Go Back   Montana Owners Club - Keystone Montana 5th Wheel Forum > GENERAL DISCUSSIONS > Tow Vehicles & Towing
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 11-07-2019, 07:57 AM   #41
saber707
Seasoned Camper
 
saber707's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Cedar Park
Posts: 95
M.O.C. #17531
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klondike View Post
I am purchasing a 2019 High Country 320MK with a hitch weight of 2,160 lbs and shipping weight of 11,085 lbs. Add in another 1,000 lbs of gear and the total weight of the 5th wheel will add up to about 12,085 lbs. I am now planning on purchasing the truck to haul it. I am looking at a 2016 to 2018 GMC 3/4 Ton or 1 Ton, Crew Cab 4X4. Both have a towing weight of between 13,700 and 14,000 lbs depending if it is a long box or a 6’6” std box. The payload of the 3/4 Ton is 2,943 lbs for the std box and 3,186 for the long box, and the 1 tons is 4,058 / 4,074 lbs.

So all trucks should be legal to tow the unit but what do you think is best? And is pulling with a long box smoother than a short box? I will purchase a sliding hitch so no worries there!
1 ton long bed is the best choice. ( no 4X4).
saber707 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2019, 09:48 AM   #42
dennis hogan
Established Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: houston
Posts: 40
M.O.C. #17659
1 Ton. Dually. Can't go wrong with extra pulling power and stabilization
Enjoy your time in the great outdoors
__________________
Dennis & Lei
2011 3665 RE Montana Hickory. 2012 Chevy Silverado
3500 HD DRW LB 4WD LTZ Air Lift 5000
Cannon Ball Express Train air Horn 185dB
dennis hogan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2019, 09:49 AM   #43
Anatnom
New Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Monroe
Posts: 4
M.O.C. #23514
I like the long bed for ease of towing. If you get a 2 wheel drive truck you’ll notice you can tow more as well. I like the 4x4 truck because during the winter I use the truck around our farm. But the 4x4 option adds weight that will lower the weight the truck can pull. I think it’s smart to go with a one ton.
Anatnom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-07-2019, 07:11 PM   #44
sptpfx
New Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Talladega
Posts: 2
M.O.C. #25248
Decision on trucks to tow with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Klondike View Post
I am purchasing a 2019 High Country 320MK with a hitch weight of 2,160 lbs and shipping weight of 11,085 lbs. Add in another 1,000 lbs of gear and the total weight of the 5th wheel will add up to about 12,085 lbs. I am now planning on purchasing the truck to haul it. I am looking at a 2016 to 2018 GMC 3/4 Ton or 1 Ton, Crew Cab 4X4. Both have a towing weight of between 13,700 and 14,000 lbs depending if it is a long box or a 6’6” std box. The payload of the 3/4 Ton is 2,943 lbs for the std box and 3,186 for the long box, and the 1 tons is 4,058 / 4,074 lbs.

So all trucks should be legal to tow the unit but what do you think is best? And is pulling with a long box smoother than a short box? I will purchase a sliding hitch so no worries there!
https://www.trailerlife.com/trailer-towing-guides/, It would pay for you to do like I did. Download the Towing guide for the year of a truck you are looking for.
I have been a full timer for 7 years. I've owned a 3/4, and 3-1 tons. There is a big difference if your hauling in the mountains or in Florida. It's the stopping you better be prepared for. My 2013 RAM 3500, Crew Cab Laramie Longhorn, 8 foot bed, Dually, has no problem towing, stopping or smooth ride. I am pulling a 2015 3791R Montana. Add more than a 1,000. You tend to add more or what if you decide to get a heavier RV. I had a 2012 Dutchman before which was lighter. Sold my 2008 Ram Dually, Mega Cab, Short wheel base because it was only rated for 13,000 lbs.
The configuration of your truck will effect your capacity. Also, if you are a Do-it-yourself type. Check and see what you need to do to replace the fuel filters and an EGR service? I do most of all my maintenance and I have found Rams are easier and cheaper to work on. But, I understand newer ones require lifting the body of the truck to do work on them.
There are many variables to consider.
I currently host an RV park and I have seen many people pulling with the wrong vehicles. PLEASE do your research before you buy.
Good look and God bless.
sptpfx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 02:44 PM   #45
Gary-Alberta
Established Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 33
M.O.C. #21650
Might as well add a contrary opinion. I had my 2015 GMC 2500 diesel when I bought my 2018 Montana 3120. To my knowledge, the difference between GMC 2500 and 3500 is rear springs, tires, wheels, only.
I wanted the shortest truck I could get because I only pull the trailer for about a dozen days per year. I pull from Canada to Arizona, 1750miles in 4 days, then the trailer is parked for 3 months before I head back. For those three months, I use my truck to go shopping, golfing, sight seeing, etc. I don't want a dually for that.
I upgraded springs, tires, wheels to 1 ton spec. I am completely satisfied with every aspect of the towing and truck usage that I have. The truck is double cab, standard box, and fits inmy garage at home too.
Consider all your requirements, not just the TOW.
__________________
Gary and Sandra
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
2015 GMC Sierra 2500HD
2018 Montana 3120RL
Gary-Alberta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 03:51 PM   #46
CAG
New Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Olympia
Posts: 4
M.O.C. #24811
That is the same trailer, I purchased back in August. Love the floorplan. I have a few more years before retirement so I plan to use the desk to telework sometimes. Live in Olympia, WA so similar to where you are. We have a 2002 F-350 CC Diesel long bed. Max tow is 13,800 about. As others have said, I own the truck so it works. It has the camper package and the helper springs just touch.

