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Old 06-04-2008, 06:58 AM   #1
sreigle
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Biting the bullet and replacing the axles

I recently posted pictures of the tires on our rear axle. Worn on the inner edges to wear steel was showing through. An obvious axle problem. Keystone declined to participate in replacing the axles, saying the unit is past the one year warranty. The rig is 21 months old. I feel this problem is related to the front axle problem (occurred during delivery to the dealer) and they replaced that axle inside the one year. I asked for reconsideration with that in mind but they declined again. I guess gone are the days where Keystone goes the extra mile.

I spoke today with Dexter Axle in Elkhart, IN. They agreed the axle lost its camber. Although we're under the axle rating we're not by very much. They told me I can have the axle recambered for around $100 or so. But, given how close we are to the rating we can expect the problem to recur. I'm not positive the reason for that but apparently a recambered axle maybe isn't quite as strong as before? Therefore, every 10,000 to 15,000 miles I'd have to have that axle recambered plus replace two tires. That's likely around $400 per occurrence. And I don't know how many times an axle can be recambered. This occurrence and two additional and we've pretty much paid the total cost of replacing with stronger axles.

So, after discussing the options with Dexter I called the place they highly recommend in Goshen, IN and arranged to have these 6,000 lb axles replaced with 7,000 lb axle in late July when we go through the area.

Rather than replace just the axle itself they'll replace the entire tube complete with new brakes, wheel bearings, etc. In discussing it with them, the 7,000 lb axle's brakes are the same size but have a more agressive lining and stronger magnet, resulting in stronger brakes.

I'm also having the shackle bolts replaced with the wet bolts at the same time.
 
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Old 06-04-2008, 07:07 AM   #2
bsmeaton
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Wow, so there really is a bit more engineering to those ratings than just the leaf spring .
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Old 06-04-2008, 07:27 AM   #3
sreigle
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This thread is about Montana axles and has no relationship to the discussions on truck ratings and truck springs.
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Old 06-04-2008, 07:50 AM   #4
H. John Kohl
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Steve,
If I was doing what you are doing I would also look hard at Hydraulic Disk brakes. With the stonger axle and disk brakes you would be all set.
Best of luck and thanks for posting.

When Aram was at the N.E. rally we discussed the 1 year warranty and I got a better appreciation from him how many owners abuse their unit and then claim warranty. I know you personally and know you are conscious about your trailer weight but Team Montana has to stop somewhere. I think this discussion could go the route of truck "brand wars" so lets just drop it here. We deal with the cards dealt us.
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Old 06-04-2008, 08:04 AM   #5
stiles watson
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Seems like you made a good decision to me. Sorry you have to bite such a large bullet. I like John's idea about disc brakes, but it ain't my dollar. Wishing you smooth travels ahead.
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Old 06-04-2008, 09:43 AM   #6
bigmurf
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My old Al-Ko axles had a 2 year warranty. Do I understand the Dexters only have 1 year? Keystone just blew me off too, then I got on Al-Ko. Ditto on the disc brakes.
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Old 06-04-2008, 10:33 AM   #7
bsmeaton
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by sreigle

This thread is about Montana axles and has no relationship to the discussions on truck ratings and truck springs.
I didn't say anything about trucks!

I was just noting your discovery that - "In discussing it with them, the 7,000 lb axle's brakes are the same size but have a more agressive lining and stronger magnet, resulting in stronger brakes".

Seems there is just a lot more engineering that goes into those ratings than what the novice can typically see by crawling underneath.
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Old 06-04-2008, 02:07 PM   #8
genecurp
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Steve, sorry you are having such a big repair. The upgrade to 7,000 pounds seems very prudent. Good luck with the axle installation next month.
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Old 06-04-2008, 05:26 PM   #9
Okie Guy
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Steve I am sorry to hear about your axle problem. Good to know you are getting it taken care of though. I am going to keep an eye on mine so if anything is wrong I can get it fixed before the 1 year warranty expires.
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Old 06-04-2008, 05:51 PM   #10
sreigle
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Bigmurf, Dexter's warranty is also two years. The problem is I can't convince anyone this is a warranty situation. I still think the damage happened during delivery when a spindle was bent on the front axle. But Keystone tells me they checked that axle at that time and it was fine. So the only thing left is it is my fault. We are very close to that axle rating and I don't think that rating has any fudge factors built in. Not from what I've seen so far, anyhow.

Keystone went to the 7,000 lb axles very shortly after our rig was built. I think it was three weeks later, actually. Not positive the timing, though. When I talked with them they said nothing else structurally was changed other than the axle assembly (I was asking what caused the GVWR increase in the newer ones). And that the formula used to calculate GVWR includes axle rating (axle rating plus estimated pinweight). Thus the higher GVWR with the larger capacity axles. Putting the 7k axles under this Montana won't change the numbers on the plate on the side of the rig but it will sure give me a lot more cushion of comfort that we won't have this loss of camber problem again. This problem is often because of overloading. We're so close to the ratings I would think there's quite a bit of stress on the axle when bouncing down the road.

