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Old 07-10-2019, 07:47 PM   #1
BGINTN
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Cool gray tank size and overflow

Hello Everyone

This is my First Post on the forum.

I am the 3rd owner of a used 2012 Mountaineer 324RLQ. First time RV owner, an engineer by degree and a commercial general contractor.

I have a problem with my gray water valve leaking and while trying to figure out exactly where it was leaking, I discovered another more perplexing issue.

I bought this unit as an alternative to staying in a hotel while working out of town. I am staying in a state park campground with no sewer, so I use the holding tanks to capacity and then have them drained by a local septic pump service. I am 37 days into this 90-day venture when I discovered water leaking from the lower belly pan. This was odd since I just had the tanks pumped out a week ago.

I dropped the lower plastic belly pan in one corner and a fair amount of gray water drained out onto the ground, sorry but I had no choice. I then drained the galley tank and the gray tank into my tote hauling them to the dump station until the tanks were empty.

The marketing brochure and the original dealer invoice states that the gray tank capacity is 93 gallons, but there is no way I filled it up in less than a week.

With the tanks empty, I closed the galley tank valve, the gray tank valve and the main sewer valve, and began filling up 5 gallon buckets of fresh water and dumping them down the shower drain.

20 gallons, no leaks, 30 gallons a small drip at the bottom of the gray tank valve, 40 gallons, a faster drip, 50 gallons a small but steady stream of water from the valve.
At 55 gallons, the water drained slower than before, at 60 gallons very slowly, but it all drained out of the shower pan and into the gray tank, or so I thought.

At this point, I went back under the RV and the system was leaking from multiple places, including from the upper belly pan under the galley tank.

Question 1 – Why is a supposed 93-gallon system overflowing after 60 gallons?

Question 2 – Does anyone know the actual tank sizes for the 2012 model year? All models are listed as having 93-gallon gray tank capacity. I suspect they are split between the Gray and the galley but not sure what the capacity of each is.

Question 3 – Does the gray tank overflow somehow into the galley tank? Elevation wise, that could work, but I could not find any obvious plumbing pipe connection between the 2 tanks other than the main sewer drain.

Thanks for reading this all the way through - BGINTN
 
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:08 PM   #2
AZ Traveler
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Welcome to the forum!

The gray tank capacity is split between the two tanks. In the later models it is 50/50, not sure about a 12. My recommendation is to seek professional help. A mobile repair may be the way to go.
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:16 PM   #3
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Welcome to the forum! On my 2010 the capacity was split 50/50. It sounds like the tank may be split. Neither of our Montys have had an overflow on a tank.
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:49 PM   #4
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Thank you sir. A professional repair will have to wait until the off season...
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:54 PM   #5
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Thank you sir. I was hoping for some overflow interconnection between the tanks, but could not see an obvious one, so your knowledge confirms that the only connection between the tanks is the main drain.
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:59 PM   #6
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Plan on 40 gals for each of the two tanks. The one you are working with is the shower tank. There is another for the kitchen. Its drain handle extends out from the frame somewhere around the tires. You will need to drain it also.
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Old 07-10-2019, 11:13 PM   #7
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Gordon-- You have got your answers as to the 93 gallon gray tank capacity from the above posts. Your tank has more than likely split at the top of the shower tank. I had this happen to me down in AZ this past winter. The only thing that you can do is not fill the shower tank full anymore until you can have time to have it replaced. It all depends on how long a shower you take each time but normally you can get at least four showers out of it before it is full and maybe more IF you take very short showers. You might ask the state park administration if you can have a mobile service tech come in and replace it while still in the 90 day stay. They will have to have the tank empty before they change it and will have to drop your underbelly to be able to do it also. It took our mobile tech two visits to install our tank because the first tank came in damaged so we had to order another tank and wait another two weeks or so to get the tech to come back to install the tank. In the meantime we still could use the tank but since we were in a full hook up park we could leave the shower gray tank valve open. If you are having a mobile septic tank company pump your tanks just make sure your vents are not clogged and you open the toilet valve when they are pumping the black tank or they can collapse the tank and that is even more of a problem. Just remember DO NOT FILL any of your tanks to capacity because they WILL split and leak!
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Old 07-10-2019, 11:27 PM   #8
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Our 2012 has 93 gallons of grey capacity. Both the bath grey and the black tanks are identical and are 53 gallons, making the galley grey tank 40 gallons.
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Old 07-11-2019, 04:14 AM   #9
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Just a suggestion from my past experience.... in my pre-Montana days I had a Puma travel trailer that had two 35ish gallon grey tanks. One was for the bathroom, and one was for the kitchen sink. Obviously we would fill the bathroom grey significantly faster than the kitchen grey. What I ended up doing was putting a "Y" into my drain lines and using both tanks by balancing out the grey water level. I had effectively almost doubled my bathroom grey usable capacity, and we ran that way for about three years until we sold it.
Hopefully this is something you may find useful. Oh, and welcome to the MOC!
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Old 07-11-2019, 06:42 AM   #10
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No overflow on any tank. If you continue to fill the shower by 5 gallon buckets water will back up in the shower.
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:10 AM   #11
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Thankfully Montana is now using one piece molded holding tanks.
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:49 AM   #12
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You need to get someone to look at your tanks....ask to see them when dropped bottom.

