EGT ..Opinions

[richfaa]

I would like to install a EGT Gage in my shinny new Ford 6.4L. I did some homework. I asked 2 very qualified sources independently about the need for a EGT gage and If you got one where would you put it Pre or post turbo. One source was the Diesel guy who maintains our busses at the school. The other the owner of a speed shop and considered to be one of the best diesel guys in the business.
Both said nearly the same thing

If you are running a stock diesel you do not need gages. If you are running performance enhancing chips or software you do need them as you are exceeding the spec's of your motor.

Both said that pre turbo is the most accurate but recommended post turbo because both have seen many cases of damage to the turbo with the pre turbo installation.
I know nothing about the subject that is whay I asked the experts. What do you think of their replies???

[Glass Guy]

Rich I agree if you are running a stock motor with no chip or programer you will not need one, if you are towing in a lot of hills and mountains it may not be a bad thing to add as you are asking the truck to work a little harder than normal. Good luck Roman

[Montana Sky]

Rich,

I am also running a 100% stock diesel, but preferred to have the EGT and Turbo Boost gauge installed anyway. I wanted them (mainly the EGT) so that I would be able to stop any potential damage to the motor or turbo before the temps exceeded the safe operating range. Being that I live out west and spend many miles traveling over numerous mountain passes each year, I personally would not tow the heavy loads I tow without the EGT and Boost gauges.

My EGT is post turbo for the reason that my GM dealership will not install any EGT probes pre turbo.

[richfaa]

The Ford has the boost guage but not the EGT. Both of these guys said the stock Motor would defuel before the EGT got in the danger zone. When I added that I am pulling 22K of truck and camper and will be towing all over the country they conceded that it "would not hurt" to have the EGT. I feel as you do Dave.I would sort of like to know what is going on when doing those long steep grades. I think I want the guage no matter what the experts say.. a added safety factor...and post turbo..again a added safety factor. I also saw some articles where it was suggested that the post turbo installation was not accurate and both these guys said not so.. as long as you keep in mind where the sensor is and what you are reading. The speed shop guy said that only in race car applications is it pre turbo as the temps are more critical and the race motor almost always blows up anyhow??? I did jump on the boost today and it did "get up and go" but..not as good as the V-10. I am sure I will change my tune later(i hope so) but the diesel is not showing me much. But... We love the truck..It is bad...very bad..

[Ozzie]

I've been going through the same thing Rich...I want both of those gauges, but I'm not the guy that'll put them in if I do get them.
I'm a little past smoking burnouts and beating up on little cars...but I would like to know how hard I'm working things.
Why they don't put them in stock is beyond me. We have a tach and tranny gauge...

[hazmic]

I have the gages on my 2000 and would not be with out them. Measure EGT before the turbo. When my temps get up there where they could damage the motor the computer cuts back on the fuel and the motor flattens out and the temps quit going up. The computer takes care of high temps even with a towing chip in it. This won't mess up the warranty will it as Ford is a stickler with the warranty. They even want our new 500 to have the oil changed by them. When it is out of warranty I will change the and filters myself but until then I have to have the dealer do it.

[Charlie]

Rich-
I have a chip and therefore installed gauges to watch. I had it installed post turbo for the safety factor. True, the response is slower than pre-turbo. 900F is the max that I should see and there have been a couple times it has creeped up close to the max, but I just get the next lower gear and the temp comes down very quickly. Would not be without them.

Mine is a pillar mount digital and sometimes when the sun is very bright I wish I had the standard dial type, anyway this link will show you what I have.

http://www.bd-power.com/ford/product...Gauges&tt=ford

[Mrs. CountryGuy]

Ozzie

off topic

is there a bug swatter to take care of that pest??

sorry guys, back to the conversation at hand, bit techy for me, but still very interesting.

[richfaa]

The Warranty states' No performance enhancing chips or software" The EGT is a guage.As I said both of these 'experts' have seen many cases of turbo damage due to pre turbo installation and it is much harder to install with more of a chance of error in installation.(their words not mine)In other words If you are going to install pre turbo have a qualified experts do the job as they have also seen many botched installation attempts by guys like me who's testosterone says .. I am a guy..guys can do that..then wind up dragging the truck into his shop for a very expensive repair.

[richfaa]

Charlie...That is the guage I was looking at because it is small and easy to mount..never thought about the glare and hard to read but you are right..Love this forum...3000 heads are better than mine.

[HughM]

By all means if you go pre turbo have it done by a pro. All it takes is those metal shavings from the probe drill hole to go thru the turbo... Bad News..

[Devildog]

While I have no chips on mine, I prefer the EGT gauge nd will put it into my next truck. I watch the heat when pulling hills, but have never seen it get high enough where I neede to slow down or pull off.

However, I think it is invaluable when I get off the highway before I shut down after a hot haul, to assure me that the turbo and exhaust have had a chance to cool down some to prevent carbon build up in the turbo bearings.
Plus, it is another neat toy.

