Electric Usage for Seasonal Campsite - Montana Owners Club

kozzy · 06-02-2019, 08:14 AM

I am new to having a seasonal site with my Montata. I just got my first electric bill for the month of may, needless to say I was blown off my chair at the bill. I am looking for a comparison of the rates charged at other parks, first of all, then Id like some opinions on the amount used. I am calling BS , but before I complain I want to do my homework. I admit I didn't take the reading in the beginning of the month, but I am past that now. so, here we go. My park charges $.27 per kWh. How is that compared to other places? For my home service, I pay $.13. Next, they charged me for 411 kwH, per the meter read, this is where I call BS. I dropped my unit off up there on May 3, and the reading they took was through yesterday. They didn't take a reading on the day I arrived, they took it on April 29. They say no one was on that site between then and when I checked in. I call BS on that. Next, my unit sat up there, plugged in with just the fridge on for pretty much the whole time. I was up there a total of 5 nights the whole month. Now, I haven't used AC yet,I did have the fireplace on briefly now and then to take the chill out at night, and I did have my hot water heater on both electric and gas. I dont see how I used 411 kwH in that time , it dosent seem possible. I happened to get my home bill yesterday as well, and I used 1145 kwH for my 3500 SqFt house, that has a hot tub always running and lots of other juicy things....how could my camper use a third of what I use at home, for basically 5 nights and a fridge running for a month? Dosent seem possible to me. Anyone know what the average kwH is for the fridge?
I am going up on Friday, and the first thing I am going to do is check the meter, so I can get a baseline of what 1 week with the camper just sitting there unoccupied uses. Im just looking for some other info and insight if anyone might have it. Thanks

BB_TX · 06-02-2019, 08:45 AM

I can't help with the rates. But I am curious. Was the bill based entirely on the 411 kwh @ $0.27/kwh? Or were there a bunch of "usage fees" attached?

kozzy · 06-02-2019, 09:26 AM

the bill was $110, so that's 411 x .27. Any service charges they have appear to be included in the flat .27 fee.

**DQDick** · 06-02-2019, 10:27 AM

I have two home bases, one in New Mexico and one in Kansas and pay a little over .09 at each of them, but those are two of the states with the lowest electric costs in the country. I used 1045 kWh last month. You need to find out how the electric bill is calculated. Parks are typically billed commercial (my Kansas home base is billed residential) and may have increased rates as the overal usage in the park goes up. Others may be amortizing the cost of providing you with power (pedestals, meters, reading, bookeeping etc.) and adding it to the rate they are charged to get the rate they charge you. There are only a couple of states that prohibit this practice.

Loneoak · 06-02-2019, 10:51 AM

We stay at an RV resort in Florida for 3 - 4 months every winter. We pay $625 per month, and this includes $60 worth of electricity. If you use more than that, they charge you the difference. The charge is 7.653 cents per Kwh for the first 1,000 Kwh and 9.259 cents over that.

We used 576 Kwh total one month and 763 another month. Our water heater is on electric only, our fridge is on electric. We use the fireplace when it is very cool, as it can be some nights. We use the a/c on hot days, but only a fan in the window on hot nights. I made Reflectix covers for the windows to keep our a/c costs down next year because our large windows face west. We also have a 3.5 cf freezer which runs all the time.

I hope this helps.

**AZ Traveler** · 06-02-2019, 11:43 AM

Ed,

You did not say where your site is but the figure that jumps out at me is $.27 Kwh. That is higher than I would expect by a factor of 2 or 3.

An RV reefer uses a fair amount more electricity than a residential. I would recommend not running your reefer if you are going to be away for more than a week. Your HW heater should get turned off anytime you leave for a day or two - it will heat right back up.

kc8lvy · 06-02-2019, 11:55 AM

I used a tool that measures killawatts. My fridge is a Norcold 2118, 18 cubic feet RV fridge. It used about 12 killawatts a day in the summer. That's about 360 killawatts a month. So 411 killawatts is not that much more. By the time you used your hot water heater and space heater, TV and some lights I can see 411. But the $.027 a killawatts seems a bit high. I pay $.011 a killawatt.
The tool I used is called Kill A Watt EZ Meter.