I am not sure but I think Keystone's statement about being past the one year warranty has to do with the period in which they take care of these things, the "general" warranty or whatever. The axles do have a 2-year warranty.
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Old 06-04-2008, 06:07 PM   #11
exav8tr
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Steve, Have you considered losing the axles in lieu of the MorRyde Independent Suspension? At the Spring rally I talked to Gary Wheeler from MorRyde and he seemed to think this was the way to go, of course, he works for MorRyde also. We are going to explore this when we get to the fall rally. I also have the 6K axles and I run right at max weight ..... I want to keep this rig for many years and don't need suspension problems.....
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Old 06-04-2008, 08:25 PM   #12
RC and Samantha
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Geeze Louise Steve, sorry to read about your Axle problem. Someone said something like if you own an RV you'd better be good with your hands & quick with your wallet. I think it may have been Carol & Al. Truer words have never been spoken huh?
Quote:
quote:Originally posted by sreigle

Putting the 7k axles under this Montana won't change the numbers on the plate on the side of the rig but it will sure give me a lot more cushion of comfort that we won't have this loss of camber problem again. This problem is often because of overloading. We're so close to the ratings I would think there's quite a bit of stress on the axle when bouncing down the road.
As you may remember we had ours changed to 7000 lb axles a long time ago. It did not change the numbers on our sticker either but we feel it was a good upgrade & are happy we have less worries on weights for Sky & are camber is still holding strong.

I think you've made a very wise choice as the others have mentioned. Anything we can do to give us a bit more peace of mind is always a good thing.

Patty
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Old 06-05-2008, 03:01 AM   #13
Mrs. CountryGuy
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Steve

Al and I think you will be VERY happy with the 7,000 pound axle upgrade.

It is our opinion, that the 6,000 were a bit skinny from the get go. No flame wars, please, it is just an opinion!

We also have the 7,000 upgrade, and no we are not full timers, but, I do tend to carry a lot of gear for our long timing jaunts, and yes, the peace of mind is grand! There is no increase of the "tag" values, when they do this work.

Patty, see my sig line, I like your "quick with the wallet" version!
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Old 06-05-2008, 12:34 PM   #14
richfaa
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Hummm Steve you just prompted me to do some close research on my RV shield Service contract aka extended Warranty. It is a exclusionary contract there is a list of exclusions and if the item is not mentioned ..it is covered. Nowhere in the list of exclusions is the word Axle or any of its components. I do see "frame and structural body parts" which prompts me to call and ask the question...what does that mean??? We also are of the opinion that the 6K axles on the 3400 is cutting it close. They paid for my black tank with no problem..
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Old 06-05-2008, 02:27 PM   #15
dsprik
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I am watching this thread closely. Of course, we are FTers and our 3400 was built just 30 days before Steve's (and about 90 days after Rich's). I am also close to the my ratings and peace of mind with 7K axles would be great.
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Old 06-06-2008, 05:41 AM   #16
Bill and Lisa
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Steve,
I understand that upgrading the axles does not change the sticker values, however I offer the following for your personal piece of mind. I was on the fortunate side of the axle change and my 3000Rk was built with 6K axles vice the prior 5200lb axles. As with many things at the factory the paper work lagged the actual changes and my stickers reflected the ratings for the 5200 lb axle. (in my opinion I am glad Aram makes changes without waiting for all the paperwork to be updated).

Montana sent me a new set of stickers to replace the incorrect ones. Therefore I can tell you from personal observation that the individual axle ratings went up by 400# (500# in your situation) and my GVWR went up 800# (1000# in your case). The Cargo Carrying Capacity on my unit went up by 800# (1000# in your case).

If I were in your position if/when the time came for me to sell my unit I would provide prospective buyers a copy of the work order to upgrade the axles and let them know what the "actual" limits on the rig are (above and beyond the sticker numbers).

Good luck.
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Old 06-06-2008, 04:10 PM   #17
sailer
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Well i have a 3000RK 2006 and had 5200 lb axels and the rear axel went straight after only 4900 miles.. we emptyed the unit to prove it was over loaded as it was built so the said they were up ing to 6000 lb axels but when it was finished i went under and the paper stickers said 6000 lb but under when i scraped them off they were D52 axels so i called back and finaly after 5 months of hageling they sent and pd for the 6000lb axels on our 3000 rk ,, now i feal safe and now we put on new tires ,, goodrich ,,we put in steel valve stems and 235/85r16 tires ,,,sailer
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Old 06-07-2008, 02:45 PM   #18
sreigle
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Bill, when I talked with Montana about what else was changed to up the GVWR they told me only the axles. They said the RVIA method of calculating GVWR is what they are required to use to remain RVIA members. They said that formula is GVWR - total axle ratings plus estimated pinweight. The frames did not change. Just the axles. So, I'm comfortable we'll have the capacity, regardless of that sticker. However, we are NOT over the ratings of the 6000 lb axles. But we are very close. Since we're having this problem and do not intend to lighten our load, then the best solution is to gain capacity.

I said we are very close to the 6000. Our total axle weight is 11,760. What I don't know for sure is how much is on each axle so it is possible the rear one is over although based on our loading and configuration I don't think so. But I don't have the confidence in the axle ratings that I have on the truck ratings. I don't have a knowledgeable insider to ask questions of when it comes to these axles while I do for the Ford.
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Old 06-07-2008, 04:23 PM   #19
sailer
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Well steve ,, we know the rear axel carries a lot more than the front axel and i thought they would be equal but its about 1000 lbs dif from ft to rear ,,, sailer
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Old 06-07-2008, 05:50 PM   #20
bigmurf
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by sailer

Well steve ,, we know the rear axel carries a lot more than the front axel and i thought they would be equal but its about 1000 lbs dif from ft to rear ,,, sailer
Can't believe this. Ours are within 100 lbs of each other. Side to side is the same.
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