Gray Tank - suddenly "empty"

[blamb]

Ok. So last night I pressed the button to check my tanks. My black tank never goes below 1/3 - I'm guessing some TP got stuck to a sensor. But last night both the black tank and gray tank were at 2/3 full, I'm sure of it. I just checked it again and the black tank is still 2/3 full but now the grey tank is reading as empty. Fearing a leak, I looked in the cargo, which is kinda sealed off except for the actual cargo area, felt all around, everything is dry. I looked under the RV, no wetness. I looked everywhere, but I can't figure out how to get a look at my actual black and grey tanks, my RV is one of those with the sealed bottom so the whole thing is flat. This is bugging me... how will I check my black and gray tanks for leaks in the future, much less fix them?

Anyway. What is going on? Do I have a gray tank leak or did the gray tank's sensors just die already?

[noneck]

Those sensors...are problematic. I've attempted to fix mine but alas not much improvement.

It is best to set yourself up with a routine and stick to it as most of us here have become less dependent on the monitor more on the routine.

[HamRad]

Blamb,

The sensors on the tanks do not work. The only one that can be trusted is the fresh water. The others simply do not work. The sensors get stuff stuck on them and do not register correctly. If you want correct readings you can have external sensors installed. Or you can do like the majority of us.... simply get used to knowing about when it is time to dump the tanks.

Since you are in a semi permanent situation you can leave the galley and gray water valves open all the time. The black tank you want closed until it is time to dump. Never leave the black tank valve open. If you do you will end up with a pile of stuff that will be almost impossible to remove. You will develop a sense of when it is time to dump. As soon as you do you might want to setup schedule for dumping. Whatever you do make sure you use plenty of water in the black tank. Things will dissolve better that way.

As far as the "suddenly" empty gray tank..... That happens from time to time. You will know when you have a leak. Water will find a way to come out from that covering under the trailer. Trust me on this! It will find a way out! Don't worry about that.

Have you dumped any of your tanks yet? If not go ahead and do so.

Good luck.

HamRad

[ols1932]

Those of us who are full timing don't pay any attention to the sensors. In over 32 years of RVing, I've never had sensors that worked -- except when new. I had a black water tank replaced and the sensors on it worked until we began using it.

You will know when to dump. The toilet will "burp" when flushing. The grey water tank will back up into the shower if too full. No problem, just empty them.

Orv

[simonsrf]

blamb,

I 4th it, the sensors don't work. You can trust the fresh water sensor, but you never know when it says 1/3 if you are one cup away from empty or one cup away from 2/3 full.

I have to disagree with HamRad about leaving the tanks open.

I recommend you leave all of the tanks closed until they are full. I was told that water sediment builds up in the galley tank and the grey tank if they are not "flushed"; the seals and O-rings will also dry out.

Our galley tank has to be flushed the most, but the grey (shower) is second, followed by the black tank.

After dumping the black tank and closing the valve, I then dump the galley tank, close the valve and then dump the grey (shower) tank.

We're fulltimers and do a lot of dry camping, so we have learned to keep a pretty close eye out for when they are full. After some time, you too will find that you can pretty much know when they are getting there, and it is usually a "X" number of days on each tank. Everyone is different. We can get about six (while in a park) all-the-hot water you want showers, and the galley will usually last about 4 days (while in a park doing lots of dishes). These numbers vary drastically when dry camping. While dry camping we have gone 21 days on the black tank without problems.

One last thing, check to make sure your valves are closed. Maybe you aren't holding any water and the sensors are just giving their normal crappy readings.

[exav8tr]

blamb, We are fulltimers also and I agree totally with simonsrf. I would add to be very careful and not let anything but liquid go down the kitchen sink as this can build also and cause leakage or stoppage problems. As ols1932 says we wait until we hear the burp in the toilet before we drain the black. We then drain the gray and galley then also.

