Hot Water problem revisited

[sfretts]

Headed to the mountains for a pleasant weekend outing and once again, minor problems reared their ugly head. I got all set up and turnd on the electric water heater on the outside. Seemed to work fine for a short time and the water warmed slightly. I checked and found the electric was no longer working. I turned on the gas heater and the water heated right up. In checking, I found the 15 amp breaker popped and it would not reset unless I turned off the electric switch. I have read the archives on this problem with the leading suspect being the switch or a ground wire. Any other suggestions on how to trouble shoot this as none of the posts mention it tripping the breaker. Gas worked fine. With the switch off (electric) the breaker stayed on.

Thanks
Steve

[H. John Kohl]

Your breaker popping indicates the hot lead is grounded. Turn off the breaker and then pull the cover for the heating element. Check for a loose wire there. IF no problem then lift the black wire off the heating element making sure it does not touch anything, turn on the black switch on the hot water heater and turn on the breaker and see if it trips. If it trips you have eliminated the heating element. If not then ohm out the heating element or replace. If it is not the heating element the next place I would look is the black outside switch.

Good luck. Remember to be safe and disconnect power when working around electrical AC.

[firetrucker]

I'll bet your heating element has burned through and shorted out, overloading the circuit.

Bob

[sfretts]

Okay, time to get the thinking caps on. Finally got weather that allowed me to check this out and here is what I found:

1. Checked continuity of element...has resistance, so is good
2. Pulled plug and checked it...good
3. Found a circuit board on the inside that came loose from the sticky tape that held it up. Looked like a 14 gauge red wire hooked into this was touching metal. This is on the line coming to the switch, so hot all the time. Reset it and put it all together and cleaned. Turned on power and POP...the circuit pops again. It still eventually will reset with the switch off.

4. In visually checking all wires, no frays, anything that would be obvious.

Any troubleshooting advice from here? Do you think the circuit board is fried???

Thanks

Edit: Red wire s after switch and appears to be part of 12 volt stuff.

[NCFischers]

Steve,
You have already isolated the problem to the black switch or the element. John Kohl's procedure should help you isolate it further. When you lift both wires from the element and ohm it, you should get continuity. If you do, remove the switch and tie the two wires together. If the heater works, bad switch.

[firetrucker]

Somewhere along the way, I would remove the element and inspect it. You could have continuity, but if the casing of the element is corroded, the result could still be a short to ground when it's in water.

Bob

[sfretts]

Hi again,

I swapped out the element and tried to no avail. I then unscrewed the black wire on the element and again, the circuit popped. I then disconnected the switch and the breaker held. I didnot want to wire it direct but will try to locate a switch and see if that fixes the problem.

Any other ideas please let me know.

Steve

[ole dude]

Almost sounds like you have a wire that has rubbed the insulation off and is grounding to the frame or some other type of ground. If you have an OHM meter, with the power OFF you might check the wire that you took loose from the switch to ground and see if you get a reading. Most likely the wire from the switch to the heater would be the cuprit. For grins you could wire a fuse in the circuit of the two wires you took loose from the switch, power up and see if the fuse blows. Or you could wire a 15amp breaker between these two wires and power up to see if the breaker there opens. Do you still have any hair left ?
The switch I believe has only two wires going to it, which opens only one side of the circuit, the switch itself could be fried but as long as it is not shorted or grounded to anything else then the most problem it could cause is not turning off or on.

[sfretts]

Hi,

I will give that a try as I too find it hard to believe the switch would cause the short. It may though. I am about 2 hours from a RV dealer, anyone know a source for the switch so I can replace and try?

Thanks

Steve

ps: I have traced the wire from the breaker all the way to the switch and everything looks fine. I pulled the breaker and inspected. It is a cheap one but is ok on the visual inspection. I would think it would not reset at all if things were bad there.

[Crossthread]

sfretts, Try switching to another breaker, I had a weak one that kept tripping. Bill

[ole dude]

How about the wire from the switch to the HWH ? Have you looked at it .