Hitch style bicycle racks

[dieselguy]

I have noted there are two definite groups of RVers here in this forum … fulltimers and recreational users, but it always has seemed we blend well in the sharing of our experiences. That being said, I can see why there are reservations beyond warranty issues by many on pulling jetski’s, boats, and motorcycles. I can see why Keystone doesn’t back it. There will always be some individual trying to pull his restored WW II Sherman tank to some rally. The early Montana’s had 8” frames that were not really I beams as the current 10” beams are, but welded steel plate. If you’ve ever looked above your belly pan, you’ll see the 3” steel floor joist are not really a whole lot of structure. I’d imagine the plywood flooring lagged to the frame does just as much for rigidity as the joist. About 1500# of toys added behind the fiver is just that … added weight no matter how you slice it.
However; it somewhat mystifies me the reservations some have about using a lightweight receiver hitch style bicycle rack. In the same breath, you see people traveling down the road with 8’ step ladders, lawn chains, and a couple of bicycles strapped to the rear ladder that’s basically screwed into the 1/8” fiberglass rear cap. This is damage potential spoken from experience. Another thought is a mere 2’ ahead of the potential rack is a 60 gal fresh water tank that we sometimes fill (or at least carry 1/3 full) before heading out because of known bad water at our destination. Water is about 8.3# per gallon which works out to be @500# sloshing around right at the very end of the frame. My 2 bikes weigh around 38# each. Considering this weight on the fulcrum arm of say 2.5’ extended behind the main frame, I doubt if frame flex is an issue here. Granted, I’m also towing with my hitch, but if you would use a hitch only to support your bicycles, why not go for it? By Gosh, I know we all have our opinions, but for those wrestling with this issue … contemplate the above examples. Stepping down from the podium … Dieselguy


Kansas
2005 2980RL
2000 F-350 Powerstroke dually
Banks 4" SS exhaust / Superchip Tuner
Pillar mount boost / pyro guages
coolant filter

[Ozz]

Well said.
I think many people just don't want to take the chance of having to butt heads with a dealer, or RV maker because of a modification they have made. This may be because of the stories of problems encountered by others, on warranty issues, and just run of the mill repairs, they also have problems getting taken care of.
I also think many people are not comfortable with mechanical issues, and sometimes see a modification as way beyond their comfort zone. What seems simple to a few mechanical types, are incredibly complex to others.
Maybe those of us who 'Push the envelope' on mod's, are giving a push to those who are on the edge of trying something they want.
I just wish you lived next door, I would be running things by you on a weekly basis.
Ozz

'07 3400RL 2nd RTU
2 Golf Cart batteries 3,000 watt inverter, automatic transfer switch
Honda 2000 Generator, Maytag's with 220 Dryer
Stationary domed Sat. dish, LCD 12 Volt Amp gauge, LCD Tank Monitor
3 added 120 volt outlets, On Board Air; 12 Volt Viair 450C compressor
2006 Ford PSD 4x4 Off Road Lariat, Hadley Air Horns, Truck inverter with 110 volts: laptop, Color Backup camera, Firestone air bags,Husky air ride roller hitch, Awning lock

[jrgwdenner]

It's a valid question and one we wrestled with before putting our bikes on the hitch receiver of our truck. We have an three year old Montana and a long bed Dodge which offers plenty of clearance that might not be available on newer setups. But it works for us so we don't have to worry about putting anything on the rear frame. I personally don't understand why the Mountaineers can have a receiver hitch on the back and not the Montanas. I would think that Keystone would have added one to the Montanas years ago. But I guess that's why they don't offer me a job.

And, dieselguy, I was just wondering if I could have your boat??

Judy
http://spaces.msn.com/bamatravelers/
http://bamatravelers.blogspot.com
Traveling with Glen and Greta in our 2004 Dodge dually and Montana 3380 RL

[BillyRay]

If properly done, I don't see a problem. I would love to do something similiar, but I personally don't have that ability or confidence to do it right.

