inch shorter and four tenths inch wider than what you currently have. Both of these sizes, in the E load range, have a maximum load rating of 3042 pounds at 80 psi. I know this looks like you would be pushing the limits, but that isn't the case. Unlike the ST rated tires, the LT has a large reserve capacity built in, meaning the maximum load rating on the tire is significantly less than the tires actual capacity. This is done due to Federal regulations because these tires must safely carry human passengers at speeds up to 112 mph. ST rated tires are not held to the same safety standards for several reasons, they are NOT legal on motorized vehicles, they are NOT legal at speeds above 65 mph, and most importantly, they are NOT legal to carry human passengers at ANY speed.

A good quality, name brand LT tire, in the E load range will serve you well. Below is an updated list of my personal preferences, along with a "ballpark" price, not including installation. Prices vary across the country, and even from dealer to dealer, so shopping around a little would be a good idea. I recommend going to a REPUTABLE dealer, one that sells a lot of tires, one whose main business is tires.

LT235/85R16E

1. Michelin XPS Rib - $314.00 each.
2. Bridgestone Duravis R250 - $250.00 each.
3. Bridgestone Duravis R500 - $206.00 each.
4. Firestone Transforce H/T - $162.00 each.
5. BF Goodrich Commercial T/A - $188.00 each.

Lonnie one other question. I am running a brand new marathon which replaced one that blewout last year. Is it advisable to use it as my spare or should I buy 5 new LTs

[LonnieB]

quote:By Biggjb

Thank you very much Lonnie. I went onto your webpage and found a dealer very close to me in Bradenton FL. He will be my first stop. Will I be able to bring my trailer to hime and have him do the change for me right on site?

Lonnie one other question. I am running a brand new marathon which replaced one that blewout last year. Is it advisable to use it as my spare or should I buy 5 new LTs

I don't know what kind of room they have at their location. You should probably call first and ask to speak with the owner or manager.

The new Marathon will work to get you out of a jam, short distance to get repair done, but I recommend getting an LT the same size as the others. Sometimes it's a great distance to the closest repair facility, and there is enough difference in the sizes to cause abnormal wear on the LT's if the ST is used for very long. Once abnormal wear starts, it is almost impossible to stop.

[Art-n-Marge]

I had a prior trailer where I had tires installed at a very small tire shop. Fortunately I had called in advance and they allowed me to park in the middle of their parking lot and they changed all four tires right then and there. Tire Dealers will always have a plan to service an oversized vehicle. I have never heard of a dealer that turned away business because of this. Like LonnieB recommends, if you call in advance, they'll tell you the best way for them to be able to help you. An advanced appointment and their instructions will get you in and out.

I agree with most of Biggjb's calculations except the Pin Weight. The posted pin weight is ONLY 15.8% of the gross weight - this is typical of marketing documentation to allow more sales for lesser rated trucks. In reality, for an Residential style RV, it's probably more like 18% to 20% therefore the axles are probably carrying less than 3,000 lbs. A better gauge of what tire to use is that the tire weight rating should match the trailer's axle rating. For example, with 6,000lb axles it's 3,000 per tire and with 7,000lb axles you should use 3,500 per tire.

Also know that the marketing brochures state an expected weight number. The actual weight you should use is the GTWR on the RV label which may differ from a brochure. Based on the above if he's saying he's at 14,400 lbs and it's on the RV label, then the marketing brochure of 14,355 does not apply to his trailer. Purchase tires based on the posted weights. Ensuring the trailer is actually within those ratings, well, that's a different story.

[RRman]

Suggest you remove BFG Commercial T/A Tires. One of mine was recalled. Two 0909 BFG Tires of mine failed within a month of each other in Nov and December 2012. The first one had a small sidewall delamination and held air until I got to a tire shop. The other one catastrophically exploded and lost its tread. That tire I sent to BFG and they said it was run low and that's why it failed (however this was within 2 hours of leaving the campground and tire was fine/at 80PSI and was a rear tire).
What do you think of Michelin LTX M/S 2 Tires? That was the offered replacement for the recalled tire and now I have 2 of them on my RV and 2 on my Truck.
Thanks!