[blamb]

Thanks everyone! I wasn't aware it was common for the sensors to not work. I feel better. I was terrified of a leak, LOL. I am a little disappointed, I was hoping the sensors would keep working long enough for me to learn how long it takes for me to fill up the tanks. There have been days when the sensors were working that I'd fill them all up in 3 days and others I went a full week... and I worry about when I do a lot of laundry. I think I only have 2 tanks, I don't think I have a galley tank? I only have valve knobs for one black and one grey. I really have no idea how I am going to develop a sense for when they are full without the sensors, though, does that require being able to hear? I wouldn't know how to know when my toilet burps, lol.

Any suggestions on how I can learn to sense when to empty them without sensors? Like I said, I can't get to my tanks, so I doubt I can set up external sensors. You say when the gray tank is full it starts backing up into the showers and sinks, right? I guess that's one way. Do I want to know what happens if you let the black tank get too full?

[exav8tr]

blamb, there should be a handle for your galley tank between the wheels on the driver side. You do have 3 tanks.....

[blamb]

Ok, can someone describe the toilet burp? lol

[exav8tr]

After you use the toilet and step on the handle to flush, it looks and sounds like a bubble has formed and bursts. You will know it when you see it.

[blamb]

quote:Originally posted by exav8tr

blamb, there should be a handle for your galley tank between the wheels on the driver side. You do have 3 tanks.....

I looked. There is no handle in that spot, just the panel for one of the appliances. Up in the front, on the driver's side, I have the little center with all the knobs, and there is only the one black tank knob and the 1 gray tank knob. After writing my last post I went all over the entire exterior of the Monty and did not find a third valve knob anywhere. BUT, on the now-defunct sensor panel, there are sensors for, Battery, Fresh, Black, Grey 1 and Grey 2. I always wondered about that Grey 2, they didn't tell me I had an extra Grey tank.. however it has never gone up in fullness ever, even when the others worked brand new and were all full. I just assumed that meant there was a place to put a second grey tank (I'm guessing this would be the galley tank) if wanted, but mine didn't come with it. I'm still thinking this is the case, as there does not seem to be a 3rd knob anywhere. Hmm.

[Driftwoodgal]

To be on the safe side with our gally tank, I use a plastic tub in the larger side. I use paper towels to wipe off food particles and grease and then wash the dishes in the tub. I then take the tub outside and dump the water on the grass. I don't want anymore food particles in my gally tank than I have to.

Bob does keep our grey tanks slightly open. He closes them completely a day or two before he is going to dump the black tank. I do add borax to all of the tanks to keep them slick and odor control.

When we shower we turn the water off like we are dry camping, so we don't use tons of water. I also put gently used TT paper in a trash can so keep the amount of TT paper that goes in the black tank. Don't expect company to do that, but since it is just the two of us most of the time.....

Colleen

[Mrs. CountryGuy]

Sounds to me that your Gray 2, which probably is the Galley tank is OPEN!!!

you have been in this unit for how long, and have not dumped that Galley?? No way girl! HAHA. Unless you never do dishes.

If the Galley Gray was closed, you would have water come up in the kitchen sink, just like when the Gray 1, which is the bathroom and the shower (usually, there are ALWAYS exceptions to the rule) will come up in the shower.

Remember that water is your bestest friend when it comes to that toilet, paper is your enemy. More water, less paper.

Go outside again, look deep under your slides, for that other handle.

Didn't you say that you have TWO sewer lines?? One should be near the convenience center, where is the other??? Look near the other one.

I am just betting when they set you up on that site they pulled it, and you are draining all the time.

I agree FULLY with exav8ter and the others, it is best to keep those things CLOSED and pull only when you need to dump.

I have seen what comes out of the gray 1 and gray 2. Food and soaps make a scum that turns to a concrete like substance, hard and HEAVY!!

[Emmel]

blamb, as Phil said, there is a handle located between the wheels, it will be on the opposite side of your door. It is up under the siding and well hidden. You must have the convenience center with the two handles which are the black tank and the shower or #1 tank.
When my slide is extended, I have to use the awning handle to pull the galley handle or crawl on my knees under the slide! I don't know of any Montanas made today that don't have the third handle. Believe me, when the galley tank is full you will know it!