BillyRay


2002 3500 Chevy D/W 4x4 C/C Diesel
2004 3685FL

[CountryGuy]

Not to argue your points guys, but I note that you both have newer units. Keystone had/has a reason for stating you will be breaking warranty. Your units now have extra gussets, etc installed right from the factory, why?? cause some of us with older units have had frame problems, and sometimes they can and have figured out it started cause some of us were hauling stuff around on the back ends.

While at the service center in Goshen on one of our trips in, they showed us a unit, guy had a lot of stuff back there on a hitch with a shelf attached, heavy generator, gas cans, cannot remember what else, but it was loaded. One of the repairs he was in for, was a long crack in the skin of his unit, which ran from the area over the front locker up to around the bedroom window. Their stand was that the unit was damaged in part by the weight on the back end doing those physics things that ole Carol has no name for, lets just call it BOUNCING! .

Now, granted they have retrofit a bunch of us with these gussets and other frame repairs, and some of us have NEVER had any thing on the back end, not even a bike.

Short story of my ranting, they had some earlier problems on units, why, I don't really care, they did, and then they changed some of the structure in the manufacturing process. You guys have units with all the improvements.

Now, why does the Mountaineer come with a bike rack and not the Montana, is their frame better, blah blah blah, so many questions, so little time! HAHA By the way, you Mountaineer 5th wheel owners, do you have the bike rack or is that just the TT versions???

Carol

[jpbcny]

quote:Originally posted by CountryGuy

By the way, you Mountaineer 5th wheel owners, do you have the bike rack or is that just the TT versions???

Carol

I have the slide-out rear carrier on my 2006 329RLS Mountaineer 5er, I wouldn't exactly refer to it as "Bike Rack", it's more of a shelf, with it's one insertable post you could probably secure a bike or two to it. Myself I use a Front Mounted Hidden Hitch Carrier, on my TV, which is also useful for parking small trailers, wave runners, and other towed things you can't see too well behind the TV, you can also make, or purchase a step that fits into the 2" receiver so that you have better access to the engine compartment...


JP

Click Here To View My Rig Info

[Wrenchtraveller]

I agree with Dieselguy and after reading Carol's post, I am glad mine is a newer model.

Just a comment on the frames, I have both the brochures for the 06 Montanas and Mountaineers.
The Montana brochure says the Montanas come with a "rolled" I beam frame.

The Mountaineer brochure leaves out the word "rolled"

I believe this means the Montana frame has superior stength, correct me if I am wrong.

Don & Donna
Vancouver Island
2005 Ford F350 V10 Lariat CC 4x4 LB SRW 11200 GVWR
2006 Montana 2955RL
click on the little pic to see a big pic

[richfaa]

You will note that the mountaineers do not have a rear cap therefore it is less cost to mount the bike rack they have.IMO it is also a lawyer thing (legal issue)We had a local wielding shop look at the frame and say there was no problem with a light rack installed to the frame..but would be expensive to install one because of the design of the camper. If keystone would tell Lipert to spec out a frame that would accommodate a bike rack Lippert would do that..but it would mean a few more bucks.Everything that is done in the manufacturing world equates down to the bottom line (money) After using and mounting the ladder bike rack we are more than convinced that more damage can be done to the camper than installing a bike rack that will haul 40 or 50 lbs of bike. We will have a hitch installed in the near future. Right now it is a money thing with us and has a low priority. Oh there is a third catagory of camper...long timers...

Rich& Helen N.Ridgeville,Ohio.

F-350SD, Lariat, V-10,4:30 Diff, tow command Long bed, Crew Cab Dually, 06 3400RL
Mor-Ryde Pin Box

[Ozz]

Rich,
Go to a large trailer hitch sales and installer in your area. We have a great one, and has been around for 60 years here, (Croft) they do them for Montana's all the time, the installed hitch there, was around $300.00, I did it myself, because I didn't want the hassle of taking the Monte there, leaving it and coming to pick it up.
Ozz

'07 3400RL 2nd RTU
2 Golf Cart batteries 3,000 watt inverter, automatic transfer switch
Honda 2000 Generator, Maytag's with 220 Dryer
Stationary domed Sat. dish, LCD 12 Volt Amp gauge, LCD Tank Monitor
3 added 120 volt outlets, On Board Air; 12 Volt Viair 450C compressor
2006 Ford PSD 4x4 Off Road Lariat, Hadley Air Horns, Truck inverter with 110 volts: laptop, Color Backup camera, Firestone air bags,Husky air ride roller hitch, Awning lock

[CountryGuy]

jpbcny

We also use the front hidden hitch and are very pleased with the price (a little over $100) and the hitch.

