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Old 03-16-2011, 10:25 AM   #1
Trailer Trash 2
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this looks interresting No DEF for 2011 dodge

I received a flier from Dodge and the new Cummings engin looks prity good especally the part of no DEF fluid needed.

ENHANCED CUMMINS ENGINE FOR 2500 & 3500
(LATE AVAILABILITY)
In the spring of 2011, Ram Heavy Duty Trucks will take the lead with a best-in-class maximum towing capacity of 22,700 pounds[2] for the high-output 6.7L CumminsŪ Turbo Diesel engine on 3500.
There's no diesel exhaust fluid (DEF) system required, and this available 350 horsepower engine will generate unsurpassed maximum torque of 800 lb-ft at 1600 RPM[1] when packaged with the available 6-speed automatic transmission on both 2500 and 3500 models. Add to that the Max Tow package, available for 3500 dual rear wheel models, and you get a gross combined weight rating (GCWR) of up to 30,000 pounds and up to 22,700 pounds of towing capacity.
Ram Heavy Duty trucks equipped with the Cummins 6.7L Turbo Diesel also boast a standard exhaust brake, providing optimal towing and braking performance. On top of Cummins' reputation for reliability, Ram trucks include an unsurpassed five-year, 100,000-mile powertrain limited warranty[3] on all 2011 engines and transmissions, helping owners rest easy.
 
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Old 03-16-2011, 11:39 AM   #2
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That's right Don, just Ford and GM use the DEF
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Old 03-16-2011, 01:08 PM   #3
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I thought that the 2011 Dodges had to run DEF fluid along with Ford and Chevy in 2011, I knew the 2010's didn't. wonder why.






i
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Old 03-16-2011, 01:17 PM   #4
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The Cummins 6.7 uses a Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF)(among other things) to control soot emissions.
Bonus is if you go to the Ram builder website there is a $1,000.00 incentive for the Cummins engine! Of course at today's diesel prices, that's about 8 or 9 fill ups for me. There are also other incentives available on top of that depending on how you configure the truck.
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Old 03-17-2011, 03:19 AM   #5
William H. Collier
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In a recent article in trailer life "January 2011" they compared the Chevy Ford and Dodge. While all three did very well Dodge and Cummins is clearly at the bottom in almost all areas. As far as the emissions system DEF is the new technology and Cummins is currently playing catch up.
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Old 03-17-2011, 04:12 AM   #6
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by William H. Collier

In a recent article in trailer life "January 2011" they compared the Chevy Ford and Dodge. While all three did very well Dodge and Cummins is clearly at the bottom in almost all areas. As far as the emissions system DEF is the new technology and Cummins is currently playing catch up.
Bill
Bill
I have, and have read that article and if I recall the Ford had 373 gears and Chevy and Dodge used 410's not all the same as far as Im concerned. I'm not picking on a particular make either, All three do what they are supose to do PULL our trailers. the topic was about Dodge not having to use DEF fluid to meet EPA standards.
I dont see how you can say Dodge is playing catching up, when it seems like it is the other manufactures trying to meet EPA standards for clean air, and Dodge is already meeting the requirments.
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:29 AM   #7
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Unless something has changed all Duramax trucks come with the 3.73 ratio rear end. Cummins not requiring DEF is a positive thing and has been praised as the only new diesel out of the three that does not need the additive. The main selling point for me out of the three has always been the Allison tranny. If I wanted a manual tranny I might be more open to the others. They are all nice trucks.
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Old 03-17-2011, 08:00 AM   #8
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Seems Cummins can meet the emissions without the DEF. We'll see if Ford and GM can follow suit.
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Old 03-17-2011, 08:32 AM   #9
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The existing 6.7 Cummins meets the current EPA requirements without the use of DEF. Ford and Chevy need the DEF to be compliant. However the requirements are more strict in 2012. I believe Ford and Chevy already meet them, but Cummins will have to add DEF to be compliant.