[dieselguy]

I guess as usual I'm gonna buck the mainstream here. It is no biggie to install the thermocouple pre-turbo plus you'll get a much more accurate indication of the temperature hitting the turbo blades. There's two easy methods of getting the thermocouple in the exhaust manifold. I drill on the bottom of the drivers side manifold about 1.5" before the flange that the up-pipe bolts to. 1. Get your drill, a pilot bit, and the full sized bit along with the correct tap ... start her up, roll under the truck and just do it. The exhaust will blow out any shavings produced. 2. Gather your equipment again except don't start the engine. Coat your drill bits with heavy grease as well as your tap ... then just do it. If you still feel there might be a shaving inside the manifold ... just stick one of those small telescoping pocket magnets in the hole before you install the thermocouple. I've done 7 installations using either of the above and never had an unhappy customer. As for the factory Garrett turbo on Fords ... 1270 is max ... 1250 sustained is very concerning. If you decide to go post tubo, be sure and keep in mind you need to add about 250 - 300 degrees to your reading to get the true temp going into your turbo. I also know there are worries about the possibility of the probe breaking off and causing damage pre-turbo ... I've never heard of this possibility becoming reality. This is just my personal take on this and not meant to throw stones at the post-turbo crowd.

[richfaa]

dieselguy..Just to make my point.. I have no idea what you are talking about. I have none of the tools or equipment you speak of..you may as well be speaking Greek as I understand nothing of what you say. I also know of no one that has a turbo destruct because of pre turbo installation//however these guys do this for a living, every day, for many years and they have seen many cases...so they say??? All of this feedback is a learning experience for me and I weigh ALL information before making a decision..

[dieselguy]

Rich: Although I can't imagine someone not having a drill motor and a few bits laying around the house ... I can sorta relate as going into the kitchen for other than a beer or potato chips scares the crap out of me ... making toast is a big step for me kitchen wise! HA! We've slipped into a Mamby Pamby nation worrying about every conceivable what-if and if-so what's it gonna cost me. This rational has stiffled The US's world leadership in technology. Sadly this will not reverse. Your mechanic friends gave you a straight forward answer based on what they believe and are comfortable with. Why do most but not all truck manufacturers generally promote post-turbo ... simply because of the what-if's and if-so's as they are exposed tens of thousands of units. Can I ramble and hijack threads or what? Bottom line ... as long as you understand what temperature you're looking at it shouldn't be a problem to go either way. Another benefit of a pyro gage is you can monitor pressure vs performance. In other words, if you have a loss in pulling power and a drop in boost pressure, it gives you a better idea of where your problem is. Like you stated ... digest all information.

[MikeM]

I wanted EGT and boost gauges for my Cummins, primarily to monitor readings during planned drive over/thru the Rockies. I wound up buying an Edge chip with monitors for about the same price as a couple of good guages. Don't care about tire smokin' performance, but just want to keep things under control. We just completed the drive from Denver to Moab, UT across I70 and I now wouldn't get rid of the system, especially EGT and boost monitor, for anything. After watching the system for the duration, I'm convinced that I could have damaged the turbo via overtemp for an extended period if I hadn't had the monitors. Without the guages, all you can do is hope for the best when pulling a load at, or over, the truck rating.

I had mine professionally installed and the probe is pre-turbo per their recommendation. Maybe could have done it myself, but no way would I take that potential risk, small or not.

[mtnhntr]

Well, I am of the pre-turbo school. I want to know the actual temperatures closest to the cylinders. Like MikeM, I got an Edge Evolution II for my 2000 7.3 PSD. I got under the truck, after much internal debate, with my drill and drilled a hole in the manifold. The hole was easy, but I ended up breaking a tap off flush with the manifold - got in too much of a hurry. Fortunately, a tapered pipe thread unscrews easily and I was able to remove it and completed the tap with another one. The Evolution II simply plugs in to the OBT port under the dash and monitors 11 engine parameters,of which you can have up to four read out on the dash monitor which to these old eyes is easy to read. The wire from the EGT plugs into the Evolution plug. It is worth it just for the gauges, but for the 7.3 engine it also gives you some much needed added power and transmission shifting performance.
Ken

[richfaa]

I do have a drill but no taps and I do not have the skills necessary to do such a job..what can I say, Our family owned trucks and a complete garage..when something broke we just took it in and it got fixed. Never did a brake job, never changed out a xmittion or took a motor apart, Changed my own oil and filters a few times and gave that up.. We do have a small set of hand tools that I try to avoid using. Helen is fairly handy and uses tools more than I do...maybe she can do the job. All this info is good stuff and I have learned a lot.....I can learn..I just can't/won't do....

[dieselguy]

Rich: No offense was meant ... we all have different areas of expertise ... like I mentioned, my food preparation skills are zero ... I can mechanically fix almost anything, but starve before I got there!

[Eagle Man]

IMHO, if the manufacturer says a stock truck works fine with stock guages, that's good enough for me.