Ozz, $300. ain't toooo bad. Most of us would have to pay someone to install, have to say we have seen a number of installs and some of them were horrible. One place we asked, they wanted $400 to $600 and then we saw one of their installs and the job was horrible, we were relieved we did not have them do the job.

Different approaches to hauling just bikes has been discussed here more than once (I should know, I was one of the heavy discussers while we were trying to make up our mind on how to do this). Lots of ideas and approaches, find the one that fits your pocket book and your comfort zone (there is that silly thing again, just cannot get away from it! HA HA)

Carol

[richfaa]

We got a price of @550.00 depending on the labor time it took. We will have it done but the autoformer is a higher pritory.

Rich& Helen N.Ridgeville,Ohio.

F-350SD, Lariat, V-10,4:30 Diff, tow command Long bed, Crew Cab Dually, 06 3400RL
Mor-Ryde Pin Box

[bob n pam]

Our rig has a hitch receiver that was installed on a brand new Montana by the dealer for the previous owners. Nothing was ever mentioned to us by the dealer when we bought it (having been used by the previous owners for 11 days) that the frame warranty was voided. It is a moot point now, but just thought I would post the info.

Bob n Pam
Fulltimers 10.01.99
2001 2955RL
2005 Ford F350 DRW PSD CC 4x4

[Mudchief]

Rich, why don't you just stop by Croft trailer here in Kansas City and have one put on when you head to the southwest?

Dennis & Linda
05 GMC 2500HD Duramax CC
Pullrite Superglide
05 Mountaineer 329RLS
[IMGhttp://i3.tinypic.com/znkncy.jpg[/IMG]

[Ozz]

quote:Originally posted by Mudchief

Rich, why don't you just stop by Croft trailer here in Kansas City and have one put on when you head to the southwest?

Dennis & Linda

Yea, that way, we local area people, could meet each other.
Maybe have some good K.C. BBQ!
Ozz

'07 3400RL 2nd RTU
2 Golf Cart batteries 3,000 watt inverter, automatic transfer switch
Honda 2000 Generator, Maytag's with 220 Dryer
Stationary domed Sat. dish, LCD 12 Volt Amp gauge, LCD Tank Monitor
3 added 120 volt outlets, On Board Air; 12 Volt Viair 450C compressor
2006 Ford PSD 4x4 Off Road Lariat, Hadley Air Horns, Truck inverter with 110 volts: laptop, Color Backup camera, Firestone air bags,Husky air ride roller hitch, Awning lock

[Broome101]

The talk about the rear mounted hitch and platform causing stress features up around the upper bedroom slide, this cannot cause those type stress fractures up there. Those are caused by frame stress in the upper 5th wheel and bedroom area and by the hitch stress and flex itself.
Any good hitch place or welder will tell you if a hitch is properly installed it will deliver some of that stress and weight up the frame of the trailer about 5-6 feet just as a good equalizer hitch set up would do, if installed correctly.
Rich is correct when he said it was all about the bottom line. It can and has been done many times by our members. If they are worried about the cost make it an option and charge for it just as it is an option on all Jayco Designers, Cedar Creeks, KZ Esclade, KZ Montego Bay, KZ New Vision,Open Road, and Cardinal's. I know for fact as I have read it on each ones brochure and spec pages, Jayco option cost $360.00, Cardinal $440.00, Cedar Creek I think was about the same. If they make it an option and bill you for it then they have no worry about bottom line, you are paying for the option just like any other option you would like to have.
I do believe that Dale from Lippert even posted that they could install on but perferred for them to do it, by that I mean Lippert Factory, just like you would have come if an option offered by Montana.