DEF has been used in Europe for over 10 years, so it really isn't a big deal technology-wise.
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Old 03-17-2011, 09:51 AM   #10
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I believe Carl is correct, from what I have read Cummins has had to detune the diesel to meet the standards, less hp and less torq for same displacement. Chevy 6.6 is 397hp and 765 ft lbs torq, Ford 6.7 is 400hp and 800 ft lbs torq., and Dodge 6.7 is 350hp 650 ft lbs torq. In addition Chevy and Ford are getting better mileage. 50hp and 150ft lbs torq is quite a difference for the same size engine.
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Old 03-17-2011, 11:42 AM   #11
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Dodge is coming out with a high output (6.7L HO) engine later this spring -- hence the article extract that started this particular thread. Dodge uses 'exotic metals' as their method of mitigating the NOx to Nitrogen / water conversion where Ford and GMC use the Desiel Exhaust Fluid (DEF) to do the same thing. Both go through a calalyst to convert the NOx to N2 and H2O; the difference being that Cummins in the Dodge use the exotic metals in the catalyst and Ford / GMC use the amonia in the Urea blend to do the same thing. Now, that said, Dodge appears to be coming out with a new 'heavier duty' truck frame for this upgraded carrying capabilty. All three also use the Desiel Particulate Filter (DPF) to capture the soot and then burn it off during a regeneration episode. GMC has a flyer out on the web saying that by using DEF they have been able to move the regenerations out to almost twice their original time -- now at approximately 700 miles instead of the 300 miles previously. Also reduces the amount of fuel used during the regeneration process to less than 1 gallon per.

Talking with my local Dodge dealer there is no way to upgrade my current 2010 either by computer program or frame to match the upcoming HO and higher pulling model. Also, talking to both Ford and GMC (GMC and Chevy) dealers, the value of my 2010 Dodge Laramie has gone down 5 to 8K dollars since Dodge announced the new 3500 HO.

Now all that said - the Dodge Chassis Cabs have used DEF since 2010. There is currently nothing changing to DEF for the 2012s as the current Dodge w/cummins meets the EPA guidelines until 2014 as I recall them saying, might have been 2015. However, cost of the exotic metals is going up so who knows what will change in the coming months. Cummins web page shows that they have been using DEF in their Heavy Duty (i.e. larger semi-truck) type engines and in their stationary power plant engines since the mid-2000s. They have the capability to do it now on the Dodge 3500 engines but leave it up to the vendor to decide.
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Old 03-17-2011, 11:55 AM   #12
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Clemson1881

Unless something has changed all Duramax trucks come with the 3.73 ratio rear end. Cummins not requiring DEF is a positive thing and has been praised as the only new diesel out of the three that does not need the additive. The main selling point for me out of the three has always been the Allison tranny. If I wanted a manual tranny I might be more open to the others. They are all nice trucks.
I agree on gears Greg but the artical said the GMC or Chevy had 410 gears for the test, I thought it was an error also, but when I called the dealer in my area they told me that 410's can be ordered in the 2011's
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Old 03-17-2011, 12:48 PM   #13
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This is all well and good but what I'd really like to see is a truck with a Cummins engine and an Allison transmission. THAT would be something!
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Old 03-17-2011, 07:59 PM   #14
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by CORattler

This is all well and good but what I'd really like to see is a truck with a Cummins engine and an Allison transmission. THAT would be something!
Me Too.
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Old 03-18-2011, 02:01 AM   #15
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quote:Originally posted by CORattler

This is all well and good but what I'd really like to see is a truck with a Cummins engine and an Allison transmission. THAT would be something!
Dream come true!
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Old 03-18-2011, 02:09 PM   #16
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When shopping for a new 2011 to me it didn't matter squat whether the truck used DEF or not there were two other factors of more importance, the engine and the tranny. Having had a Cummins for almost 5 years we absolutely loved it and were confident that it would outlast our rving days, but in the end we missed the Allison more. Thus a decision back to the Chevy as we also wait for the dream to become reality of a Cummins/Allison combo.
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Old 03-19-2011, 06:19 AM   #17
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Where I work we just took delivery of a 2011 5500 Dodge chassis cab and it has the DEF tank. For those interested in these things a custom tow platform for goose neck (B&W Turn Over Ball) and 5th wheel (Companion Hitch) is being installed this week. The total cost is about $90k Canadian.
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Old 03-19-2011, 06:29 AM   #18
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by Trailer Trash 2

Quote:
quote:Originally posted by CORattler

This is all well and good but what I'd really like to see is a truck with a Cummins engine and an Allison transmission. THAT would be something!
Me Too.
Same here!
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