Figure a few 1000s in cost
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Old 07-11-2019, 02:43 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ Traveler View Post
Welcome to the forum!

The gray tank capacity is split between the two tanks. In the later models it is 50/50, not sure about a 12. My recommendation is to seek professional help. A mobile repair may be the way to go.
Some days I think I should seek professional help
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Old 07-11-2019, 03:10 PM   #14
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Gray water wont hurt the environment at all. Some people water there lawns with it. Its just a little soap and water mixed with some body dirt LOL
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Old 07-11-2019, 05:09 PM   #15
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Thank you All, I like this group! Based on all of the suggestions, I will investigate further, hopefully not a split tank...
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:38 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by BiigDaddy View Post
Just a suggestion from my past experience.... in my pre-Montana days I had a Puma travel trailer that had two 35ish gallon grey tanks. One was for the bathroom, and one was for the kitchen sink. Obviously we would fill the bathroom grey significantly faster than the kitchen grey. What I ended up doing was putting a "Y" into my drain lines and using both tanks by balancing out the grey water level. I had effectively almost doubled my bathroom grey usable capacity, and we ran that way for about three years until we sold it.
Hopefully this is something you may find useful. Oh, and welcome to the MOC!

Thank you.

After thinking about it, I already have that in place since there is the main discharge valve on the end of the system. If that valve is closed and both the gray and galley tank valves are open, they will be linked together via the drain system, effectively giving me the full 93 gallon capacity by filling the gray tank first then the upper galley tank second.

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Old 07-11-2019, 07:43 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by rohrmann View Post
Our 2012 has 93 gallons of grey capacity. Both the bath grey and the black tanks are identical and are 53 gallons, making the galley grey tank 40 gallons.
Thank you. That makes sense why the drain slowed down significantly after 55 gallons...the tank was full!
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:49 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by WeBeFulltime View Post
Thankfully Montana is now using one piece molded holding tanks.
Thank you. Does anyone recall the year 1 piece tanks were used in the Montana's?

I would think that is common technology used in industry for decades, but whether that technology made it into the RV world is another

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Old 07-11-2019, 08:02 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Rondo View Post
Gordon-- You have got your answers as to the 93 gallon gray tank capacity from the above posts. Your tank has more than likely split at the top of the shower tank. I had this happen to me down in AZ this past winter. The only thing that you can do is not fill the shower tank full anymore until you can have time to have it replaced. It all depends on how long a shower you take each time but normally you can get at least four showers out of it before it is full and maybe more IF you take very short showers. You might ask the state park administration if you can have a mobile service tech come in and replace it while still in the 90 day stay. They will have to have the tank empty before they change it and will have to drop your underbelly to be able to do it also. It took our mobile tech two visits to install our tank because the first tank came in damaged so we had to order another tank and wait another two weeks or so to get the tech to come back to install the tank. In the meantime we still could use the tank but since we were in a full hook up park we could leave the shower gray tank valve open. If you are having a mobile septic tank company pump your tanks just make sure your vents are not clogged and you open the toilet valve when they are pumping the black tank or they can collapse the tank and that is even more of a problem. Just remember DO NOT FILL any of your tanks to capacity because they WILL split and leak!
Thank you. Good tips, especially on the collapsed tank from the suction.

I would hope the tank is not split from just the water weight and gravity, but I will have to drop the belly pans myself to determine the extent and go from there. If they are in fact, split or collapsed, I will have to seek professional help.

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Old 07-11-2019, 08:19 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by BGINTN View Post
Thank you.

After thinking about it, I already have that in place since there is the main discharge valve on the end of the system. If that valve is closed and both the gray and galley tank valves are open, they will be linked together via the drain system, effectively giving me the full 93 gallon capacity by filling the gray tank first then the upper galley tank second.

BGINTN
There was discussion on this technique earlier this year. My concern is that after you fill the shower tank you are applying extra pressure to the top lid as the kitchen tanks fills. These two piece tanks weak spot is the attachment of the tank lid.

I did use this technique in my Montana before the dropped frame came into being. It worked wonderfully.

Past topics on this:
http://www.montanaowners.com/forums/...ad.php?t=71583
http://www.montanaowners.com/forums/...ualize+gray%2A
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