Broome101
2005 F350 PSD,SRW,CC,LB, King Ranch, 4x4
2005 3685FL

http://www.picturetrail.com/broome101

[richfaa]

Now that is a excellent idea.Can we have more information on Croft trailer.. OOPPPs..did a google..got their web site..If you had one done there what was their price..

quote:Originally posted by Ozz

Yea, that way, we local area people, could meet each other.
Maybe have some good K.C. BBQ!
Ozz

'07 3400RL 2nd RTU
2 Golf Cart batteries 3,000 watt inverter, automatic transfer switch
Honda 2000 Generator, Maytag's with 220 Dryer
Stationary domed Sat. dish, LCD 12 Volt Amp gauge, LCD Tank Monitor
3 added 120 volt outlets, On Board Air; 12 Volt Viair 450C compressor
2006 Ford PSD 4x4 Off Road Lariat, Hadley Air Horns, Truck inverter with 110 volts: laptop, Color Backup camera, Firestone air bags,Husky air ride roller hitch, Awning lock

Rich& Helen N.Ridgeville,Ohio.

F-350SD, Lariat, V-10,4:30 Diff, tow command Long bed, Crew Cab Dually, 06 3400RL
Mor-Ryde Pin Box

[Ozz]

Rich,
I think they quoted me a price around $3?? something installed, I looked at my bill, it was $308.00, I picked it up and did the job myself.
Call, ask for Doug, he is now at their new store in Grain Valley, not too far from the main store, he is the expert. The new manager at Croft's main store is just getting used to the new job, and well, you know.......
If you decide to do it, let me know, and I will talk with Doug.
Ozz

'07 3400RL 2nd RTU
2 Golf Cart batteries 3,000 watt inverter, automatic transfer switch
Honda 2000 Generator, Maytag's with 220 Dryer
Stationary domed Sat. dish, LCD 12 Volt Amp gauge, LCD Tank Monitor
3 added 120 volt outlets, On Board Air; 12 Volt Viair 450C compressor
2006 Ford PSD 4x4 Off Road Lariat, Hadley Air Horns, Truck inverter with 110 volts: laptop, Color Backup camera, Firestone air bags,Husky air ride roller hitch, Awning lock

[CountryGuy]

Broome101,

Sure you guys are more into the physics of this situation than I am, but, just to keep the record straight, the guy we saw at the service center, the skin damage was NOT on the side of the bedroom slide, it was the curb side. There may have been damage on the slide side, but, being honest and upfront, I don't remember any there, I do remember the curb side, it was a 4 foot long (maybe even longer) crack in the skin. Only mention this so we are all on the same page, as they say.

Carol

On edit: Some one jump in here, I don't remember any one that I know of that has had the frame flex repairs that also had this skin damage.

Again, you scientific types are much better at understanding and explaining, but if your frame was flexing, and the skin is rigid, couldn't the flexing lead to the skin breaking?? Again, so many questions, so little time

This is not the same situation as the skin crack that extends from the bedroom slide downward, the one that they fixed and on future models put in a flex joint in the skin. That is a different situation from what I was trying to describe in prior posts.

[richfaa]

Thanks Ozz. I did a print on the information..will see what happens..

Rich& Helen N.Ridgeville,Ohio.

F-350SD, Lariat, V-10,4:30 Diff, tow command Long bed, Crew Cab Dually, 06 3400RL
Mor-Ryde Pin Box

[richfaa]

I am no kind of a expert on anything,But I would guess that a "heavy" load like the one observed at the service center would cause stess problems.Sort of like the improperly mounted bike on the ladder rack thing.All kind of up and down stress could cause a lot of damage. We are talking about 50 lbs of bike and a hitch on the rear and many other RV manufactures manage to find a frame that can handle a bike rack mounted on the rear.Perhaps Montana and their engineering and design staff are not up to the task??? or.oopps..could it be a "cost' thing..

Rich& Helen N.Ridgeville,Ohio.

F-350SD, Lariat, V-10,4:30 Diff, tow command Long bed, Crew Cab Dually, 06 3400RL
Mor-Ryde Pin Box