The trailer pulls great behind it, don't even notice Semi trailers going by.

Hopes this helps you.
CAG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 05:06 PM   #47
beeje
Montana Master
 
beeje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 1,320
M.O.C. #17894
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary-Alberta View Post
Might as well add a contrary opinion. I had my 2015 GMC 2500 diesel when I bought my 2018 Montana 3120. To my knowledge, the difference between GMC 2500 and 3500 is rear springs, tires, wheels, only.
I wanted the shortest truck I could get because I only pull the trailer for about a dozen days per year. I pull from Canada to Arizona, 1750miles in 4 days, then the trailer is parked for 3 months before I head back. For those three months, I use my truck to go shopping, golfing, sight seeing, etc. I don't want a dually for that.
I upgraded springs, tires, wheels to 1 ton spec. I am completely satisfied with every aspect of the towing and truck usage that I have. The truck is double cab, standard box, and fits inmy garage at home too.
Consider all your requirements, not just the TOW.
I understand wanting to use the truck that you already own to tow a camper. What I do not understand it the total lack of caring about matching your tow vehicle to the camper you want to tow. Your 3120 has a GVWR of 16000lbs. WELL beyond your trucks cargo capacity (which I guess to be around 2000lbs, (check the drivers door yellow sticker ). We are talking more that double its capacity, not just a little bit.
__________________
2014 GMC 3500 Dually diesel 4x4 CCLB. Curt q24.
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes.
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS to be installed 6/2020
beeje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 05:11 PM   #48
Gary-Alberta
Established Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 33
M.O.C. #21650
Beeje
My loaded rear axle is 6150
Rear axle capacity is 6200
Tires rated at 3525 each, total 7050
I am satisfied that I am rolling down the road safely.
__________________
Gary and Sandra
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
2015 GMC Sierra 2500HD
2018 Montana 3120RL
Gary-Alberta is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 05:27 PM   #49
beeje
Montana Master
 
beeje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 1,320
M.O.C. #17894
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary-Alberta View Post
Beeje
My loaded rear axle is 6150
Rear axle capacity is 6200
Tires rated at 3525 each, total 7050
I am satisfied that I am rolling down the road safely.
Gary, I'm not trying to beat you up in any way, I'm just trying to make you aware that your truck is WAY undersized for that camper. If you do not believe me, go out to your truck and look at the yellow sticker on the drivers door post and report back with what it states as your cargo carrying capacity.

Your camper will have a pin weight around 3000-4000 lbs. That's without including anyone in the truck/ fuel / firewood / dog / or whatever else you may be carting along.
__________________
2014 GMC 3500 Dually diesel 4x4 CCLB. Curt q24.
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes.
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS to be installed 6/2020
beeje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 06:57 PM   #50
TLightning
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Kville
Posts: 2,776
M.O.C. #7871
Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje View Post
Gary, I'm not trying to beat you up in any way, I'm just trying to make you aware that your truck is WAY undersized for that camper. If you do not believe me, go out to your truck and look at the yellow sticker on the drivers door post and report back with what it states as your cargo carrying capacity.

Your camper will have a pin weight around 3000-4000 lbs. That's without including anyone in the truck/ fuel / firewood / dog / or whatever else you may be carting along.
You are exactly correct, but you can never convince a guy driving a 3/4 ton truck that it's not enough truck.

