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Old 12-01-2012, 03:52 PM   #1
h2ojocky
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Montana durability

Newbie here. Thanks for the welcome. Considering buying a 2004
2955RL Montana. Have been reading posts regarding problems with flexing and cracks in the bedroom. Is this going to be a problem for a 2004 32 foot trailer? Wanted to go Montana due to the quality, but have been reading about problems and am getting cold feet. Am I still OK?

Also the pinbox seems to have a lip on the front that is bent. Will this be a problem. Trying to attach photo but not having any luck.

Thanks for any input.


 
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:01 PM   #2
DQDick
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Personally, I'd just inspect the rig for signs of failure and then jump right in. If the woodwork in the front cabinet is good and the seals on the front are solid, my opinion is that you're good. Remember there are something like 6,000 members on this forum and while the problems are something to be concerned about they aren't happening to everyone by any means. I would be more concerned about the lip over the king pin. Sounds like someone tried to hitch with the pin too low. If it's bent down you should replace it. If it's bent up you could probably get away with it, but I'd replace it anyway if it were mine.
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:41 PM   #3
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There are at least two things I would do before buying a used unit.

Based on the VIN# I wuld ask the dealer to get a history of warranty work preformed on the unit.

If you are buying this from a dealer, I would ask for the names of the folks that traded it in and their contact information. Did they upgrade to a larger unit of the same make? Did they buy a different make?

Any physical damage to the pin box, or otherwise would send up red flags to me. It is difficult to find hidden damage, and be assured it will have been hidden by the previous owner or the dealer if it was known to have existed.

Take every precaution possible. If you can, have someone with previous experience and knowledge inspect it with you.

It is a big investment and you deserve to get a good used unit that you can enjoy without the worry of problems that pre-existed.

Good luck
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Old 12-01-2012, 04:51 PM   #4
8.1al
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All good advice above. When we first bought our Montana I came to this forum, read about this, that and the next thing and wondered omigosh what did we get into. Someone wisely pointed out that the problems you see are not universal or widespread. As stated above it would be a good idea to have the dealer check its history. As for the pinbox those things are built of heavy steel, I would think it would be hard to bend. If you go here you will find instructions on adding a photo of your pinbox
http://www.montanaowners.com/AddingPhoto.html
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Old 12-01-2012, 05:04 PM   #5
Rondo
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We own a 2004 2980 and have had no flex problems-- knock on wood! As said previously here by others check out the unit close and as stated, if you know someone that has a unit have them check it out with you also. Extra eyes are always better! IF it's at a dealer go to the main menu of the forum and print out a couple of the PDI's and have the dealer go through the unit step by step with you and check things out listed in the PDI to see if it is all working correctly.
When you say the front of the pinbox is bent- do you mean the very front lip is bent up or down or what? If it is bent up all the way across the pinbox, the front is bent or curved up to slide over the hitch easier when hooking up! It's made that way but if it is bent down, that is not suppose to be that way! Let us know what you meant by being bent!
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Old 12-01-2012, 05:42 PM   #6
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I had a 2004 3400RL and towed it over 55,000 miles without issue. Do your homework on the coach and inspect it carefully. If all looks good, I would not let a few misfortunes of others stop you from buying the coach.
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Old 12-01-2012, 06:14 PM   #7
h2ojocky
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Thanks for all the advice on inspections. This trailer is at a private party who states that he bought it in 2005. The front lip of pinbox has a natural lip that goes up, but one edge is bent up more. I am going to attempt to attach a photo.

[https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-g...8/IMG_5903.JPG][/img]
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Old 12-02-2012, 12:52 AM   #8
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I would expect the owner to have an explanation how the damage happened since he's owned it since 05 although it doesn't look like a big problem if the damaged is confined it the front lip. If the owner isn't a member of the MOC he may not be aware of some of the problem areas frequently brought up here such as suspension shackle bolts, marathon tires, loose u bolts on axles, EZ lube systems being over greased and leaking onto the brake shoes and frame flex as you had mentioned. Also look closely for any damage due to water around the slides. Stains on the interior walls and spongy floors. Most of what I mentioned above could relate to any brand, not just the Montana. Just take your time with the pdi looking literally top to bottom!
Good luck and keep us informed how it goes.
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Old 12-02-2012, 01:38 AM   #9
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We have been happy with all of our Montanas, and they have held up well. Keep in mind a 2004 has probably seen a lot of usage and wear and tear over the years. Comes down to how it was maintained over those years.
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Old 12-02-2012, 02:16 AM   #10
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Good advice from Dick.
Inspect it well and have an independent look at it prior to purchase to give you a warm fuzzy on the condition if you would feel better. The kingpin should be relatively inexpensive to replace. It's a key link when towing and should not be deformed (IMHO).
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by DQDick

Personally, I'd just inspect the rig for signs of failure and then jump right in. If the woodwork in the front cabinet is good and the seals on the front are solid, my opinion is that you're good. Remember there are something like 6,000 members on this forum and while the problems are something to be concerned about they aren't happening to everyone by any means. I would be more concerned about the lip over the king pin. Sounds like someone tried to hitch with the pin too low. If it's bent down you should replace it. If it's bent up you could probably get away with it, but I'd replace it anyway if it were mine.
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Old 12-02-2012, 02:57 AM   #11
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I will tell you when it comes to frame flex it isn't just a Montana Keystone problem. Most mid priced units frames are built by Lippert Industries. It's evident in almost every brand in that mid level unit. It's a fact and don't ask how I know!!