[blamb]

Ok the last 2 posts had me looking up and under and in between, rather than just the exterior. Well I'll be damned, whaddya know? There IS a third knob! It's in front of the wheels rather than in between. What a strange place... and yes, as previously mentioned, it's under the slide and dang hard to get to. Not to mention, the same color as the frame and wheels so no wonder it took me quite a while to find it. And it WAS wide open. It's now CLOSED, and I wasn't sure I was gonna make it back up off the ground and out from under the slide, lol. Thanks guys and gals!

I am happy to have learned this, but at the same time it makes "learning the tanks" more daunting. See, I didn't get the chance to learn how long it takes to fill up that galley tank til the sensors went kablooey. I'll just have to wait until water starts coming up my sink drain and shower drain to learn, I guess! I'm hoping I recognize the burp without hearing it before I have a nasty black tank situation, though, lol.

[stiles watson]

You do have a third tank and so a third handle. On all the units I have seen it is underneath the unit in comparison to the other two. Mine comes out of the frame under neath between the wheels. It is no easily visible. I didn't see your rig model listed in your signature. Call your dealer and ask where the third handle is on your unit.

[exav8tr]

Come to think of it the DW uses a tub in the kitchen sink when she does the dishes, but pours it into the toilet to help keep it clean. Of course, we don't do that when boondocking or without a sewer line. In my opinion, dumping the dish water outside could, possibly, attract critters.

[blamb]

One more thing I forgot to add. I did this in the stick house. I am going to start doing it again in the Monty as soon as I get the right tools. I'm going to give up TP altogether, except for guests. You heard me right! I've always been against disposables. Toilet paper was the only disposable I went back to using when I moved into this thing. (Yes, LADIES, I know what you're thinking... that too. I will spare the men, if you wanna know what I do for that, PM me, lol) I am going to go back to CLOTH WIPES. They do a much better job and no TP in the tank that way. I threw out all my cloth TP when I moved cuz it was old and worn out anyway. So I have to save up money for the right kind of fabric to make new ones. It's easy peasy tho, if you cut them down to the right size you can prefill an electric baby wipe warmer with some homemade solution and put a nicely folded stack of cloth wipes in it, and have warmed up, antibacterial moist wipes for #2. And then a stack of dry wipes for #1. A water proof container filled with vinegar and water to toss them in when done, and just one extra load of laundry once a week, problem solved! And no, it doesn't stink if you change the vinegar water once or twice a week. Of course if there is more than once person using cloth wipes you'll have to do it more frequently. And like I said, I always keep regular TP on hand for guests and um, extra foul incidents (we DO get sick and sometimes...) but you'd be surprised how often I've discovered guests venture into the world of luxurious cloth!

[Waynem]

Blamb,
I am of the opinion to only open the valves to drain. This is for the reasons of coagulation of food and grease particles in the galley, and skin tissue and dirt in the gray. Keeping a supply of water in there breaks down those particles.

You mentioned that you do a lot of washing, like in washing machine. If you trailer is plumbed correctly, the washer drain should go directly into the drain that is hooked up to the sewer, and not into any holding tank. So all you have to do is make sure your sewer hose is hooked up and your washing machine will drain.

Pick up a clear plastic elbow for your sewer output. You will be able to monitor the outflow of substances. As for using TP, we use Angel Soft off of the shelves in super markets. I do not see any paper particles coming past the clear elbow - it is all dissolved.

You can do a TPaper test by placing a square of paper in a glass of water and stir it gently with the handle of a spoon or fork, or a knife. You should see it dissolve almost immediately. This type of TP is safe to use. Do not believe everything your read on packages as being "Septic Safe," as like 'Made In China'.

JMHO

[ols1932]

blamb,
You can safely use toilet paper if you use the kind that breaks up in water. Test the tp by putting a sheet in a glass of water and shake the glass. If it's ok to use in the toilet, it will readily break apart. We've used all kinds until we settled on Angel Soft which is 2 ply and breaks up very easily in the water. When we dump the black water tank we never see any tp because it has all broken apart and liquified.

Orv