Go Back   Montana Owners Club - Keystone Montana 5th Wheel Forum > GENERAL DISCUSSIONS > Tow Vehicles & Towing
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 05-06-2019, 08:12 PM   #21
JABURKHOLDER
Montana Fan
 
JABURKHOLDER's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Cuyahoga Falls
Posts: 465
M.O.C. #18572
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtlakejim View Post
If your already concerned about it why not just go ahead and buy the dually one ton so you don't have to worry about it?????????????????????????


This isn't rocket science folks. A dually 1 ton assures you have enough truck no question about it. And if you can't handle the slightly wider rear end on one then why on earth are you even thinking about hauling a 40' 5th wheel down the road? Geezzzzz. If you can't drive any better than that do us all a favor and take a cab to your motel room!
Nice way to dissuade to new member from buying an RV.
__________________
ATC/NAC Jerry A. Burkholder, USN (RET.)

Rule #1. The Chief is always right.
Rule #2. When in doubt, refer to rule #1.
JABURKHOLDER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2019, 08:17 PM   #22
mhs4771
Montana Master
 
mhs4771's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Sebring
Posts: 2,549
M.O.C. #9969
Not all states let you license a truck for than the door sticker number. In NY the door sticker is the max, but you can go less.
__________________
Michelle & Ann
2018 Chevy 3500HD High Country DRW 4X4 Crew Cab w/Duramax/Allison, Formally 2010 Montana 2955RL, Now Loaded 2016 SOB, Mor/ryde IS, Disc Brakes & Pin Box, Comfort Ride Hitch, Sailun 17.5 Tires.
mhs4771 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2019, 08:24 PM   #23
BiggarView
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Crest Hill
Posts: 265
M.O.C. #19382
Send a message via AIM to BiggarView
Pulling it is one thing, stopping it is another and controlling it is yet another. A fully loaded Monty on a F250 will potentially be the tail wagging the dog. Straight line and gentle curves and easy slopes will probably result in no adverse problems. It is the down hill on the curves in bad weather and a rear tire failure and Mr Murphy calling in at the worst possible time that you could more likely regret not having enough truck for the job. Don't forget you'll also be sharing the road with other drivers and should one of them have a problem that tests your driving skills or the capabilities of your truck trailer combo, you'll be more likely to share the tale around the campfire instead of a hospital bed with a more capable truck.

Find the trailer you want, then get the truck that is right for job first and right for your budget second. With some searching you can satisfy both requirements.
__________________
2017 RAM 3500 Laramie CCLB Dually CTD Aisin
2020 3813MS on order
BiggarView is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2019, 09:19 PM   #24
Mr Pachu
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: R
Posts: 239
M.O.C. #17922
Is my truck capable of towing a 40' Montana? I'm going to move the fifth wheel hitch so that it's over the rear axle. What do you all think?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 14240543_19 2013 Kenworth.jpg (187.4 KB, 14 views)
Mr Pachu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2019, 10:22 PM   #25
mtlakejim
Montana Master
 
mtlakejim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Bee Branch
Posts: 2,140
M.O.C. #20693
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Pachu View Post
Is my truck capable of towing a 40' Montana? I'm going to move the fifth wheel hitch so that it's over the rear axle. What do you all think?
IF you actually drove one of those you would be in the get the dually to tow that 40' trailer camp!!! Nobody hates to see an undersized truck towing something that big coming at them more than a Professional Driver!!! They see more stupid crap than any of us!

Hats off and God Bless our truckers!
__________________
James & Irene Wilson
Bee Branch, AR.
2017 Ram 1 ton diesel duallyCrew Cab/Long Bed
2018 Montana High Country 381TH Garage Full of Toys
mtlakejim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2019, 10:37 PM   #26
Theunz
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Catoosa
Posts: 436
M.O.C. #18384
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Pachu View Post
Is my truck capable of towing a 40' Montana? I'm going to move the fifth wheel hitch so that it's over the rear axle. What do you all think?
That would be the perfect rig...IF you're trying to break your monte's frame, knock the cabinets off the wall and break all your dishes!
__________________
2015 3100RL legacy...2005 Ford F-250 CC SB. Tows like a charm! 4/19 Updated to 2017 Chevy 3500 CC SB SRW -hope it tows as well as my F 250 did!
Theunz is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-06-2019, 11:33 PM   #27
Mr Pachu
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: R
Posts: 239
M.O.C. #17922
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theunz View Post
That would be the perfect rig...IF you're trying to break your monte's frame, knock the cabinets off the wall and break all your dishes!