So don't look at Montana as the unit with frame flex. Look it over like you would any other unit and all you can do is hope your not one of the ones that has this happen. It is in fact a very minor few that experience this and the ones that has had it happen are the first ones that going to bring it up here. As they should as it's a very hard thing to swallow when you are talking about frames and the amount of work that has to go into repairing them and the cost of these units. Montana's are a good unit and for the most part will serve you well for a long time.

Another thing I will add is there is some talk as to some units going to 12" frames and hoping that cures the problem. Again another wrong thought wave as it makes no difference what so ever. Redesign of the front overhang is where the work needs to be addressed IMHO!!

Dave
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:36 AM   #12
8.1al
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It's hard to tell from the photo but something has been added to the pinbox. Maybe a plate for a Pullrite hitch and that is what is bent. The way it sticks way out in front of the pinbox I'm not surprised it's bent. I would have someone take a close look at the suspension, especially between the axles where the equalizer and shackles are. Like most brands if it has many miles on it the bolts may be turning and wearing the shackles and sometimes the equalizer tool. We're not trying to scare you just want to make you aware of things to look for in any used trailer.
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Old 12-02-2012, 04:25 AM   #13
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How about the actual pin itself? Is the bottom of the box flat, with just the front edge bent? Or is the bottom of the box where the pin is bent also? The bottom of the box should be level. From the pic, it looks like it wouldn't be a problem, but like was mentioned earlier, the owner should know what happened to it. Did you ask him?
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Old 12-02-2012, 05:42 AM   #14
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There has been lots of great advice so far. Before going forward on ANY rig, weigh your truck with just you in it and a full tank of gas and know your Curb Weight. Then know the GVWR and CGVWR for your truck and subtract the curb weight. You'll need at LEAST 3,000lbs to allow for about 500 lbs of gear and passengers and about 2,500 lbs for carrying the pin weight on your vehicle, more or less.

Luckily for you, a 2004 rig of that size typically falls into a 3/4 ton of any make of truck. DO NOT attempt to pull this rig with a 1/2 ton truck. There are many parts of the 1/2 ton that will probably not support that weight over time. It's more than a big engine or big tires that has to pull a trailer.

Then go over the trailer with a fine tooth comb. A previously-owned trailer buyer will need to know enough about doing their own "pre-delivery inspection" procedures or bring someone along who is quite adept at this. That bump in the front King Pin, would make me want to check things out quite a bit especially for things you can't see.

I'd like to list a whole raft of things to check (if it were me), but you also need to know how to interpret what you find so we'll wait for you to ask questions so we can determine your experience and knowledge. Frame Flex would be rare but there are other concerns you should know about and these might still not make this such a bad deal, like that bend at the pin box for the addon attachment. The original Monty pin box does NOT appear bent.

Good luck to you.
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Old 12-02-2012, 01:18 PM   #15
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That looks very much like a Superglide universal plate attached to a OEM Pinbox. Perhaps it was improperly installed to begin with. Kinda seems to stick out too far. It's POSSIBLE that the RV was lowered onto the pin box plate prematurely an as a result bent the add-on plate. JMHO.
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Old 12-03-2012, 05:46 AM   #16
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I have a 2004 2880RL, bought new in 2003. Only major problem I've had was with axles and that was my fault.
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Old 12-04-2012, 02:34 PM   #17
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Quote:
quote:Originally posted by h2ojocky

...have been reading about problems and am getting cold feet...
Don't forget, on these forums, you are going to read about problems. We don't get on here and say, "everything's fine." We get on when we have a problem, so there are many many more 'problem' questions than other questions.
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Old 12-05-2012, 04:00 AM   #18
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It appears as if you have an extended pin on your rig. I have one on my 2005 2955RL. I bought the camper used and it was already on it. It is used for towing with a short bed pickup so when you turn sharply you don't crunch out the rear window. A slider hitch does the same job and I have one of those too.

At the fall rally, a Keystone representative checked my Montana for frame flex. He did not find any. He told me that one of the the first signs of this problem is the caulking around the front corner shows signs of separation from the trim. On the photo, it is the curved part just to the right of the lower marker light.



He also told me that they didn't think too highly of the extended pin that I am using. It puts extra stress on the frame in the front. Mine is welded on and would be a bear to remove.
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Old 12-05-2012, 03:32 PM   #19
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bullroc3 wrote:
Quote:
quote:
At the fall rally, a Keystone representative checked my Montana for frame flex. He did not find any. He told me that one of the the first signs of this problem is the caulking around the front corner shows signs of separation from the trim. On the photo, it is the curved part just to the right of the lower marker light.
I would have loved to have been with the Keystone representative as he was performing this check on my unit. Do you mind sharing what he did to determine your unit had no flex problem.

Your picture shows the DS of your unit, the proper test is done on the ODS at the expansion joint, it is this side that normally shows the caulking separating from the trim first. My 3402 shows no sign of separation on the DS, but it is an entirely different story on the other side. The ODS wall has been significantly compromised by the opening for the bedroom slide. It will respond to flex differently that will the DS, that is why they put the expansion joint there.

Caulking can and will crack or separate in almost any location where it is used on an RV over time. That is the reason we need to check all the area's that are caulked and redo them from time to time.
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Old 12-07-2012, 04:45 AM   #20
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The picture posted in the my reply is the passenger side. Follow the top of the propane compartment door (put your mouse on it!!) right to the curved part of the molding. That is where the representative checked for the flex (looking for a separation in the molding and the caulking an eighth of an inch or more).
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