kozzy · 06-02-2019, 12:11 PM

Thanks all for this info it is helpful. I live in NYS, my camp ground is in the 1000 Islands region of NYS. My house is located in central NY, about an hour away from the campground. My residential rate, will all the extras National Grid charge is $.13 / kwh. Im not sure what the typical rate is up there, but they charge $.27 / kwn for their metered electric. I was really looking for numbers on the fridge, could I really use 411 in that short of a period, and I guess i could. Im going to start keeping better track of it. The place I stay is an upscale RV resort, and their prices on everything re high, so the fact that the rates are that high compared to other places does not surprise me.
I have a norcold double door SS fridge, I believe it is the 2118. Its pretty big. I am going to try and calculate the usage this week. Ill use the AMP draw with the kw for this past week to try

BB_TX · 06-02-2019, 01:45 PM

You also mentioned you left your WH on both propane and electric. If I have my WH on both it will only heat on electric if we are not using much if any hot water. Different thermostat settings I guess. Taking a shower will generally cause the gas to kick in also. So if the weather were somewhat cool it may have been coming on on electric regularly to keep the water hot. Doesn’t take long at all to heat the tank up, so turning off when gone for some time would help.

TennTom · 06-02-2019, 10:08 PM

DQ tapped one of the things to look at. Commercial power is more than Residential. I would call up the Elec company up there and get the rates. It is illegal for the Campground to "sell" power meaning they can't charge more than what they have to pay. Many power company's will tell you the rates depend on the size of the property or the total amount being used so it could be difficult to get a true rate, that's why many states make it illegal for marinas and campsites to put in meters. Only the power company can do that.

rohrmann · 06-02-2019, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BB_TX

You also mentioned you left your WH on both propane and electric. If I have my WH on both it will only heat on electric if we are not using much if any hot water. Different thermostat settings I guess. Taking a shower will generally cause the gas to kick in also. So if the weather were somewhat cool it may have been coming on on electric regularly to keep the water hot. Doesn’t take long at all to heat the tank up, so turning off when gone for some time would help.

If your water heater is a Suburban, when both the electric and gas is switched on, both will operate at the same time. If the water heater is not being used for daily use, it would be much better to just turn off both the gas and the electric.

rohrmann · 06-02-2019, 10:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kozzy

Thanks all for this info it is helpful. I live in NYS, my camp ground is in the 1000 Islands region of NYS. My house is located in central NY, about an hour away from the campground. My residential rate, will all the extras National Grid charge is $.13 / kwh. Im not sure what the typical rate is up there, but they charge $.27 / kwn for their metered electric. I was really looking for numbers on the fridge, could I really use 411 in that short of a period, and I guess i could. Im going to start keeping better track of it. The place I stay is an upscale RV resort, and their prices on everything re high, so the fact that the rates are that high compared to other places does not surprise me.
I have a norcold double door SS fridge, I believe it is the 2118. Its pretty big. I am going to try and calculate the usage this week. Ill use the AMP draw with the kw for this past week to try

If your fridge is full of food, then you need to leave it on. If it is empty, turn it off, or if you just have a few things in it that need to stay cold, you might be better off taking them with you in an ice chest and turn off the fridge while you are gone and then bringing them back with you when you return. If the weather is mild and no freezing is expected, you don't even need heat on, so you might get away with little or no bill for power. The only thing that may use power if everything else is off would be your converter that maintains your batteries.

suny07 · 06-03-2019, 04:49 AM

Hi,

we have a Lot in a Campground which we rent out while not in use.
This is in SC and renters tend to use a lot of power with their AC's.
It was fully rented last month.
Consumption Average last Month was 18KWH p day.
Which came to a total of 536KWH.
Our rate is $0.134 but we have a direct contract with the provider.

I hope this helps you getting an idea that you hav a high consumption for 5 days.

Mike

mazboy · 06-03-2019, 05:37 AM

gee, gosh, one paragraph. what again?

anyway, the rate is not unusual in some campgrounds. If you leave your RV there you should just unplugged the rig if you are interested in being charged while you are gone...it is not BS, it is RVing:-)

Rving is just not living in your real home.

1retired06 · 06-03-2019, 08:46 AM

In our Snowbird park in Florida, still have some warm months, we are metered. Most of us pay in the neighborhood of $100 per month, particularly when running AC. Never heard anyone complain much about the cost, guess it is worth it for most of us to be in a nice park with friends, and out of the snow and ice. There is a Waiting list for seasonal sites.

