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Old 03-02-2011, 02:20 PM   #1
pbahlin
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Moryde Equalizer Box Not Vertical

I've been installing the Moryde wet bolt kit. Did the passenger side Monday. And today completed the driver's side. It went well but, as in everything fifth wheel there's a glitch.

Half way through the driver's side I got a perfect front to back view of the equalizer box and it is severely twisted outward. It seems that somewhere in my travels the I-beam flange bent, allowing the box to move out.

I've made a web page with pics here. It looks like the center of effort from the springs is not centered on the web of the I-beam. This means every bump is pounding the snot out of the flange.

Also, there are vertical supports welded on to the web of the I-beam to reduce the chance of bending the flange due to pressure from the box. Unfortunately they don't seem to be in a position to do what they're supposed to do. On the passenger side, one support is over the box. On the driver's side (the bent side), neither support is over the box.

I've got some questions for the forum before I go to Keystone/Lippert/Moryde for a resolution....

First, has anybody ever seen this before?

Next, do you think it's safe to drive it? The welds seem fine.

Last, any ideas other than my own theory, on what might have happened here?

And one more, sorry! What do you think this is doing to my $1500 worth of tires
 
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Old 03-02-2011, 02:59 PM   #2
Exnavydiver
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Paul, yes I have seen this on two other units and there have been a few posted on the forum. I believe this is why Morryde came out with the X-factor upgrade. Several were installed during and after the rally. Usually it is the spring brackets that bend in or out but yes there have been some boxes that have bent. The X-factor system is three metal supports each of the spring brackets and the two boxes. They go from side to side so the right supports the left and the left supports the right. Here is a link to the Mor/Ryde X-factor site. Seeing it is easier to understand. In answer to your Question I would get this fixed asap... Dave
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Old 03-02-2011, 06:12 PM   #3
stiles watson
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Yes, this has happened before. I watch mine like a hawk. I think the welds are ok, but I think they need to reinforce the frame better. That retrofit bracing described above has seemed to work for others having the problem. Unless it affects the alignment, the tires should not be a problem. It should be fixed to prevent the danger of further twisting and possible breakage.

As to cause, I don't know what kind of roads you traverse or at what speed. The first of this problem was reported here from a MOCer who traveled the frozen tundra roads into Alaska. He had a breakdown when the Mor/Ryde RE twisted from the severe pounding he received in the process. It seems to me it is more likely to occur when there is a side force added to the forward travel. However, I am neither a metallurgist nor a structural engineer.
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Old 03-02-2011, 11:57 PM   #4
Lambchop
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Yes, this happened on our 08 when I took delivery. The dealer took it to a tractor trailer shop (Utility). They straighten the box & made up an square bar with large brackets on both ends & bolted it to the boxes. Solid as a rock now with over 7,000 miles now. Probably repaired stronger than the X factor.

Roy
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Old 03-03-2011, 12:06 AM   #5
pbahlin
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Does anybody know if this is considered a manufacturing defect, covered by keystone or Lippert.
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Old 03-03-2011, 05:09 AM   #6
Lambchop
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by pbahlin

Does anybody know if this is considered a manufacturing defect, covered by keystone or Lippert.
The dealer here in WI said that Lippert covered the repair.
The trailer was new....so don't know the length of warranty by Lippert...maybe 2 years??

Roy
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Old 03-03-2011, 06:30 AM   #7
Ozz
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Lambchop

Yes, this happened on our 08 when I took delivery. The dealer took it to a tractor trailer shop (Utility). They straighten the box & made up an square bar with large brackets on both ends & bolted it to the boxes. Solid as a rock now with over 7,000 miles now. Probably repaired stronger than the X factor.

Roy
Roy,
Is there any way you could take a couple of pictures?
Thanks, Ozz
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Old 03-03-2011, 10:39 AM   #8
pbahlin
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I'd also love to see pictures. I've looked at the X-Factor and don't really think it's a great solution for this. It is basically forming a rectangle (inherently unstable) with one long side locked in place by slotted holes (inherently unstable too). Nothing would beat a welded set of gussets from flange to web above the box in two places on both sides of the I-beam.
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Old 03-03-2011, 10:43 AM   #9
Ozz
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by pbahlin

I'd also love to see pictures. I've looked at the X-Factor and don't really think it's a great solution for this. It is basically forming a rectangle (inherently unstable) with one long side locked in place by slotted holes (inherently unstable too). Nothing would beat a welded set of gussets from flange to web above the box in two places on both sides of the I-beam.
Roger on the gussets, I just looked at mine, they welded a short pc. of small square-stock on the flange. Pretty lame.
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Old 03-03-2011, 11:21 AM   #10
Lambchop
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Ozz

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Lambchop

Yes, this happened on our 08 when I took delivery. The dealer took it to a tractor trailer shop (Utility). They straighten the box & made up an square bar with large brackets on both ends & bolted it to the boxes. Solid as a rock now with over 7,000 miles now. Probably repaired stronger than the X factor.