Gary's comment "Consider all your requirements, not just the TOW," misses the entire point. Towing is the most important thing that truck will ever do, even if only part time. The truck needs to be purchased that will do the toughest job/heaviest job, not the easy jobs.
TLightning is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 07:05 PM   #51
sptpfx
New Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2019
Location: Talladega
Posts: 2
M.O.C. #25248
Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje View Post
Gary, I'm not trying to beat you up in any way, I'm just trying to make you aware that your truck is WAY undersized for that camper. If you do not believe me, go out to your truck and look at the yellow sticker on the drivers door post and report back with what it states as your cargo carrying capacity.

Your camper will have a pin weight around 3000-4000 lbs. That's without including anyone in the truck/ fuel / firewood / dog / or whatever else you may be carting along.

View what happened to my friend. He was pulling a new 40ft pull behind with a Nissan Titan I-20, Mile marker 169. Doing 70 in a 70 MPH zone. Semi was doing around 60-65. No distractions, ie phones,texting, drinking. We all tried to tell him he needed a larger truck but he wouldn't listen. Now he owns a 2016 Ram 2500 4WD, gas burner, 11, 000lb fifth wheel. Oh yeah, he almost killed his granddaughter. I tell everyone to really make sure what you are using to pull trailers are SAFE for towing and STOPPING. He bought a gas burner for his everyday driving.
Just remember you can buy many things but not family members.
Thanks for giving sound advice.
sptpfx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 08:23 PM   #52
jsb5717
Montana Fan
 
jsb5717's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: Milwaukie, OR
Posts: 248
M.O.C. #23668
In all fairness it looks like Gary did also make an attempt to upgrade his truck to accomodate the heavier load...springs being a big part of the payload. Bummer is that the upgrades are undocumented for actual payload. There's no way to know if he has satisfied any legal issues should there be an accident. I'm not sure, are the brakes bigger on a 1 ton vs 3/4 ton?
__________________

Jeff & Sandi (and Teddy - 7lb Schnorkie)
2018 Montana HC 305RL / Andersen Ultimate Hitch on B&W Ball
2012 RAM 3500 Big Horn Crew Cab 4x4 SRW / AMP Power Running Boards
jsb5717 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 08:27 PM   #53
mlh
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Salem
Posts: 4,890
M.O.C. #2283
The brakes on a 3/4 and 1 ton SRW truck are exactly the same. In fact every thing on the the trucks are the same except for the rear springs which he upgraded
Lynwood
__________________
www.harrellsprec.com
Lynwood Harrell
323 RL HC 2008 F250
mlh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-08-2019, 10:07 PM   #54
powerhaulic
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: piseco
Posts: 235
M.O.C. #20884
I'm with Gary 100%, I was in the same boat with my '18.
the ONLY difference 2500-3500-SRW with the GM's up to '19 is the rear spring pack. And the 3500 DRW actually has smaller rotors.


I installed air bags and heavier load tires, sticker be damned the truck was every bit as "safe" as the 3500



__________________
2020 AT4 3500 SRW Duramax SB
2018 Denali Duramax crew (traded)
2018.5 Montana 3811MS Legacy
Lippert AirRide pinbox / PullRite SuperLight hitch
powerhaulic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2019, 05:53 AM   #55
jeffba
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bastrop
Posts: 2,008
M.O.C. #20753
Gary,

What is the GVWR of a 2015 GMC 3500 SRW?
The reason I ask is Ford's SRW F350s currently top out at 11,500lbs.
The difference between a Ford f250 and a F350 is the rear spring.
Your truck under load is 12,350 lbs.

I do not understand how adding a springs and tires increases your GVWR to over 12350 lbs
__________________
2019 20th Anniversary Edition 3701LK
B&W 20K for Ford OEM Puck
2018 Ford F-350 Lariat CCLB PSD DRW
Poke super lignum unum et diem
jeffba is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2019, 06:44 AM   #56
Dave W
Montana Master
 
Dave W's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Upstate NY
Posts: 906
M.O.C. #14547
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlh View Post
The brakes on a 3/4 and 1 ton SRW truck are exactly the same. In fact every thing on the the trucks are the same except for the rear springs which he upgraded

Lynwood

I had to do some research before we bought our current 5er so found that they are not quite the same. Or at least a Ford. A Ford 3/4 T has a 3-1/2" 6200 rated axle tube while a 1 T has a 4" axle tube 7280 rated and a an axle shaft 1/8" larger in diameter. Some of the later 3/4 T trucks (2017 up)have been equipped with a 4"and larger shaft so there is overlap. Also, the 1 T trucks generally have one or more spring leaf for that higher payload rating plus a 4" raising block vs the 2" on the 3/4T - and again, 2017 up, there is some cross mixing. Then there is the Sterling/Dana differential confusion and gear sizing. The F350 gets the higher capacity tires as well, ~3400# vs the ~3700#. But with that said, from the frame up (sprung weight) - identical except for the badges.