Dave W · 06-03-2019, 12:37 PM

In NY State north of NY City, you are usually served by National Grid with some in the far eastern part of the state by NYSEG. Neither of their rates are really too bad. This is my home use and the last bill:
Electricity Supply 0.03292 x 510 kWh 16.79

Merchant Function 0.00163763 x 510 kWh 0.83

ESRM 0.007553 x 510 kWh 3.85

Total Electricity Supply $ 21.47 for 510kwh

Then there are the delivery and service charges (which no one actually understands):
Basic Service (not including usage) 17.00

Delivery 0.055824 x 510 kWh 28.47

SBC 0.005045 x 510 kWh 2.57

Legacy Transition Chrg 0.002122 x 510 kWh 1.09 RDM

-0.000729 x 510 kWh -0.37

Transmission Rev Adj -0.00402 x 510 kWh -2.05 Tariff Surcharge 2.04082 % 0.95

Total Electricity Delivery $ 47.66

21.47+47.66=69.13 or .1355kwh

A campground will probably be on a commercial rate but .27/kwh doen't seem right as the Nat Grid posted commercial rates are .10-.16/kwh depending on class plus those delivery charges.

So, yes, IMO, you do need an explanation of how .27/kwh was derived. Our seasonal CG power (Nat Grid) has never exceeded $60/month with fridge 100% of the time, a/c left on while we weren't there but at a reduced level and 12 to 15 days of our monthly stays

richfaa · 06-03-2019, 04:10 PM

We are in Central Florida during the winter near Disney World. Wwe use what we use.Helen keeps the heat at 71 and the A/C at 78 on auto.. Fridge and hot water tank on electric. We have a 10 CF upright freezer in the rear electric it runs 24/7. Florida rates are 7.638 for the first 1000 KW 9.259 for the 2bs 1000. Fuel charge is 3.6980 for the first 1000KW ,4.6698 for the second 1000KW. They also have a Asset Securitization charge???

The bill March was 78.75 using 532KH. It was 115.48 in February . I do not know if that is good or bad but we use it so we pay it. Note the electric bill in Northern Ohio during the winter months could be over 250.00 or more not to mention a Natural gas bill about the same as the furnace runs 24/7 in the winter. We used 2 tanks of propane this winter in Florida at I think at 21.36 a tank (FJ).

Florida also charges a "fee" for paying Electric and water bill 3.00,but..... The weather is great

jimcol · 06-03-2019, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TennTom

DQ tapped one of the things to look at. Commercial power is more than Residential. I would call up the Elec company up there and get the rates. It is illegal for the Campground to "sell" power meaning they can't charge more than what they have to pay. Many power company's will tell you the rates depend on the size of the property or the total amount being used so it could be difficult to get a true rate, that's why many states make it illegal for marinas and campsites to put in meters. Only the power company can do that.

This may be true in TennTom state or his experience but we have stayed in a few seasonal sights where we have had to pay for the metered power. I ask the park in Az. how they arrived at their rate as it seemed high. The explanation I was given made sense to me. They do not mark up the power cost but they have the right to recoup their expense for laying the power inside the park. This includes transformers, cabling, meter pedestals and the out lets on those pedestals. The state utility commission tells them how quick they get to recoup those expenses. Seems to me at that time it was either 5 or 7 years. The park manager explained to me they only have about 5 out of 12 months to charge because it is too damn hot to be there in an RV the other 7 months a year. Don't remember what the rate was it seemed fairly high to me but once I understood the circumstances I understand why it would be high.

kozzy · 06-09-2019, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TennTom

DQ tapped one of the things to look at. Commercial power is more than Residential. I would call up the Elec company up there and get the rates. It is illegal for the Campground to "sell" power meaning they can't charge more than what they have to pay. Many power company's will tell you the rates depend on the size of the property or the total amount being used so it could be difficult to get a true rate, that's why many states make it illegal for marinas and campsites to put in meters. Only the power company can do that.

Is it illegal in NYS??? Does anyone know?

kozzy · 06-09-2019, 07:22 AM

This is al very helpful info, thank you so much. I def dont have a problem paying for it, I know that RV living is different, etc. This was just a first for me and I was thrown back by the rate and how much higher it is compared to my rate at home. I was also thrown back by the consumption in my RV. Since I never had to pay for it metered, I guess I never really paid attention to it. I did some math and home work over the last week, since I had my meter read, and I am putting my numbers together and they seem fair as far as usage. I do need to ask them how they get their rate..just for piece of mind.

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