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05-07-2015, 06:31 AM
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#1
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Madison
Posts: 1,239
M.O.C. #5906
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Another broken tank?
We've recently noticed water coming from between the frame and the underneath cover roughly under the shower location. With the trailer level its only a slow drip. With the trailer not level the water gushes out on the entry door side. When we dump, all three tanks appear to be emptying properly (no empty tanks). Also there is no appearance of excessive sagging underneath. We pulled the side wall out of the pass through and found nothing wet and nothing appearing out of the ordinary. The next thing to check are the tanks themselves. BTW, odor says that the water is not coming from the black tank.
What all is involved with dropping the bottom cover? Is this something that "Joe average" can accomplish with a minimum number of tools or should it be left to a technician in a repair shop?
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05-07-2015, 06:44 AM
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#2
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Montana Master
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Lake Gaston
Posts: 8,773
M.O.C. #12156
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Dropping the belly is no big deal. Socket wrench is all you need. Reinstalling can be tricky. For the support bars for example, pay attention and mark the DS/ODS ends so when you reinstall, the holes line up.
__________________
Mike and Lorraine
2002 3655 FL, 2005 3650RK
2010 3665RE, 2015 3910FB
F350 crew cab dually 6.7
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05-07-2015, 06:45 AM
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#3
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Montana Master
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Washington Coast
Posts: 2,688
M.O.C. #10696
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Yes any Joe average can do it .it is just a bunch of screws on each side and a couple of cross braces and peel back the black undercover and the foil insulation and it is all there to see,while you are in there you might want to zip tie all of the loose and hanging hoses and wires nice and neat as you will see they are just laying around loose in there but yeah no big deal just time consuming
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05-07-2015, 09:16 AM
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#4
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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the inlet has probably popped loose and liquid is getting into the underbelly. You have a underbelly full of liquid and it holds a lot.
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05-08-2015, 03:45 AM
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#5
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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The replacement of our two failed holding tanks is progressing well. We will have supporting strapping and flexible inlet piping to prevent further failures. Big thanks to Steve Holmes and Nicholis Cotnor owner relations for their understand and help in this matter. All parts are ordered and on there way. The Montana is at the dealer waiting.
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05-08-2015, 03:49 AM
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#6
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Madison
Posts: 1,239
M.O.C. #5906
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Rich, is Town & Country in Clyde doing your work?
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05-08-2015, 04:13 AM
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#7
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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Yes they are Don. The only dealer I would trust to do the work properly. Tom the service manage is on the phone with me nearly every day with updates and progress. Took the Montana in Tuesday. The parts were ordered and verified Thursday and Tom thinks they should be in his shop Tuesday Received verification From Keystone that the parts are ordered and shipped. Everyone involved at the dealer and Keystone is doing a great job......So far.....
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05-08-2015, 04:16 AM
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#8
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Established Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Southern
Posts: 27
M.O.C. #14578
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by richfaa
flexible inlet piping to prevent further failures.
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Do you know what flexible pipe they used or have a part number?
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05-08-2015, 07:16 AM
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#9
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Montana Master
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Pensacola (mail forward service)
Posts: 3,198
M.O.C. #13740
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There could be many things going on here. 1- could be water out of hot water pressure vent finding its way into bottom 2- could be slightly loose connections on water heater 3- could be loose connection on shower plumbing 4- could be infamous black tank rinse vaccum breaker spitting out water when tank being rinsed as mine did or putting out lots more fresh water 5- could be water leaking from drain assembly when shower being used or even water from lip of shower base leaking past screw and into bottom 6- could even be a leaking t connection in a pex line as keystone loved to t off a pex run in my rig and I am sure in yours as well. Just takes some looking with passthru wall removed and while shower is running, black tank being rinsed, etc. Make sure you check those shower base lips well (mine has two screws with rubber washers under screw heads right on entry area). I would do that prior to dropping bottom, but that is easy as well. Just be prepared for lots of sawdust, dropped fittings/screws, and things you can't imagine dropping out. And thr rats nest of electric lines, hydraulic lines, etc will be part of your cleanup work. John
__________________
2012 F350 6.7 L dually, 2013 3800RE with 6 pt leveling, Sumitomo 17.5" load range h tires, Samsung 18 cu ft residential fridge, 8k Morryde I.S. with disc brakes. Full timing since 2012.
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05-08-2015, 07:52 AM
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#10
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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My tanks and related parts are in the mail .E mail from Keystone today with the UPS tracking number.
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05-08-2015, 11:22 AM
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#11
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Madison
Posts: 1,239
M.O.C. #5906
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Tomorrow is the day that we plan some exploratory work to see where the water is coming from.
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05-09-2015, 04:58 AM
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#12
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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1 1/2 by 1 1/2 flex pipe.
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05-09-2015, 06:02 AM
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#13
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Madison
Posts: 1,239
M.O.C. #5906
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The fun has started. The belly cover is now off of the rear two holding tanks. Bet the cover was holding over 5 gallons of water. Soap suds and no bad smell says it's gray water from the shower tank. The old look and feel test shows that you can't see or feel any signs of water running over the tanks or fittings. We are now in the process of filling and draining the tanks to see what happens.
We are also seeing a lot of rust. The frame where the cover bolts on and the propane pipe is showing pitting. Some rust preventative will be in order before it all goes back together.
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05-09-2015, 06:12 AM
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#14
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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My bet is it popped loose at the input. Fill the tank and as it fills it will begin to sag you may hear a "pop" sound as the inlet pulls out of the tank.
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05-09-2015, 07:38 AM
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#15
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Madison
Posts: 1,239
M.O.C. #5906
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Is there an easy way to inspect the top of the shower tank and is there more than one top intake location?
With the tank full, water cascades from somewhere on the top. There is a drain that passes through the floor of the pass through storage into the front of the tank. All of the fittings on that drain are tight and dry. If there is no other intake location the only thing I can think of is a split tank. Any suggestions? The short term fix is to keep the shower tank drain open.
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05-09-2015, 09:18 AM
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#16
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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Did I say the tank sags or what.???? That is why we are having strapping on our replacement tanks. Very poor design... IF you can see the inlet pipe is NOT pulled loose then I would say the tank has split around the inlet fitting. Mine did the same thing.
You are gonna have to drop the tank to see the problem.
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05-09-2015, 12:13 PM
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#17
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Madison
Posts: 1,239
M.O.C. #5906
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Yes, Rich I see your point. There is nothing to support either the black or shower gray tanks. There are two "C" channels that bolt across the bottom side of the belly cover. They would support a fallen tank, but certainly don't touch or give support to a sagging one.
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05-09-2015, 01:47 PM
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#18
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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The support that we are adding are two more "C" channels on each tank plus the flex input pipe. The dealer knew exactly what to order as other brands do that OEM.
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05-13-2015, 10:36 AM
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#19
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Montana Master
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 20,229
M.O.C. #2839
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Update on our two failed tank problems. UPS advised that the parts shipment from Keystone were delivered to our dealer. The dealer will check that they are the correct parts and they are all there. So far everything has gone according to plan as Keystone promised. We are due for replacement May 18th.
We dropped it at the dealership May 5th and if all goes well should have it repaired by May 18th. We are having the dealership do some other work for us like routine miant, etc and installation of two batteries.
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05-16-2015, 10:27 AM
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#20
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Montana Master
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Eugene
Posts: 1,053
M.O.C. #5091
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Rich, are you paying extra for the strapping, c-channel and the flex connector? Sounds like you have a good dealer. Did Keystone help you with the problem even though you were out of warranty?
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