GM and Fiat - not a clue but suspect similar
__________________
Dave W
Traveling with my DW Susan, a couple poodlepups and our 2014 Montana High Country 343RL, being towed by a 6.7 2011 F250 CCLB using a B&W hitch and OEM puck system
Dave W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2019, 07:00 AM   #57
powerhaulic
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: piseco
Posts: 235
M.O.C. #20884
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave W View Post
I had to do some research before we bought our current 5er so found that they are not quite the same. Or at least a Ford. A Ford 3/4 T has a 3-1/2" 6200 rated axle tube while a 1 T has a 4" axle tube 7280 rated and a an axle shaft 1/8" larger in diameter. Some of the later 3/4 T trucks (2017 up)have been equipped with a 4"and larger shaft so there is overlap. Also, the 1 T trucks generally have one or more spring leaf for that higher payload rating plus a 4" raising block vs the 2" on the 3/4T - and again, 2017 up, there is some cross mixing. Then there is the Sterling/Dana differential confusion and gear sizing. The F350 gets the higher capacity tires as well, ~3400# vs the ~3700#. But with that said, from the frame up (sprung weight) - identical except for the badges.



GM and Fiat - not a clue but suspect similar
Gm, is all I can address in this respect.
'19 and prior there is no difference other than the spring pack.
'20 is a different story, the 3500 gets a larger rear ring gear, bigger brakes and different programming to allow full torque rating in first gear.
__________________
2020 AT4 3500 SRW Duramax SB
2018 Denali Duramax crew (traded)
2018.5 Montana 3811MS Legacy
Lippert AirRide pinbox / PullRite SuperLight hitch
powerhaulic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2019, 08:43 AM   #58
beeje
Montana Master
 
beeje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 1,320
M.O.C. #17894
The bottom line is that if you are towing with an inadequately sized truck for the load you are hauling and happen to get involved in an accident that god forbid seriously injures or kills someone, you will be sued with NO chance of winning your case.

The #s are the #s and are there for a reason. NONE of them (camper or truck) should be exceeded.
__________________
2014 GMC 3500 Dually diesel 4x4 CCLB. Curt q24.
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes.
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS to be installed 6/2020
beeje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2019, 09:05 AM   #59
dfb
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Gardnerville
Posts: 691
M.O.C. #17163
Quote:
Originally Posted by beeje View Post
The bottom line is that if you are towing with an inadequately sized truck for the load you are hauling and happen to get involved in an accident that god forbid seriously injures or kills someone, you will be sued with NO chance of winning your case.

The #s are the #s and are there for a reason. NONE of them (camper or truck) should be exceeded.
HOGWASH! First, anyone can be sued for anything. Second, the person AT FAULT is the liable party. Lastly, I wish folks would stop with this..
Now, get the weight of that truck BEFORE you buy. My guess is that the weighs in at near 9000 lbs with fuel and two people and hitch. If the Gvwr of that 3/4 ton is 10,000, the weight of the pin is too much, as it leaves 1000 pounds of leeway.. Do yourself a huge favour, Get a 1 ton dually long bed.. I DO see many GMS but i have no idea what the tow ratings are.. i do think the new Generals are more tow capable, whereas it was FORD AND RAMS..
dfb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2019, 10:56 AM   #60
CAG
New Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Olympia
Posts: 4
M.O.C. #24811
First, I am not a lawyer. Yes, there is alot of confusion on what a truck is rated for. Yes, there is the sticker on the truck (10,000) yet I get a truck registration from the state saying (12,000) and I have to pay the bill for that one. I have read that for some time period (not sure when) the makers derated 1 tons to let people driver without a CDL. Thus alot of 1 tons that have the 9,999 GVW rather than what they are really rated for by the makers. Your truck is ALWAYS limited by the weakest link, be that tires, axles, brakes, trailer brakes and controllers, etc.

As to legal, I would agree if it is not your fault doesn't matter. Not sure it matters if it is your fault. Insurance still covers... heck don't they cover if you are drunk and hit someone?

FYI, Light Truck tires are de-rated by 10%, they figure everyone overloads them. Although this site doesn't have the reserve amount they do mention it - Tires branded with the "LT" designation are the "little brothers" of 18-wheel tractor-trailer tires and are designed to provide substantial reserve capacity to accept the additional stresses of carrying heavy cargo. https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiret....jsp?techid=46
CAG is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Montana RV, Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:26 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×