Roy
Roy,
Is there any way you could take a couple of pictures?
Thanks, Ozz

Ozz, I'll try tomorrow to get some pics of my repair on the Moryde.


Roy
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Old 03-03-2011, 05:35 PM   #11
rgrpmr
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I'm very interested in your problem as it is much worse than mine. I had much back and forth with my dealer, Keystone, and Lippert. No one seemed interested in my problem for various reasons. I believe the system is under designed and that the web stiffeners you mention are in the wrong place (or at least need to be on both sides of the beam). If, like me, you remove the underbody, you may see there are no stiffeners on the inside where I think they should be. My main reason for posting is that because of my problem, I have been watching what Keystone does with the new units. I just looked at a new one last week. The flange on the beam of the new unit is twice as thick as mine is. This leads me to believe they know there is a problem even though they said to me there was no problem with their design. I guess the other thing is, why offer an X-Factor if there is no problem.
Rob
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Old 03-04-2011, 02:01 AM   #12
richfaa
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I was never impressed with the suspension systems on the Montana 3400 or for that matter on any comparable unit any brand. IMO the OEM suspension will not hold up well with heavy use. We were never comfortable with the OEM system and we did have problems. Afer a suspension failure two years ago we had the Mor-Ryde IS system installed. Now that is a suspension system and we feel much better.
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Old 03-04-2011, 03:20 AM   #13
pbahlin
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Rich:

How does that system attach to the frame?

Who did the install?

What is the cost?
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Old 03-04-2011, 03:34 AM   #14
pbahlin
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Rgrpmr:

I've talked to Keystone regarding this. They've logged the call and asked me to take the rig to a Montana dealer for pics and analysis. So far they've been helpful. The service rep told me my unit is out of Keystone warranty but that Lippert 'usually' extends their frame warranty for 2 years beyond the Keystone warranty. She also told me that regardless of what happens, Keystone will 'manage' the repair and warranty resolutions amongst themselves, dealer, Lippert, and Moryde.

We'll see how that shakes out but on other problems Keystone has always been up front and straight with me so I'm hopeful. I'm not sure from your post how you went about getting your problem resolved. My recommendation is to always, always make your first call to Keystone, get the problem report logged and keep them involved.

They will be your ally in dealing with reluctant or incompetent dealers and vendors (who are surely out there).

Like you, I don't understand why the 'stiffeners' are welded in what appears to be random locations unrelated to where the suspension stresses are obviously being transferred to the frame. It seems to me to be an open and shut case of manufacturing defect which any green lawyer could win relief on with two pictures.
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Old 03-04-2011, 04:19 AM   #15
Lambchop
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Here are the pictures of my Mor-Ryde repair:

I have 7,000# axles

[img][/img]

[img][/img]

Roy
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Old 03-04-2011, 04:28 AM   #16
jimcol
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Thanks Roy, a picture is worth a thousand words. Jim
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Old 03-04-2011, 08:13 AM   #17
richfaa
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by pbahlin

Rich:

How does that system attach to the frame?

Who did the install?

What is the cost?
It is welded to the frame.

Mor Ryde in Elkhart did the install.

Cost was about 2,200.00 at the fall rally 2009


Take a look at the Mor Ryde web site.. It is a very sturdy system.
.
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Old 03-04-2011, 09:23 AM   #18
Ozz
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Wow! nice fix.
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Old 03-04-2011, 12:16 PM   #19
gcrocket
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I have been concerned about the suspension on my rig so I have added the Dexter EZ-Flex, wet bolts, 5th Airborne pinbox and my version of the Lippert frame braces shown in the picture. Holding tank straps are shown also. 2000 to add the morryde xfactor? I'll have to tell the DW so she'll appreciate my efforts more
http://tinyurl.com/6dt3huz
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Old 03-04-2011, 12:26 PM   #20
Ozz
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Gasp.... you are my hero! I may have met my Mod-mate..
Very nice, I like the improvements.
Ozz
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