What's the difference, the Monte's frame was breaking like the post of Golfmedics trailer frame problem, cabinets were coming loose, all the wood trim was or did fall off along with numerous other problems and this was towing with a DRW.
Mr Pachu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2019, 05:59 AM   #28
Eagleback
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Full Timer In Naples, Florida
Posts: 894
M.O.C. #15731
Ok. Going away from the truck wars again. You stated that you are looking for a home base to park the Monty on. If you are just going to leave it there, then keep the truck you have and get the rv delivered to that spot. Problem solved.
__________________
2017, 3500 Ram Big Horn, 4x4, Crew Cab, DRW, Aisin, 4:10. Curt Q20, 2014 Mountaineer 331 RLT, Sailun.
Eagleback is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2019, 07:12 AM   #29
mazboy
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Grand Rapids
Posts: 1,498
M.O.C. #9561
your truck, if you just purchased it will do fine. I think it is too late to dump it for a one ton.
just don't lookg at mobile suites:-)
mazboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-07-2019, 08:53 PM   #30
Montana Man
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Lemoore
Posts: 603
M.O.C. #21963
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedster100 View Post
Go look it up, I've already purchased extra weight for my 3500hd and did so for my 2500hd as well. Need it to tow around Backhoe's & Dozers...

Just pay the MTO /DOT as most who do commercial work already knows...
Perhaps you could explain a little better what you did.

There are no government fees that allow you to exceed gvwr on a vehicle.
__________________
2016 3160, Legacy, Manufacturing defects corrected by me, 2014 Ram 3500 SRW SWB 4X4 6.7 Aisin Mega Cab, EBC slotted disks and brakes.
Montana Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 09:30 AM   #31
MARTYB
New Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Louisville
Posts: 4
M.O.C. #23534
When I was looking at purchasing my MHC 385BR I was concerned that I didn't have enough truck. I knew that the max trailer weight was within the tow rating for the truck and the GCWR would be under the max, but the pin weight would be over the payload rating for the truck. BTW my truck is a 2014 RAM 2500 Cummins. I asked the dealer if I could take it for a test run and he said sure. I was coming from a 30 foot Sprinter fifth wheel, so I already had the hitch. The Montana leveled the truck, verified with a tape measure. My test run was a total success! I took it on the interstate, up a very long steep grade and on a winding 2 lane road. I felt no sway, no sense of the trailer trying to push me, semis passing me at 80 had no affect and I could maintain the speed limit with no effort. I am running aftermarket wheels and tires with the tires being rated at 4000lbs. I am very confident in my trucks ability to handle my camper. Still after reading the many many comments by the weight police I was concerned about the legality of my set up. I contacted the KY State Police who is responsible for vehicle enforcement and posed this question, If the pin weight of my fifth wheel exceeds the payload rating for my truck, but the trailer is under the tow rating and I am under the max GCWR, am I legal? The answer was yes. So for my truck if the trailer is under 175000lbs and the combined weight is under 275000lbs I am legal. I realize a 1 ton would have more capacity but is it really needed? would the extra cost be justified? I my case the answer is no.
MARTYB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 10:48 AM   #32
Montana Man
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Lemoore
Posts: 603
M.O.C. #21963
@MARTYB, I would ask them the question, if I exceed the gvwr of my truck am I legal? It is a similar question to yours but is very specific as payload ratings and gvwr can be different.

No doubt the truck can handle it but if loads weights didn't matter they wouldn't have 2500 and 3500 models. If they come back and say exceeding the gvwr rating is OK, print out and save that response.
__________________
2016 3160, Legacy, Manufacturing defects corrected by me, 2014 Ram 3500 SRW SWB 4X4 6.7 Aisin Mega Cab, EBC slotted disks and brakes.
Montana Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 11:10 AM   #33
MARTYB
New Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Louisville
Posts: 4
M.O.C. #23534
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana Man View Post
@MARTYB, I would ask them the question, if I exceed the gvwr of my truck am I legal? It is a similar question to yours but is very specific as payload ratings and gvwr can be different.

No doubt the truck can handle it but if loads weights didn't matter they wouldn't have 2500 and 3500 models. If they come back and say exceeding the gvwr rating is OK, print out and save that response.
My question did state that I was over the payload rating for the truck. My take is that pin weight and cargo weight are two different things. Why would a truck be rated to pull a trailer that would automatically exceed the cargo weight? It seems to me the GCWR is what they are looking at.
MARTYB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 11:24 AM   #34
Montana Man
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Lemoore
Posts: 603
M.O.C. #21963
The truck can not exceed gvwr. It is only rated to weigh under this rating regardless of what is causing the weight. It is vehicle specific. The amount of weight left for "cargo" is reduced by hitch weight, passenger weight, aftermarket stuff, etc. Cargo carrying capacity is a rating that is misleading imo.

There are trailers that weigh a lot yet do not place much weight on the truck. Farm implements come to mind. GCWR is important but is not a concern I believe for your application.
__________________
2016 3160, Legacy, Manufacturing defects corrected by me, 2014 Ram 3500 SRW SWB 4X4 6.7 Aisin Mega Cab, EBC slotted disks and brakes.
Montana Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 12:30 PM   #35
MARTYB
New Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Louisville
Posts: 4
M.O.C. #23534
Quote:
Originally Posted by Montana Man View Post
The truck can not exceed gvwr. It is only rated to weigh under this rating regardless of what is causing the weight. It is vehicle specific. The amount of weight left for "cargo" is reduced by hitch weight, passenger weight, aftermarket stuff, etc. Cargo carrying capacity is a rating that is misleading imo.