[LonnieB]

Hey Chas,

There was a very large recall on the BF Goodrich Commercial T/A last year, but it sounds like there may still be some out there, and you are one of the unfortunate ones that didn't get notified. The problem was only there for a short time, but it involved a lot of tires. Supposedly, the problem has been corrected.

As to my thoughts on the Michelin LTX M/S2, an excellent tire that I should have put on my list. The only reason I didn't is, I feel if someone is going to spend that much money, they'd be better served by the Michelin XPS Rib, which is at the top of the list, or the Bridgestone Duravis R250, both of which are all steel construction.

[mamestra]

We replaced our Marathons after 1 blow out and 10 000 miles with Michelin XPS Ribs, I have 3000 miles on these and certainly feel much more comfortable, we never ran the marathons over 60 mph.

[RRman]

Lonnie, thanks to RV.net and the MOC I learned about the recall which affected one of my newer BFG Commercial T/A tires, which with some inconvenience was replaced for free with my first Michelin LTX M/S 2. It was only a few months later that my slightly older and NOT within the recall window/build 0909 dates BFG tires failed on me. I was shocked that Michelin/BFG did not support my claim for a new tire and $700 worth of damage (estimated) to my Montana. No kidding their presumably defective tire lost air before it failed - much more likely due to tread delamination than any other cause I can imagine. I make sure we tow/RV almost once a month, except for 2.5 months over the winter, so my tires get some use, but not more than 5k per year...

[LonnieB]

Chas,

When you sent the failed tire back to Michelin/BFG (the same company for those who don't already know), it was thoroughly examined using pretty sophisticated equipment, not just a visual inspection. If it was determined the tire failed due to loss of air pressure, and your claim was denied, the air pressure loss was cause by a puncture rather than tread separation. Had the loss of air pressure been caused by workmanship or materials, the tire would have been replaced at no cost to you, and the damage to your trailer most likely would have been taken care of too.

I'm sure your tires were at proper inflation when you left the campground, but in two hours of driving a lot of things can happen, especially to the rear tire of a tandem axle unit. The most likely scenario is, you ran over something in the road, something you couldn't even see, and the reason it got the rear tire is this. When the front tire ran over it, the object was laying flat on the ground and unable to puncture the tire, but as the front tire passed over the object it flipped the object up and the rear tire hit it while it was in such a position as to puncture the tire. This could have happened at any time during the two hours of driving, it could have even happened before you got out of the campground.

[RRman]

Lonnie,
It still remains hard for me to believe a object could have passed by my front TV tire, the rear duallys and then got kicked up when tread delamination was related to the recall. All I had left of that failed rear tire was the carcass, all the tread was gone. But was done is done and I was able to make the necessary main floor damage (vs cosmetic) repairs to my Montana myself so I can count myself "lucky" and no problems on the several subsequent RV trips we've taken since last year.

[hookman]

I put Duravis 250's on my trailer in December at Lonnie's recommendation and have put almost 3000 miles on them . They are good tires and the dealer I bought them off of also recommends them. I only wish I was closer to Lonnie so I could have bought them off him . Thanks again Lonnie.

[mopar1]

This question is for Lonnie. First thank you for your trusted tire advise. I, too, am looking for a new set of tires for my Mountaineer. My question is about your recommendation for www.tirepros.com. What exactly sets them apart from the rest of the tire dealers out there? I found a dealer close enough to my home in Indianapolis (Tire Central & service College park.)
I got a few quotes I thought I would share:

1) Michelin XPS rib, $1,488
2) Bridgestone Duravis R250 $996.18
3) Goodyear Wrangler HT $807.01

All the above included mount, balance and tax. The road hazard Warranty costs $17 a tire extra. The sales man recommended the Wrangler HT tires but I am not a big fan of Goodyear tires.