There are trailers that weigh a lot yet do not place much weight on the truck. Farm implements come to mind. GCWR is important but is not a concern I believe for your application.
According to KSP GCW is what matters when towing.
MARTYB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 01:14 PM   #36
richfaa
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: North Ridgeville
Posts: 19,749
M.O.C. #2839
I do not comment on weight threads anymore .It is useless.We have a F-350 dually not because we wanted one but because the specs of the RV said we needed one. We are long timers and high end users. The truck is not our daily driver 95 % or better is pulling the Montana.
richfaa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 01:21 PM   #37
Montana Man
Montana Master
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Lemoore
Posts: 603
M.O.C. #21963
GCW does matter. There isn't just one rating by which we must comply. There is also gvwr, axle ratings front and rear, tire ratings. Everyone's situation is different but the ratings, if one is concerned about them, must not be exceeded.

Some police only check the gcwr of the truck and trailer regardless of the actual weights. Many of our diesels are rated for those numbers but they aren't the only numbers to be concerned with. In central CA they at times will do a wheel weight check and get folks with actual weights. If involved in a bad wreck, an attorney will be looking at those numbers as well.
__________________
2016 3160, Legacy, Manufacturing defects corrected by me, 2014 Ram 3500 SRW SWB 4X4 6.7 Aisin Mega Cab, EBC slotted disks and brakes.
Montana Man is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 01:37 PM   #38
Slow Hand
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Livermore
Posts: 174
M.O.C. #17391
Quote:
Originally Posted by BiggarView View Post
Pulling it is one thing, stopping it is another and controlling it is yet another. A fully loaded Monty on a F250 will potentially be the tail wagging the dog. Straight line and gentle curves and easy slopes will probably result in no adverse problems. It is the down hill on the curves in bad weather and a rear tire failure and Mr Murphy calling in at the worst possible time that you could more likely regret not having enough truck for the job. Don't forget you'll also be sharing the road with other drivers and should one of them have a problem that tests your driving skills or the capabilities of your truck trailer combo, you'll be more likely to share the tale around the campfire instead of a hospital bed with a more capable truck.

Find the trailer you want, then get the truck that is right for job first and right for your budget second. With some searching you can satisfy both requirements.
I have pulled my Montana from coast to coast in all kinds of weather conditions and my F250 SRW never had a problem I am right at the limit on the door sticker but never had a problem going up or down hill. Wind rain not a big deal. i got my7 truck to match my trailer which is how you should do it. By the way just for everyone's information the Montana has brakes on it. They are not just for looks they actually work. The truck is designed to stop the max towing capacity. So far I have towed my Montana 33,000 miles and consider myself a pro at towing. I have backed it up more times than I can count. No I don't use a spotter. I get out and look and put it where I want it to go. Not everyone needs a DRW truck.
Slow Hand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 02:20 PM   #39
beeje
Montana Master
 
beeje's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: westminster md
Posts: 1,335
M.O.C. #17894
Anybody can and will do whatever they want to do. The a lot of rigs being towed down our nations highways are overweight. There has never been a 250/2500 truck from any manufacturer capable (with in all weight limits) of towing a heavy camper.

The pin weight of a 10k gross weight camper could be as mush as 25%= 2500lbs of pin weight far exceeding any 2500,s cargo capacity and you have not even added any other cargo or passengers to the truck yet.!!!!

My Monte is pushing around 3k pin weight
__________________
2014 GMC 3500 Dually diesel 4x4 CCLB. Curt q24.
2011 Montana 3455 SA. 6 point level up. Disc brakes.
Progressive EMS. Valterra tank valves. Sailun G637 tires. ARP fridge control. All led lighting. Mor Ryde IS to be installed 6/2020
beeje is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-10-2019, 02:29 PM   #40
BiggarView
Montana Fan
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Crest Hill
Posts: 265
M.O.C. #19382
Send a message via AIM to BiggarView
Slowhand... you left out the operative word... "yet." or put another way "so far". Not once in my post did I say the OP needs a dually. I used the words "potentially" and "possibly" WRT needing more truck. Yes specs matter and being within specs will determine what one needs. You say you are right at the door sticker. Good for you. What you have works for you. I also did not imply brakes were a sole condition for such decisions, I was talking about control, the last point I made stated in my opening statement. A heavy trailer wags the dog or at least has the potential to. Under those conditions... more truck is better than less.

And yes not everybody needs a dually... the math will determine what is needed, not ego.
__________________
2017 RAM 3500 Laramie CCLB Dually CTD Aisin
2020 3813MS on order
BiggarView is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Montana RV, Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates. This is an independent, unofficial site.


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:07 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×