[LonnieB]

mopar1,

Tire Pros is a nationwide network of locally owned independent tire dealers, a franchise that not just any tire dealer can be a part of. This nationwide network of Tire Pros dealers, along with our affiliation with American Car Care Centers allows us to offer the best tire warranties in the business, along with 12 month/12,000 mile complimentary roadside assistance, honored at over 30,000 locations. To become a Tire Pros dealer, there are many qualifying factors that must be met, the first of which is to be locally owned and operated. Being locally owned and operated, many of our customers are our friends and neighbors, people we see every day, people we go to church with, people whose families interact with our families on a regular basis. We have spent years building our businesses on honesty and integrity, two things we take very seriously and that we will not compromise. The money our customers spend remains in our local economy, it doesn't go to some giant corporation off in some other state or country. Our staff, from the top dog to the sales people, to the tire techs and mechanics, are all professionals with one common goal. To see that every person that walks through our door is treated courteously, and respectfully, and that the work we do for them is done timely, correctly, professionally, and without trying to sell unneeded services. Our facilities are neat, clean, and in order (unless the wind has been blowing dirt for three days nonstop ), and there is always a comfortable waiting area, usually with free wifi access. I don't know about the others, but we even allow our RV friends to stay overnight in our lot if they need to, or just want to.

This is just a little of what sets Tire Pros apart from many of the other tire dealers. I'm not saying there aren't other honest, reputable dealers out there, I'm saying I know Tire Pros dealers are because I am one of them.

If you are comfortable with the dealer you mentioned, their prices look pretty fair to me. A little high on the Michelins, but the Bridgestones are cheap enough.

[mopar1]

Lonnie, thank you for your explanation. I also liked the warranty that can be purchased. I think I'll give them a try.
I am going to be spending a bunch on tires soon. 4 for the Montana, 6 for the truck and 4 for our Jeep. I am going to be tire poor at tire pro!

[PSFORD99]

quote:Originally posted by LonnieB

The specs I came up with for your trailer are as follows;

Dry shipping weight - 10,415 lbs.
Cargo carrying capacity - 3,940 lbs.
Pin weight - 2,275 lbs.

Adding the dry shipping weight and the cargo carrying capacity together I get 14,355 lbs., which is pretty close to what you listed. Subtracting the pin weight from 14,400 I come up with 12,125 which calculates out to 3,031 pounds per tire.

The most common LT size to replace the ST, is LT235/85R16. This size is approximately one inch larger in diameter and the same width as the ST235/80R16 you are currently running. Another size would be LT245/75R16 which is three tenths inch shorter and four tenths inch wider than what you currently have. Both of these sizes, in the E load range, have a maximum load rating of 3042 pounds at 80 psi. I know this looks like you would be pushing the limits, but that isn't the case. Unlike the ST rated tires, the LT has a large reserve capacity built in, meaning the maximum load rating on the tire is significantly less than the tires actual capacity. This is done due to Federal regulations because these tires must safely carry human passengers at speeds up to 112 mph. ST rated tires are not held to the same safety standards for several reasons, they are NOT legal on motorized vehicles, they are NOT legal at speeds above 65 mph, and most importantly, they are NOT legal to carry human passengers at ANY speed.

A good quality, name brand LT tire, in the E load range will serve you well. Below is an updated list of my personal preferences, along with a "ballpark" price, not including installation. Prices vary across the country, and even from dealer to dealer, so shopping around a little would be a good idea. I recommend going to a REPUTABLE dealer, one that sells a lot of tires, one whose main business is tires.

LT235/85R16E

1. Michelin XPS Rib - $314.00 each.
2. Bridgestone Duravis R250 - $250.00 each.
3. Bridgestone Duravis R500 - $206.00 each.
4. Firestone Transforce H/T - $162.00 each.
5. BF Goodrich Commercial T/A - $188.00 each.

There is no doubt that above mentioned LT tires are superior to the OEM tires that come on our fifth wheels. My question , and I know within reason they have a reserve capacity, but Lonnie where do you draw the line if we chose to actually ignore the weight rating that is stamped on the tire ? So we say it is okay as above because the weight is slightly under the weight rating, that is IF the weight is equal on all four tires ,but we know all four tires are not going to be equal.